Having read this forum for months there seems to be many posters from a lot of different clubs use it. I was having a conversation about the health of the amature game over the last couple of years and it came about that we realised that the pasion for the game is still there. However with the amout of games been called off this year due to the weather and teams giving 18-0 is it time to move to summer rugby. I know people will say hard pitches but is there any other reasons not to.
One of the plus points mentioned would be training in the light (clubs could save money from not having to pay for indoor training) and then winter training could be sat/sun afternoon.
Just wondered what your thoughts are.

From a team management and coaching perspective - summer is the only way forward. We only formed 3 years ago and have struggled to attract new players in a non-RL area, and struggled to find facilities - especially winter training facilities.

Yet, during the summer we can train in great conditions, players are happy to train for longer, and we've got all sorts coming down - footballers, RU lads, friends of existing players, etc. Unfortunately, they (and other 'fair weather' players) are the ones who drift off when the clocks change and training is either a mudbath or on astroturf, and always cold, wet and grim.

And it goes without saying there would be far fewer weather postponements.

Our club sec, mmp, would be better than me to go into the runnings of the club - but I'm fairly sure he's keen on summer rugby and as far as I'm aware there are bigger steps in that direction for 2011/12.

Winter training can be non existant. We cant train on the pitches, as if we do, they rip up and give the game on the saturday more chance of being postponed. This means we have to pay to go to an indoor venue, which costs the club and players (more subs) at a time where the country is in recession.

Summer rugby is the way forward, hard pitches???? Surely someone can get the hosepipe out for 20 mins a couple of hours before a game.

Summers the way forward. Im sick of Postponements, lack of numbers training and running round in -5 degrees.

So summer has hard pitches, in winter training its that cold you seize up (when doing game plan standing around etc) and end up pulling muscles etc.

If the pro's can do it in summer who hit eachother harder and slam opponents down harder, then im sure us amateurs can do it. Id take that risk any day.

My gut feeling is that we will end up with two competitions - one in summer, one in winter and that the winter comp will be smaller than it is currently as some clubs switch and make the summer comp larger.

[uBUT[/u it will all be dependant on a given clubs own circumstances and not a mass switch as the RFL seems to think might happen, and that BARLA seem to think definately will not. Individual clubs will weigh up the benefits of each option, their players will too, and you'll end up with a new structure. It'll be clubs (and their players), and not leagues, BARLA or teh RFL that will make decisions and determine the future.

At the minute, the summer comp is squeezing itself into too few a number of months so not clash with the winter leagues which limits the number of sides per division to just 6 roughly - at some point the summer comp will need to bite the bullet and extend its overall duration (and number of clubs) and at that point, clubs will have decisions to make.

My personal view is that if you are a new club, you've much greater flexibility to think about switching. You are not going to 'lose' a place in an NWC Division that it took you 30 years to build for example and you've probably got more flxibility in how you are run to enable you to switch. If you're an older club, you've invested a lot of effort to get to NWC Prem, or 1, or 2, or 3 and your whole infrastructure is probably built around playing in winter anyway so why would you switch? You'd have already solved the floodlit training issues you face or any other barrier that makes winter play diffiicult for example whereas a new club, still trying to solve that problem might just think that summer makes sense.

However, my big annoyance is the current RFL consultation approach. They have consulted with players but not clubs. They need to ask club administrators about the practicality of switching if they are serious about encouraging lots of sides to move to summer. For example, I would need to ask the school we play at and the cricket club we use for after game food before i could definately say that yes, we could switch. But the RFL havent bothered asking about that and seem to assume that clubs can just take the necessary steps based on having aksed players what they prefer. I'm pro-summer - but i need to check its viable before committing.

We have played in the Summer foer 3 seasons now, we havent come accross a pitch that has been closed due to being too hard, yes we have played on some dust bowls but they are playable and no serious injuries have been reported.

We are able to train on our home pitch or alternative pitches in day light without the cost to hire indoor or all weather pitches.

I can only see that if we want to develop the game at grass roots level than it has to be in the Summer.

If there is a switch to summer a short season could quickly become a neccessity as councils make their pitches soccer for the winter and then changing the posts for a short RL season. will give them extra income stream and the possibility of selling off playing fields.

The smart councils will get the dual purpose posts. Soccer goals with the uprights on top.

Pitches that belong to clubs and don't get used in the winter will not be rutted when we get into spring and summer and won't be bare of grass either.

It's a no brainer in my personal opinion, especially for the junior game. At the risk of generalising, the only few people I've spoken to about a potential change (and I've spoken to a lot, believe me) who thought that we should stay as we are have been over 65, without exception.

Personally for me (Burtonwood) Summer Rugby is the only way forward, over the last 3 years the number of games that have been called due to the frozen pitches and weather has been stupid.

Not only that, but money, no clubs contribute to Rugby to make money, but clubs are losing money hand over fist due to having to to make alternative arrangements for training and then not been able to collect subs at the weekend due to no games been on!!

For me personally, summer rugby is the only way forward, as someone quite rightly says above, training in lighter summer months will make things a million times easier, and I think more enjoyable, now I'm not having a go at Higginshaw but I've played rugby for 22 years and 2 weeks ago at Higginshaw, I played in the worst ever conditions, I have ever played in, horizontal Rain, the pitch was a mud bath, the wind was howling and I for one hope that no one ever has to play in those kind of conditions again!!!

So summer rugby all the way for me.

didn't they play part of the season in the ncl in the summer to see how things went(not to sure about this but can remember someone said widnes st maries played in some games). Just wondering if this was correct how was the responce to it.

West Bank had a go in the summer league lass year i think mate.

I think MMP is bang on, couldnt have put it better myself.

