If anyone wants to get the money back so be it I suppose some of them will be thinking if the club goes down the pan so will the money and they will have lost out.Some of those will be ones who have only just begun to watch wakey and some will be thinking not this again.It pays to have a balanced look at things and if you can do that you just might convince them to keep on supporting the club rather than just making them more determined to get the money back.So I would say rather than telling them to do one or they need boiling in oil have a go at making them have a change of mind.

Its parly to blame, its also fair to say that match day attendances have been over egged a little, when we announce 8.500 we are all happy and praise the clubs good work and backslap the ego's.

But what if its only 7.500/7.800.

There is no benefit in over egging match day attendances, There will be VAT due on all ticket sales so if you over egg the match day attendance by say 1000 (made up of 80% adult 20% junior) that potentially leaves you with a VAT short fall of over £3k, that 13 times a season is over £44k so not sensible business practise.
I think the attendance figures have been pretty accurate this season, unlike in previous seasons prior to Mr Glovers takeover (if you know what I mean

)

yes Sunday is the ideal time to get people to give, large crowd against our nearest rivals both in terms of geography & league position. Wishing the old shop in the car park was still there so we could have a sale and if half the fans spent £20 each a tidy sum could be raised .

You are Jeremy Clarkson and I claim my £5.

Of course what you say is TRUE, it wouldn't make any sense.

This mess is nothing to do with just low season tickets, the staff wages are far higher than the income generated, every match day the 3 highest costs are Ambulance, Security, and would you believe the Wildcats Dolls who are/were rented to the club by the owner



The £400,000 needed is not to pay off debts like some on here think, that is needed to just operate through the off season until the Sky money comes through. The club owes Glover over £400K on top of that due to his directors loan, they owe the RFL for the tax bailout last month, and are £1.2 in debt on top of that, its NOT just 400K.

The players are way overpaid, some to the point of stupidity, and we have lots of Staff on 30K plus doing jobs that overlap, i.e. Cain, Hudson, Dickens, all taking good wages, and the RFL no longer require a Super League Club to have both an head of Youth, and a Player Performance Manager, Dickens is fulltime with the 19's what!

I know 100 million percent, that the only people owed money for months now who have been paid is the owner of the security company, and that is down to no security = no fixture = 40K RFL fine per game for not playing.

If you think that the 17 CCJ's are over, then think again, an considerable number will be landing soon. If anyone with the exception of Longo told me at Wakefield it was day time, I would open the blinds to check !

I have watched year in year out for 35 years, seen ups and downs, great performances, and some of the worst, but knowing a Club has been mismanaged, and then compounded that with in accuracies and deceit is poor to say the least.

i'll be donating plenty of money on Sunday....Over the bar.





Hope you've got plenty of real ale on.

To be honest I wouldn't blame anybody for asking for their money back, thats their perogative and they have a right to do so if they wish. I wouldn't do it myself and think that now is the time back the club as they desperately need it, but it's their call, good luck to them. Maybe they are just sick to death of been associated with a club that is happy to let local businesses sing for their money whilst ensuring certain match day performers get paid bang on time for their performances. Remember the press release a matter of weeks ago lauding the receipt of the foxy bingo cheque and proudly saying that Wakefield fans had raised the most of any club. It proves that fans have backed the club with their wallets and purses and have been well and truely let down by those in charge.

This clubs reputation in the business community is utter mud and if Carter is hoping to entice new signifcant investment from any of them then I feel he is going to be sadly disappointed. For example why do you think the east stand still has Eric France emblazoned all over it? Nobody wants to sponsor it for any decent amount thats why and its not for the want of trying by the commercial staff. It took over a year to get any sponsorship for the small roof on the Western terrace and that isn't a cash only deal. And Carter has missed a trick by not making a symbolic sacrifice and punting Elston. This would have been seen as taking firm action, now it looks like he has bottled it to some extent. I'm afraid confidence in the club is at an all time low on the back of a reputation of being charlatens and companies don't want to get bitten on the backside in trading climate that is showing signs of improving but still very difficult. Bear in mind spirit of 1873's next set of trading figures are due out at the end of next month and they are not going to make pretty reading. It is hardly going to inspire confidence.

Once again it will be the long suffering fans who are asked to pick up the pieces but, (while probably fanciful as I doubt the trust would come close to that number), talk of asking 400 to put a £1000 in is all ok but it needs to be explained that they will have to keep putting in EVERY year or drop into the championship and run the risk of not being able to service the debts. Superleague is a costly business and to be competitive you HAVE to spend money. Cutting your cloth to suit needs to be done but will result in an uncompetitve team, equalling lower attendances and sponsors becoming harder to find. The extra capital will be needed EVERY year for a least five years to enable the business to operate and hope (and it could be a while off yet) that Newmarket happens and is the holy grail it is believed by some to be. It is not just a short term investment, it will have to be a long term financial commitment to continue to put funds into the club just to keep us spending what we are now which is already going to be the lowest in the superleague next year. We will be operating on less TV money than this thanks to the RFL paying our tax bill so it is only going to get harder and ultimatley more players will have to go which will affect attendances next year. We have a long road ahead of us and bumpy is even going close to decribing how the road is going to be.

