So your solution to dwindling crowds is to alienate a large proportion of our loyal fanbase in favour of a demographic who have amply shown that they stop following (if indeed they ever followed at all) at the drop of a hat? In addition, how many new fans would actually fork out £20+ quid a match or a few hundred for a season ticket because there was a bar they could go to before the game? I'd put that number somewhere around zero. Meantime the club loses thousands every week supporting a half empty facility instead of a thriving, well supported, all-inclusive one just to satisfy the vanity of people like yourself who think they're somehow a special case by virtue of being younger than someone else.

Great business plan.

I'm not in that age demographic. I have however noticed how much it is missing from the stands.

Let's assume that none of the existing loyal fanbase felt in any way alienated by the existing provision that has kept them coming for the last few years and wouldn't immediately leave because an additional facility has opened up, alongside the existing facilities that they clearly have found adequate up til now.

Let's also assume that the marketing department at Wigan has been tasked with some kind of response to the dwindling crowds. PART of that solution might be to look at the matchday experience, no? I find it odd that anyone would object to attempts to engage/re-engage with non-attending supporters and looking at doing things differently to maybe encourage them to purchase firstly a one off and then as a result attending more regularly.

If the actual plan of the fanzone is to just to attract the pre-match income from drinkers that already use the South Stand Bar or concourse then that's their call and will make some impact on club revenue, but I'd like to think there's a wider plan to it all.

You must be kidding. It's an ageing fan base. Most young un's sack it off when they're old enough to go somewhere else with their mates and I can't blame them. Mighty Max, a kiddy pom pom dance troupe on the pitch and getting told to sit down by old folk with tartan travel rugs on their knees. It's dying on its backside. There's almost a full generation missing on matchdays. The club finally set up a venue that might be appealing to that demographic and the Riversiders have reserved table signs up by week 3.

Firstly, we can't assume that as the revenue from the SS bar not going into club coffers has been a bone of contention amongst fans for decades. To be excluded from any plans to redress this by virtue of their age would not sit well in the slightest. If you need further proof just take a look at the people who are actually now going to the fanzone bar. It's self evident.

Secondly, your last paragraph is exactly the main raison d'etre of the new fanzone. I'm not saying they don't have further hopes around picking up new fans, I'm sure they do, but that wasn't the main thrust of the initiative. How do I know this? The club themselves have said so on numerous occasions. Additionally, there is no way that having a club bar would have a significant impact on ticket sales anyway. For 99% of people going, the rugby is the overriding consideration when deciding to buy a ticket. A bar would, for the most part, not be a deciding factor. It may help make the game day experience better but, in and of itself, would not persuade someone to buy a ticket who otherwise would not have done.

So the premise of your argument is flawed and that's before we even get into the poor economic business model you're proposing.

But here's the real crux of my argument. I'm not in the 60+ demographic you've mentioned either but I do strongly object to the direct and unashamed ageism of your post. Below, I've taken the liberty of posting the final part of your initial post but replaced the words "the 60+ age bracket" with the word "gays". Would you still be happy to post?

"certainly to myself and it would appear to several others on this thread is cheesy and dated and much more suited to gays."

I'm guessing not.

It’s hard to squeeze in a good match day experience on a Thursday or Friday night. For a better match day experience we need to move home games to Sunday’s. Then you get the travelling away fans being able to attend, younger kids (under 4) being able to attend because it’s not too late, you could play the reserves game before the first team game at Robin Park just before the game and make a day of it. They’ve put on buses to a couple of areas but they need a couple more routes.

Sunday games usually have smaller crowds than Friday nights

The same generation that has gone missing from virtually every sporting audience worldwide with the exception of electronic sports events. Go figure.

But if you’re trying to make the experience better for the fan, you don’t get enough time to do it other than a Saturday or Sunday. That way you can play a game whether it’s 19s or reserves just before it for the fans to watch too at Robin Park and make a day of it.

But if crowds are smaller then why would we go to the trouble/cost?

I still see them at the football ?

You’ve just answer your own question.

Quote ="Akinwale Arobieke"I still see them at the football ?'" No you don't: https://www.football365.com/news/wanted ... tball-fans

Quote ="Akinwale Arobieke"I still see them at the football ?'" No you don't: https://www.football365.com/news/wanted ... tball-fans

Quote ="Phuzzy"No you don't: https://www.football365.com/news/wanted ... tball-fans'" One authors survey of 2 clubs from 12 years ago? I go to games (RL and football) and can see the demographics with my own eyes.

Quote ="Phuzzy"No you don't: https://www.football365.com/news/wanted ... tball-fans'" One authors survey of 2 clubs from 12 years ago? I go to games (RL and football) and can see the demographics with my own eyes.

