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| Quote ="Kosh"And yet as pointed out to you a few posts ago we have had far larger crowds during worse runs of fortune. Which strongly indicates that there are other factors at work than simply conjuring up a winning team from thin air.'"
Of course there will be other factors at play but the main one will always be what happens on the pitch week in week out, maybe those staying away have simply been worn down over a period of time.
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| he's failing to see that the dropping attendance is down to him and his decisions. We're bored of his empty promises and inability to make good decisions in terms of recruitment.
No pass for me this year but I'll be there first game of the season. I just hope I'm made to eat large portions of humble pie.
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| Quote ="@airlie_bird"Most decent businesses (it is after all what the club is) acknowledge where they are going wrong when losing money and address it. Sitting in a small room in front of a few customers saying spend with us or else is not a great way to go about addressing the issues.
AP said we have lost kids in the past 2 years, he attributed most of this to football. He mentioned getting his kids back to his ex at midnight as a personal issue. Maybe just maybe the message is getting through there.
Friday nights do not attract families in the numbers they should. Friday nights do not attract away fans. Hence a threat veiled or otherwise to close the North stand. That's before Thursday's. But Friday's we are to,d attract corporates. Well maybe AP needs to recognise where IMHO he has gone wrong. Add in mediocre results despite wembley and you don't have to be an accountant to realise where his money is going.
Many of us have been there there was only a few thousand stood in the freezing winter months. We survived. Maybe at times by the skin of our teeth but we survived. We now have a supposedly more professional product played apparently in the summer, but Friday nights in February, March, April do nothing to entice families.
Play Sunday's and put on entertainment and make it a family occasion and have a winning team who make us feel excited about going to watch and people will return.
But don't sit and threaten us with extinction trying to scare us into going again.
I get APs passion but I do wonder about his methods at times.'"
Why do Leeds, Wigan and Saints make a success of choosing Fridays? I agree on the family point to some extent, but for us Fridays are less disruptive to the weekend in the summer. It's certainly not clear cut IMO.
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| I hope we stick with Friday's tbh
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| Quote ="WormInHand"I did get the impression it's a bit make-or-break this season. The North and South stands possibly closed next season if crowds don't improve. Onky 200 or so passes sold in October. Pearson is desperate to rally sales and push for a better atmosphere (mentioned the new floodlights contributing to that). Although he insisted vocally on being 'professional' and 'diplomatic', it's clear it's all out war with the Allams.
He mentioned several times we are being 'squeezed' and he only just managed to broker the deal to keep the full stadium open for the next 12 months. If gates fall below an average 9500 he will struggle to fight that position next year. Then it's the slippery slope.
What was most telling is he cited the huge debts of the SMC as their leverage and justification for this. He also stated that he cannot understand while the SMC balance-sheet situation is so 'complicated' when it was very simple - and marginally profitable - when he ran it.
It was also mentioned that the relationship with the SMC was previously 'amicable' whereas now... it isn't. Now it is 'functional'.
The Allams, he said, are 100% definite in their desire to sell the club. Presumably that aspiration would be much simpler with us 'squeezed out'.
Now is the time to rally. If every family could introduce one new passholder, or convince a stay-away to return, that'd probably do it.'"
For me that about encapsulates it all well said. James Smailes said tonight to me that tomorrows Mail front page and additional articles inside will make worrying reading for us all. Its about the state of the SMC and what they intend to do next!
He tweeted "Had a chat with Pearson this afternoon. Some very strong words in tomorrow's HDM which Adam may touch on tonight regarding attendances & SMC"
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| I agree that Fridays are the best option from a family perspective as it leaves us one full day (Sunday) to do family things. I've never understood the late night issue as it's Saturday the next day and night matches are part and parcel of the excitement of being a kid and going to rugby. I well remember the thrill when I was small.
Personally, I'd like a couple of Sundays chucked into the mix as there's nothing nicer than a balmy stroll down to the Stadium via Sunday lunch and a few drinks then a leisurely stroll back. But too many leaves too little family time if the whole family -like mine- aren't addicts.
Plus what about the kids who play Sunday rugby. A few parents were chuntering about that tonight when the point was raised.
End of the day, the preference will always be a split. No sauce suits every gander.
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| Does anyone know if it will be put on FCLive as a podcast or a video at any point? Working tonight and no chance to listen to it.
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| Quote ="hullbg"Does anyone know if it will be put on FCLive as a podcast or a video at any point? Working tonight and no chance to listen to it.'"
I think they said it will be on fclive as a free video/podcast.
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| Quote ="Smiggs"Of course there will be other factors at play but the main one will always be what happens on the pitch week in week out, maybe those staying away have simply been worn down over a period of time.'"
