Is it me or since Danny has been made vice captain he has been a shadow of his former self? He said at the time that he is not the most vocal of players so why give him the extra responsibility. Plus i dont understand why the captaincy was taken of Lynch......but we can save that for another day.........or can we ?

Thought he was excellent in the first half against us on Saturday, was thinking at half time that unless we get a grip of him second half it could be all over. Mr Gentle helped us out by taking him off (no doubt a planned game time thing) and he was a shadow of himself when he came back on. OK we were on top by that stage so he wasn't the only one whose game had gone backwards from the first half!

Thought he was excellent in the first half against us on Saturday, was thinking at half time that unless we get a grip of him second half it could be all over. Mr Gentle helped us out by taking him off (no doubt a planned game time thing) and he was a shadow of himself when he came back on. OK we were on top by that stage so he wasn't the only one whose game had gone backwards from the first half!

Thought the team as a whole has not been the same since the captaincy was changed from Lynchy.

Even Lynch himself has struggled and does not look the machine he was all last season.

Does being spelled suit his game?

Not playing at all would currently suit his game!
Wire the closest he's been to his best form.
Aaron at the times he's played and used just at hooker has been 3times better.
Think Danny will find his form. But when the team isn't going so well it shows the deficiencies in his game.
Pass selection run selection and pass execution. All a distance behind Aarons. Which is why I'd like to see him off the bench and re establish his devastating running game.

We haven't seen many of those scoots from dummy half this year either

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No, thought we where very poor when he was off the pitch,

Don't think Houghton has played too well this year, and I wouldn't absolve him of blame (his distribution in particular has not been good enough), but it is largely the same problem as with our halves, namely; our ptb speed. It is at least as difficult for the hookers to deal with the lack of space and scrambling defence as our halves, and whilst they perhaps have more influence by being at the ptb there's still only so much they can do when our forwards aren't doing enough on the floor.

On saying that, Heremaia was at least as bad on Saturday, if not worse, including poor passes that ended up in knock-ons which were mainly his fault.

As for Lynch, he definitely hasn't been playing as well this year as last, and the question of whether taking the captaincy away might have affected him will always crop up as long as that is the case.

lynch doesnt come across as someone who would take his ball home though, maybe his form has just dipped, seems to me as someone who would always give his all,

I'm not saying he has or even would but its noticeable the team performances in general and Lynch himself seem to be off. Maybe there its just a coincendence or changing the Captaincy has had a negative effect within the team?

The fact Andy Lynch's performance has been below what we saw from his machine like displays last season it just not something i would have expected. He was pretty much like a machine week in week out whether fully fit or carrying the knocks he did last season there was very little change in his own performance. I'm not having a go at Lynchy in any way as I think he has earnt the right to have a stinker every now again with his performances week in week out since joining us.

So my concern is why is a player that has always been such a consistent performer out on the field since he joined the club now having an indifferent start to the season? As when your home bankers so to speak are not hitting the consistency then it doesnt bode well.

Maybe his best years are behind him, he has been playing playing a tough position at the top level for a long time.

Another knee jerk reaction thread, people need to rematch the games so far this season. He was much better than heremia last week, we looked much better when he was on, also was excellent against saints outplaying roby, in fact his only poor game has been at Leeds.

Hookers are the least of our problems.

To add to this,

Briscoe has main the most meters, the most tackle busts and clean breaks.

Houghton and lynch are both in the Top 4 for meters and tackles.

Lynch and briscoe are 2nd an 3rd in offloads.

Ok stats don't tell the full story, but not sure some players deserve the criticism on here.

Halfbacks and centres are main problem, replace Seymour and arundel with holdsworth and crooks and we would have beat widnes and thre woud be no heads like this.

Agree

Houghton has been great for us over a period of time and is one of the best hookers around, and we should be grateful to have him & Heremaia.
He had 1 bad game against Widnes within a very bad team performance (and he wasnt the worst)

Feel like a scratched record but our problems are at 6 & 7, they have been for years and they continue to be our achilles heel.

And Holdsworth alone isnt enough, Horne would be a good back up 6, IMO we need a world class 7 (who can captain and lead the team) and a decent back up 7 - strength in depth.

Certainly my view. They were two big misses in the context of how the game panned out.

For my sins I watched game again, arundel cost us two try's with his poor defence, Seymour 2 try's with his poor defence and interception pass.

Galea also guilty of a few basic errors, which cost us, we have a few players guilty of making individual errors and they keep making the same mistakes every time they play, hopefully some of these won't play this Friday.

Pretty much my thoughts. He's not been bad, just not hit his standard of last season and you have to wonder why.

Whilst I agree with the main gist of the point, I don't think it's unfair to say that Houghton has not played as well as he can. His passing has never been his strong point, but I think that this year we are seeing players having to adjust their runs or reach high for the ball too often. Passes from dummy half should be in the bread basket pretty much every time, and it is noticeable that Houghton is behind Heremaia in this area.

Having said all that, as in my other post I do think that our ptb speed is the main problem and restricts how effective our hookers can be.

Maybe on Saturday, but over the season so far I think it's been our ptb speed, which has been across almost the entire team but particularly the forwards. It also becomes more apparent the higher the calibre of opposition we play.

It's been a problem for years, although at times last season it improved noticeably. Not sure what the underlying reason is TBH.

I'm not convinced it did improve last season. I think we just worked around it at times by offloading a lot. That's where we're hugely missing Watts, Moa, Manu, and Ellis, as much as you can miss someone you haven't had. I've just looked the stats up, and we don't have anyone who has made double figures in offloads yet, and only one over 5. In 5 games and with the amount of forwards we have had playing big minutes that's pretty pitiful IMO.

Spot on. Our pack doesn't/can't steamroller the opposition so to get any go forward we have to commit tacklers and offload. Otherwise combined with the ptb speed a scooting hooker has no chance. That's Houghton's game. When he's forced into creating for other players from a standing start his decision making , speed of thought and passing let him down. The current England hooker , Roby , wouldn't be much different behind our pack at the moment.

I dont like to call anyone in the team but for my Lynch had an outstanding season and why on earth was the captaincey taken off him. He did great for us.

All this hype on Ellis coming and he decides to bring him as capt and he hasnt even played for us yet. Houghton has no experience of been a captain let alone a vice captain and unfortunately I dont think he can manage it. Lynch really got the team going last season. It really does make you wonder if there is a wee bit of jealousy there. I certainly would be peed off if it was me and also named player of the season.

I dont know the reasons why so I cant speculate but I do think it was the wrong thing to do. We just dont have a leader at all now. Hopefully when Ellis eventually gets back he will make a difference.