I see them at the rugby also normally in the SS

Quote ="Akinwale Arobieke"One authors survey of 2 clubs from 12 years ago? I go to games (RL and football) and can see the demographics with my own eyes.'" I was giving you an example. All research shows the demographic for sporting events is ageing. If you want to use your own eyes I suggest you try actually having them open. I can see around 20 under 30s in the seats immediately surrounding me in the East Stand at the rugby. It doesn't mean the demographic isn't aging. Here you are...fill your boots as I understand using Google can be hard work for those who want to blindly argue their case regardless of overwhelming proof to the contrary. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/amp/football/41901398 www.fsf.org.uk/latest-news/view/ ... -time-bomb

Quote ="Akinwale Arobieke"One authors survey of 2 clubs from 12 years ago? I go to games (RL and football) and can see the demographics with my own eyes.'" I was giving you an example. All research shows the demographic for sporting events is ageing. If you want to use your own eyes I suggest you try actually having them open. I can see around 20 under 30s in the seats immediately surrounding me in the East Stand at the rugby. It doesn't mean the demographic isn't aging. Here you are...fill your boots as I understand using Google can be hard work for those who want to blindly argue their case regardless of overwhelming proof to the contrary. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/amp/football/41901398 www.fsf.org.uk/latest-news/view/ ... -time-bomb

Half full South Stand. Go back five years it was filled most matches.

You can argue the point all you like, I attend football as well as rugby, and can absoulutely assure you if we are talking 18-25 year old's, the amount of this age range at football compared to rugby is literally ten fold. Probably, as harsh as it sounds because its more "edgey" and cool to go to football than rugby these days.

So because crowds for sunday games are smaller, the club are going to move games to a sunday to try and attract fans?

As a bloke who goes watching Latics and the rugby you probably have a point, although by the same token football could say they have a real problem attracting women to games. If I go to a Latics away game, the crowd is made up of 80-90% males, between the ages of 12-60. A big reason behind that is the lads culture and that element of hooliganism that exists with the vast majority of football clubs. Away days feel like you’re on a stag do/lads day out but that doesn’t then making it an ideal atmosphere to entice in females or families.

The ideal is that you have it all ways but it’s difficult. I don’t think the answer is banning the Riversiders from the Fanzone because they’re not ‘cool’ enough.

You just sound like the average Football supporter!

Did anyone suggest "Banning them"?

The trouble i have with it is that it becomes an event/place that is sculpted in a particular way to suit one particular demographic and that in itself either lends itself to or against each individuals perception of what it should be.
I virtually never went into the south stand and any inclination I did have to make the fan zone my pre or post match location of choice has been eroded because I didn't like the feel of how the SS Bar pre and post match was run and feel too many similarities may exist.
I would rather it have organically grown and as others have said theres nothing stopping the Riversiders selling tickets or whatever (and I dont give a toss about reserved seats). But they have their events st their own riversiders meetings and I dont feel as though the fan zone becoming an extension of that organisation helps.
I'm 50/50 on the attracting new fans argument.
We have got an ageing demographic, but it's always been that way.
I dont want the "football, more edgy feel" and dont think its needed unless you want to go down a particular route (and most people know my feelings on that).
But as someone who is involved in 2 organisations that IMO are suffering because of an ageing demographic I can tell you that there is an element of people that want things run in the 2020's because that's how they did it the 1970s/80s/90s and im afraid those organisations will wither and die because the older element dont want to change. And as someone who sits mid way between both camps (but more towards the older age, I'm 4icon_cool.gif I've always thought that we have to constantly evolve.
Having a band pre match, yeah,
Different surroundings and money going to the club, yeah
Club shop etc, yeah
I wont say the words JTB and others have used but I agree and it just sounds a bit same.old same old.
I had a free pass Sunday post game, I didnt take much persuading to go into town rather than listen to the interviews being described on here.

You know what?
Scrap that, I'm blaming the Riversiders!

Typing my reply and I've gone straight through my stop and now half hour wait plus return trip to get back to where I should have been 10mins ago!!!!

Banning them is obviously a strong term and nobody has suggested that but plenty have said they should be stopped from doing this, that and the other. Maybe they should be given less influence but it’ll make no difference to me either way. I’m not over thinking what the bar is meant to be in all honesty. I see it as a place to have a pint before the game with other fans and put money in the clubs pockets. I’ve not done that in the South Stand since probably 2007/2008 (at a guess) because the money didn’t go to the club. Maybe not having that 10+ years worth of going in the South Stand bar has meant I’ve not had the chance for them to get on my nerves.

We’ll see how the facility evolves but it’s been a positive start IMO.

Nowt worse mate, well there is, I once fell asleep on the last train back to Wigan from Manchester and when I woke up I was in Blackburn. It took me a few minutes to work out that to be in Blackburn, I’d got the wrong train in the first place....and then fell asleep on it



I had the umpteen pints of Guinness to blame it on mind

Pull the other one