If the stayaway (apart from going to Wembley) supporters are waiting for a successful club they might find the club disappears before they see it.
I understand people's frustrations and impatience but the club need to be backed in numbers now.
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| The idea that a move to Sundays would improve attendances is a complete red herring.
This year we played Widnes and Wakefield on Sundays and got 10,306 and 10,088 respectively.
In 2012 we switched to Sunday games and our average attendance dropped about 5% compared to 2011. Only the opening game against Warrington drew more than 12,000 apart from the Good Friday derby.
Most of our big attendances (aside from the 19k against Bradford in 2003) have been Friday night games.
There are arguments both ways, of course. Some will always want Sunday fixtures, some (me included) Fridays. There are far more things for people to do on a Sunday compared to, say, twenty years ago. Especially people with children.
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| "In any kind of weather" unless we are losing. How anyone can call Pearson is beyond me. He is not making threats he is stating the obvious. IMO whatever day/night we play some will not like it but what can he do either way he cannot win.Yes he wants fans to spend money without that we have no club its not rocket science ,do fans expect him to fund it all out his own pocket? for gods sake get real.What did fans want him to say ,"we are not selling passes but i dont really care" he is asking why?he wants whats best for the Club and unless fans buy into it then it will be the end,,rant over
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| I didn't get a chance to listen to the forum but here's my take on things. I think pearson's period in charge has been very much a mixed bag. I'm grateful for him coming in and effectively saving the club through significant amounts of his own money being pumped in. He has done some good things, including trying to improve the culture, improving player welfare and investing in facilities and youth development. He has also made some monumental mistakes during that time which have damaged the club significantly IMO.
The worst of these was misjudging his position with the allams whilst at city and crossing them in a way which we are still suffering for (And looking like it could get much worse). allam appears to be a man who holds a grudge and even worse, seems like he's prepared to be vindictive in achieving what he sees as redress against those who cross him. You only have to look at his treatment of city's fans who have dared to question his running of that club. I've said since allam's first rumblings over the stadium that it will end badly for us and I still hold to that opinion.
pearson has also made some major feck ups in running the club. Firstly in trusting mcrae, who seemed to have his own agenda in working with howes and his recruitment strategy, through to firing a coach who wasn't perfect but who had taken us to 2 top 6 finishes and a wembley final (Yes I know it was a disaster on the day and the huddersfield game was a shambles but you have to question why he'd "lost" the players by that point) and then appointing a very inexperienced coach who took us to our worst finish since the dark early days of agar's tenure.
Communication and marketing seem to have got much worse for me in the last 3 years. Every article I read on the website is poorly constructed and seems to be written in the style of a local radio presenter (Which is, perhaps, what it is). We've also have a situation where we have so few businesses involved with the club that there have been occassions where the circle restaurant hasn't even opened. This a is a far cry from when I used to go in there and the place was packed. Do we have any professional marketers at the club? For all his faults, rule was very good on the marketing front but things have declined since he left.
I have bought my pass and will continue to support the club but I can fully understand those who have made the decision not to after too many seasons of false hope .
Anyway, just y take and I'm sure there will be plenty ready to shoot me down
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| Is [url=http://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/Allam-Hull-City-Council-s-loss-control-running-KC/story-24139003-detail/story.htmlTHIS[/url allam saying it's his stadium and he can do what he wants with it or him firing the first shots in a legal battle against the council?
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| Quote ="ComeOnYouUll"The idea that a move to Sundays would improve attendances is a complete red herring.
This year we played Widnes and Wakefield on Sundays and got 10,306 and 10,088 respectively.
In 2012 we switched to Sunday games and our average attendance dropped about 5% compared to 2011. Only the opening game against Warrington drew more than 12,000 apart from the Good Friday derby.
Most of our big attendances (aside from the 19k against Bradford in 2003) have been Friday night games.
There are arguments both ways, of course. Some will always want Sunday fixtures, some (me included) Fridays. There are far more things for people to do on a Sunday compared to, say, twenty years ago. Especially people with children.'"
Exactly what I was going to say, we've tried Sunday rugby and it wasn't any better, and the club finds it easier to get Corporate fans in on a Friday night.
with people working ever different times and days in the modern world I don't think there's a perfect time/day for everyone to attend a game anymore. IMO the biggest factors in our crowds are our form/confidence in the team and whether the game is on SKY or not.
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| Quote ="WormInHand"I did get the impression it's a bit make-or-break this season. The North and South stands possibly closed next season if crowds don't improve. Onky 200 or so passes sold in October. Pearson is desperate to rally sales and push for a better atmosphere (mentioned the new floodlights contributing to that). Although he insisted vocally on being 'professional' and 'diplomatic', it's clear it's all out war with the Allams.