Well to show what i think, i bought my grandson and mine season ticket as soon as they were available and contrary to wanting my money back i have just signed up for foxy bingo (p.s. i'm a pensioner).

Thanks for that i was asking this question yesterday.
I had an inkling they may be lining somebodys pocket.
On a slightly different tack and not costing the club directly but i heard that "a club director" was earning income from renting out property to players, another example of pocket lining?
Perhaps there is nothing wrong with either but this income would have been helpful to the club.

Glad to hear it, we ALL need to do what we can.

Do you KNOW this or THINK this?
I assume you are not including player wages or in fact anyone that is salaried?

Good for you mate.
I'd forgotten about Foxy Bingo. Will do that today myself

As depressing as this post is, i think its a pretty accurate reflection sadly.

Depends on the terms, I suppose. It might be a way of getting a player more cheaply, in that the cost of living is less for the player, and the director has the advantage of knowing the nature of his tenant.

The only alternative would be to let the player sort his own accommodation out in the private sector, which makes it a less attractive reason to join the club, or the director rents the property to the club, who sub-lets it at a greater rent to the player. Again, though, the player loses out.

That sounds fairly legit to me, and a common sense way of sorting out accommodation for a player.

I agree with you on the two snipped bits but not really on the fans asking for refunds. They bought a season ticket. There is nothing on there to say it guarentees the team they want. If we are in superleague there should be no refunds at all..... imho

Unless said individual is profiting from his fortunate position within the club and the club doesnt benefit in any way.
I accept i may be going a bit x files, but if "our very own" wildcat dolls issue is true and they are not our very own they belong to someone else and that comes as a cost to us, i am getting a bit cheesed off when the club is as skint as we are and i think rightly suspicious.

If the wildcat dolls are making a profit out of the club?
This needs to stop now!
It's one luxury I can live without.
Id rather see youngest given the chance to play rugby on the pitch instead!
And if they are a separate company?
Are they not trading on our trademark wildcat dolls?
They need to change there name to Elstons Dolls!
If they have been booked this weekend I hope they are donating there fee back to the club!!!!

I agree with you on the Dolls issue, as that has nothing to do with rugby. I think it's a trickier issue with the housing as the alternatives are probably worse.

A player from out of the area (I presume these are overseas players) has to live somewhere. The club could just find them somewhere in the private sector and let them pay the going rate. But what if a director can let them live cheaper? A more attractive option for the player and so maybe more likely to secure a signature at maybe a lower price for the club. The club could buy properties and rent them out, but any undervalue of rent would be seen as a taxable benefit and so not benefit the player as much.

I can see how it can irk that a director is able to secure a stream of tenants, but if it helps secure a player, then there is benefit to the club at no cost to the club.

The Dolls issue is just about paying over the odds for some pom-pom waving, which I can happily do without. That costs the club money, which reduces the budget for players.

I'm not defending the Dolls particularly. It's not something that interests me at the game.
However, none of the people commenting (Including me) know the details.

Having them as a private ownership rather than club owned, we may save on insurance and other employers costs.
They are a good marketing brand for us so I see the good they do outside match day.

I do however agree that if it is simply a money earner for an individual then I'd change how that worked.....not necessarily get rid.

Whilst I'm not 100% on this i think each dancer gets £25 per game (less than the legal hourly rate - though I'm not sure if legal rate covers what they do) and the brand is Sarah Elston's for which, I would assume, she is paid by the club seperately from the job for which she is employed. I'd be interested if anyone could confirm whether the £400 figure is correct as this wouldn't make as much money for sarah as i would have thought. That being said its money for nothing as I don't think she dances anymore. All events undertaken by the "dolls" are seperate to the club. One thing is for sure; Sarah definitely has her head screwed on and is a very successful business woman as she also has her own dancing school which is of a good size and would generate quite an income in its own right.

I agree and good on her.

Fans pointing the finger at her is a real cheap shot.

I don't think it's ever as simple as one person to blame in situations like this as much as everyone seems to need to single someone out. It will be interesting to see if and when people within the club become outspoken and start to distance themselves from others (who they might have have had a very close working relationship with until the financial difficulties were made public).

Some of this is just searching for scapegoats, a bit like we used to blame Steve Southern for our poor results.
The real issue is trusting the Guardians of the club and again, at times like this there is plenty of finger pointing and looking for someone to blame.
We need to draw a line under what has gone and trust the new guys.