In summer of 2009 NCL ran their own Summer season which had any teams from the NCL playing in it if they wished. They did it to see if the NCL were in favour or not.

As I said though we'll have to accept a short season. Soccer will get the first use of the pitches as they're not as terrified of winter as we appear to be and we'll get what's left of the year that they don't want....on council pitches (which covers most Yorkshire teams) anyway.

Its probably the wrong time of the year to be answering this question, especially given the current weather and games off, which ahs always been the case. My own view is that I don't think summer rugby will take off because the drive isn't coming from the tradional clubs & players, its from elsewhere. I've yet to speak to a player from an NCL or NWC club playing above div 2 that has expressed a preference for summer rugby, quite the opposite in fact. The established summer clubs, those that only exist in the summer, might actually suffer most because they naturally rely on players from other clubs to field teams. If those same teams then chose to play in the summer, their playing base would evaporate overnight. That would be really sad to see because they have worked very hard over the years to get established.

With regards pitches my experience of summer rugby is that the playing surfaces from the past few years is that they are actually in worse condition than winter. Someone described them as dust bowls which they predominantly are. The RU clubs we've played at have been hard and rutted but because 'its summer' that seems to be ok and acceptable. Watering just isnt an option, you'd need the fire brigade to sort some of the pitches I've seen games played on.

There's a long way to go on this one but that's my two penneths worth!

I agree. From all the meetings I go to the traditional clubs are resistant, and the more new the club, the more willing to consider the option of switching. That's why I think you'll end up with two distinct and both smaller competitions as it will be individual clubs/players that will make decisions. as for players, it annoys me sometimes to see a summer game where I recognise almost all the players on the field from winter sides...the objective was supposed to be to expand the player base! those clubs would be exposed now if there was a mass switchover and the RFL could be very embarassed - they use the summer numbers as part of the increase in participation justifying their Sport England monies.

mmp I to am disapointed with the way the summer league is now, like you say it was to bring people into the game not just use people from other clubs.
You say traditional clubs are resistant I was wondering what are the problems they see.

it's not so much 'problems' but a case that they have invested a lot of time and effort in getting to the position they are in now and it is inherently a risk to go down another route without having a clear idea of what the benefits might be and what the incentives are to switch. In most cases, the clubs are pretty sustainable based on their current operating model and have structures that will keep them at the top end of the competition (and i sometimes find it curious just how much value is placed on league placings etc. above finance etc - in many sports (take RU), its being financially sound that is seen as more important). Add 'tradition' (which is not a bad thing) into the mix and the bigger question for those clubs is why should we switch?

I really do not feel that the RFL have articulated the benefits enough to those people who will actually have to implement any changes. they are speaking to BARLA, they are surveying players, but it is what the individual club (and its members/players) decides on a case by case basis that will determine whether clubs switch.

Community Board met on Thursday and press release due out today apparently...lets see what is said!

Summer or winter i just want to play every week without missing games due to bad weather/pitches.
i am always hearing how the RFL are not afriad to try things diffrent and that makes us unique in sport. do you think it could be a good option to change to summer rugby for 1 year then have a vote to see which everyone prefers, some players may have visions of summer rugby wont be for them but they may change their mind after a season at it. if not then stick with winter, discussion could then be closed??

Doesn't really matter we think, summer or winter.

The RFL have an agenda and aim to take over the youth game. They already have ear marked three amateur teams per pro club and have put forward proposed free unlimited transfers between the rest of the clubs in that area and the ones linked to the pro teams.

The summer leagues will be run by the RFL (it's part of the proposal not often advertised) and those leagues will be ran by a chairman, a service area co-ordinator and a administrator. No guesses that they will be paid employees and therefore under the control of the RFL.

Already they are ploughing money into those committees and members who they feel are key to getting the switch over made, former volunteers are now getting five figure sums and still calling themselves volunteers.

The so called community forum has a rather large number of paid employees on it, so pinch of salt with what comes out of it, as for the "minutes of the meetings" well they do seem to often miss key facts the are raised against any proposal from an employee and often show a complete difference of opinion by carefully worded paragraphs.

There will be a lot less players taking part in the game when it switches and as the two seasons overlap there will be more 18-0's not less as teams fail to complete their fixtures at each end of the season.

By the way, don't get confused about games that are shown as P-P, many are not weather related and if you look closely some of the teams involved played elsewhere and some fixtures are errors and postponed as they have already been played.

Teams who cannot play in the summer (e.g. Myton Warriors) have been simply told that "there will be casualties - disgraceful!

Just look at the number of paid employees now in ever area and ask if we as the community get value for money. Some areas have combined figures of six figure sums in wages being spent on service area co-ordinators, talent coaches, derivites officers etc etc, one Super League club even pays the wife of a player £10K towards her salary to keep it out of the cap !

I wonder what, given a chance, those former hard working volunteers, who are no longer with game, would have delivered given the same six figures every year to invest in the youth and its clubs which currently goes oin wages of people who spend most of the week in meetings!

They have ran leagues on shoe string budgets for many years producing many great players in the process, 50K to two clubs every year alone would have soon had our community clubs in a better shape than they have been ever!

Makes you wonder

chaos rules: www.nationalconferenceleague.co. ... tions.html

chaos rules: www.nationalconferenceleague.co. ... tions.html

And therein lies the problem. We are pawns in a tug-of-war between Barla and RFL and I don't think either of them has the clubs' best interest in mind.

BARLA have the clubs best interests at heart, but sadly some of its committee have only their own interests on the agenda.

RFL on the other hand, simly have their own interests at heart - i.e. the elite youth. They only need the rest to make sure their star players have a team to play for most weeks.