Completely dropped from the England squad and overlooked by McNamara.

Cant say its undeserved. What has happened to him this year?

We've ruined him.......or should I say Agar has......

He will be back in next year with only showing his true talent back end of the season he probably only just missed out.

I'm glad

a) he gets a full post season's rest, which we will benefit from
b) he's not been good/consistent enough to warrant an International jersey. I hate it when out of form players in any sport are picked on reputation, when they're out of form

Clarkey has one poor season and is dropped, yet that NRL failure Tomkins waltzes into the squad without a care in the world. McNamara is clueless. He's chosen two specialist centres in that team, so you know that players are going to be played out of position.

The sooner he nobs off and England get someone in who will pick players in the right position and pick players based on form and not reputation, the sooner England might actually get somwhere in the international game.

Got to agree with Lefty a break from the game with a uninterrupted preseason will as said earlier beneifit both Clark and club, must admit I'm more surprised with the selection of Benny.

I can only see three props in that squad which doesn't provide cover for injuries or interchanges...unless the plan is to use Ben as a prop.

He's had a good season. Been our second best player. But we've not played well as a team and our ptbs can be painfully slow so his most dangerous play with quick scoots from dummy half have been far less impactive.

I think his defence has been exceptionally good and his passing has continued to improve, past what he's been able to produce in his career so far as he's had to do more of it with us (with the less scooting).

I think people just look out for his dummy half runs though and with them being fewer in number people just think "oh Clark's well gone off the boil", when he really hasn't.

He's had a good season for us. Probably our second best player.

The forwards do look a little short on numbers, I would think Mac would start with Graham/Hill Roby or Hodgson back three Farrell, Whitehead, O'Loughlin, Bench Hodgson or Roby, Cooper, T Burgess, Ferres, I think on this seasons form Ferres is over Westwood that would leave Currie.

Currie is in good form and this will be a great experience for him, Farrell and whitehead will have seniority but any injuries he will probably get a deserved chance as will Benny.

He's not completely dropped because of form. Clark has been omitted because he is to have the operation that's hasn't been a secret all season!

Clark is injured and has been to see specialists several times this season.

That is why he isn't selected.

I had heard Clark was carrying a injury but he was not on Tony Smiths list for surgery, so hopefully nothing too serious just time and treatment.

Clark has had poor support from a very average pack this year. Asotasi played 5 minutes a half, Harrison lost his pre-season training and needs three operations, England has just not performed as hoped, Evans picked up a season ending injury, Simms has great heart but not the bulk to make yardage at prop, Westwood has been a rock but he is now 35 and showing his age, Woody disappeared before the season started, Currie has been very good in attack but is half back-half forward and lacks the grunt of e.g. a Bateman. So we have lacked go-forward for most of the season and Hill has been outstanding in carrying the the forward drive - playing in all 34 of our matches and giving 110%. With such a poor forward attack Clark has been living off crumbs. He needs a forward to break the line or get up a little faster in the tackle, anything to pull the defence a little out of shape and leave defenders a yard or so out of position so he can make a break. Think back to when we had Monas playing for us - how many times did he run directly at an (out of position) off side forward for a penalty ? For virtually all season the opposition defence have not only been set, they have had time for a cup of tea and a butty before we have played the ball. And when Dwyer has been on the pitch, Clark has also been playing minutes as well - as an extra forward.

Clark has taken time to settle. But I think next year will be a fair test of what he is capable of, providing of course we have sorted out the pack and can mix it with the likes of Saints and Wigan.

great post.. easy to see why our pack has been so under par this season really when its infront of you in black and white... We should be a totally different proposition next season.

I can't give you an argument w/o, whenever I blame the pack I get it from all angles differing.

i dont ever recall seeing you being called out for your pack comments... i think everyone knows we have suffered in the pack.

you have usually been called out over....

* Bridge is the best 6 in the league.. or bridge and ratchford at 6&7
* Wheeler is a great signing, saints will miss him badly
* saying the honeymoon period for clark and sims was up after a few games

oh yea, you did get rightly slated for saying that Hill hadnt been very good this season.. or words to that effect.

i cant think of anymore of the top of my head, but im sure theres a few

Although not exactly what I said in all your paraphrases I don't deny those even if some were from the season prior to this one.
And still I said Sims is lightweight at prop during the honeymoon period as he still is.

But you have completely made up the bit about Hill.
I won't hold it against you.
But the whole pack as a unit was poor and thus includes Hill, but that doesn't make it his fault.

If our pack has been poor this season then God only knows how bad the backs have been.

I seem to recall last season as one were we had field position but would ineffectually bash away at the opponents line from 20m out.

you deffo had a little pop at Hill... i remember reading it and shaking my head in disbelief.

i have neither the time,patience or motivation to try and use the extremely poor search facility on this forum and find it though.

I wont hold it against you though

I half agree on the basis that the games where we were the dominant pack were few and far between, or have we been spoilt this last few years and yes from 20 out with a set of 6 you may as well have nipped to the bar for a refill. So much so that we often kicked out short rather than put ourselves under pressure to score from close in.

In response to Winslade's proposition, whatever the merits of the individuals involved, Higham/Monaghan combo on the pitch together were effective as they had the luxury of running at teams that had spent more time on the back foot compared with Clark and Dwyer IMO

Not me MD pal. Your mistaken or made it up.
Hill is not a poor player
I did say I thought Peacock was better than him this season and a couple others. Perhaps that was what you meant?

Remember when Leeds fans thought we'd let him leave.

He's only had one good season

must have imagined it then haha

No prob MD.

I like Hill, he's done a couple of pack leader knocks this year with 2 greats tries that come to mind.

Perhaps the responsibly of carrying a light pack will put us in good stead for next season.

I'd still say that the shared responsibilies at Saints for example means the likes of Warmsley Masoe and LMS have all looked emmence as a unit and subsequent look better individually.

It may not be the case but that is the illusion that it casts.