What will it take for us as a team to play good exspansive rugby?
We are far too easy to defend against because we are so predictable.

Do we need an attack minded coach like Nathan Brown? When he was at St George he loved to play exicting rugby.

Or is it less workhorses and utility players in the team?

It's really boring to watch Hull FC.

Bit harsh? Granted last night it was boring and poor to watch, but its a bit generalised to say we are ALWAYS boring

I think we sometimes lack someone taking control of the game, moving us around the park and making plays which change games

it needs sorting, thats for sure

We haven't played exicting rugby since 2004.

Hull seem to worry about the percentages too much and are scared the try something off the cuff.

I disagree there, we have showed exciting play, just not consistently

wrong decisions and nobody taking control are our problems

wasnt a million miles away against brad,did some nice stuff. there had been a steady progression until then. i hoped we would have kicked on even more but we have gone backwards since.

Last night surely wasn't the right conditions for "expansive" rugby?

If we tried to play expansive rugby last night and dropped ball after ball the same people would be here moaning that they shouldnt throw the ball about and should respect posession. There is a fine line

I never mentioned about last night I just mean overall. We still never throw the ball out wide enough and do things off the cuff. All we ever seem to do is give it to say Horne have Tickle as a dummy runner and throw it the G. Horne from behind Ticks. Or same scenario but give it to Ticks on the shorts.

Another is Start to go wide but give a drop off back inside right into the sqaure markers.

The speed and accuracy of our passing is on the whole very poor.

Another thing that p!sses me off is that when defending, our line move up about 2 metres then stop and wait for them. Whereas Leeds and Saints have a rush defence, which works a treat.

I agree, it's tough. However, a seemingly 3 pass maximum for any given tackle is nowhere near even approaching it.

What hacks me off more is that for the first few games we moved up quickly and effectively. Last night in particular we looked as if we couldn't be bothered to.

gotta agree our defensive line was like a dogs hind leg.

Offensiveley, we're very poor. Speed of the PTB is generally slow, and most of our players seem to struggle to pass the ball quickly and accurately. In the last 2 games we've struggled to make as many yards as the opposition with ball in hand.

Defensively, we were doing well early in the season but since the Huddersfield game we've gone backwards. I think it's down to fatigue from the props and 2nd rowers who are playing far too many minutes - which other team expects 2 props to do 65+ minutes each and their 2nd rowers to play the full match? It just looks too easy to make metres against us, putting us under unnecessary pressure.

We just look like the same team who were coached by sharp and I don't see it improving

Got to agree about PTB, why are we so slow?we'll never get a penalty for 'lying on' we seem to be happy to get up slowly, and when we're near oppositions line i'm not as confident about us scoring, yet when the opposition are nr our line i always feel they'll score.

It's hard to disagree with any of that really.

Hard to disagree with any of that TBH.

Can you somehow post it to our coaching staff,?

I think we have made a great start to the season so don't want to be to critical, but do agree that things have slipped in the last two games.

What surprises me is that people are shocked that we look like the same team that was coached by Sharp, what people have to remember is Sharp was probably calling the shots but Agar will have done a lot of the day to day coaching. So no wonder much hasn't changed.

IMO the only short term solution is probably for agar to allow more input from J Sharp.

By the way I am not calling for Agar to go, but he needs to look to a more expansive game we are way too predictable.

Did I just see "Jon Sharp" and "expansive game" in the same sentence.

There is no surprse that Hudderfield are playing good rugby, they now have a cracking coach.

I was not saying J Sharp would play an expansive game and yes Hudds are now playing great rugby under Brown.

All I am saying is to try and change things quickly input other than that of Agar has to come from somewhere. In some ways that is probably Hull's problem both Agar and Sharp are to similar in coaching style.

I do remember Huddersfield under Sharp almost putting us out of the playoffs in 2007 by moving the ball through numerous hands each tackle, it was probably that big tackle by Carvell that changed the game.

We have the ability to play decent stuff but it never seems to be a priority with us. We seem to prefer to just try and grind a win out. After a positive start to the season we actually played some good stuff and scored some good inventive trys. We just seem to have gone away from that and tried to keep it tight which isn't working now as the pack are tired. I do think the conditions played a part on Saturday night but we should still have been better.

I thought on Saturday our biggest problem was Berrigan and then Houghton, both were shocking and that is where Quins won the game. We had no direction, speed or decent service from dummy half and the Quins did through Randall. Also we looked too slow in the forwards whereas Quins had far mroe mobility.

Got to agree. Berrigans passing was really poor in particular.

I was poor and slow and he never got out of dummy half to engage their forwards, very disappointing display.