He mentioned several times we are being 'squeezed' and he only just managed to broker the deal to keep the full stadium open for the next 12 months. If gates fall below an average 9500 he will struggle to fight that position next year. Then it's the slippery slope.
What was most telling is he cited the huge debts of the SMC as their leverage and justification for this. He also stated that he cannot understand while the SMC balance-sheet situation is so 'complicated' when it was very simple - and marginally profitable - when he ran it.
It was also mentioned that the relationship with the SMC was previously 'amicable' whereas now... it isn't. Now it is 'functional'.
The Allams, he said, are 100% definite in their desire to sell the club. Presumably that aspiration would be much simpler with us 'squeezed out'.
Now is the time to rally. If every family could introduce one new passholder, or convince a stay-away to return, that'd probably do it.'"
new floodlights?
also I'm not panicking about pass sales just yet, we're still to buy ours, as we still have a few weeks to retain our seat, and there was no real incentives to buy early this year.
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| Quote ="@airlie_bird"Most decent businesses (it is after all what the club is) acknowledge where they are going wrong when losing money and address it. Sitting in a small room in front of a few customers saying spend with us or else is not a great way to go about addressing the issues.
AP said we have lost kids in the past 2 years, he attributed most of this to football. He mentioned getting his kids back to his ex at midnight as a personal issue. Maybe just maybe the message is getting through there.
Friday nights do not attract families in the numbers they should. Friday nights do not attract away fans. Hence a threat veiled or otherwise to close the North stand. That's before Thursday's. But Friday's we are to,d attract corporates. Well maybe AP needs to recognise where IMHO he has gone wrong. Add in mediocre results despite wembley and you don't have to be an accountant to realise where his money is going.
Many of us have been there there was only a few thousand stood in the freezing winter months. We survived. Maybe at times by the skin of our teeth but we survived. We now have a supposedly more professional product played apparently in the summer, but Friday nights in February, March, April do nothing to entice families.
Play Sunday's and put on entertainment and make it a family occasion and have a winning team who make us feel excited about going to watch and people will return.
But don't sit and threaten us with extinction trying to scare us into going again.
I get APs passion but I do wonder about his methods at times.'"
Wigan and Leeds have played Friday night home games just about since the inception of SL. They have the top two averages and have no problem attracting new fans. Even in Wigans poorer seasons (2005-200icon_cool.gif they maintained high crowds. Leeds gates were already high before they won SL with Friday night games.
There have been plenty of good away followings over the years on Fridays. It's more just general RL fan apathy which stops a lot travelling. As an example, I live in West Yorks and know loads of Wakey fans, they would dream of going to Leeds or Bradford to watch their team. Crackers isn't it.
The key to increasing gates is a performing team. Of course that's asker said than done.
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| Makes me quite annoyed to read Pearson bleating on effectively blaming the fans for being fickle when in fact his rather large number of club feck ups have contributed to our current situation in a bigger way than the recession or the Allams.
Im sorry but I said ages ago that Pearson may be the worst thing that could of ever happen to this club and I stick with it. The guy has almost been clueless since the start and now he expects us all to carry on being blind sheep for another year or even two, well im sorry he needs to stop dreaming. Its his bad management of the whole club that's got us into our current predicament and nothing else
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| There is no doubt AP has made mistakes, mainly with his trust in certain people for recruitment and salaries handed out to players, but without him, this club would be in a far far worst state, he has put so much money into this club on and off the field, ask yourself who else in this City has the money or is would be willing to invest a few million into us?
There is no doubt that things need to improve on the pitch, but if he leaves I would really fear for the future of Hull FC.
I personally see nothing in wrong with what he is saying, if you want to see Hull spending a full cap and paying out 6 figure transfer fees on players then he needs to get the revenue from ticket sales, it is a two way street but with the money he has invested and improvements he has made to the club off the field do you not think he deserves our support?
On another note the HDM claims that our average attendance last season was 9662, this isn't correct is it?
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| I'll hold my hand up and say I'm 1 of those fans that Pearson is trying to blame instead of taking any responsibly for his terrible investment whilst he has been in charge of the club.
Personally last season I found myself going to the stadium out of habit or feeling like I should be there despite the fact I was rarely looking forward to the game or ever coming away feeling like we are heading in the right direction.
I started picking and choosing my games and did feel really guilty about it at the start but by the end of the season I felt like I had made the right decision.
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| Quote ="Mrs Barista"In summary the club is in the hands of the stayaway fans.
Let's hope they don't let us down.'"
You could just as easily make the case that it is the 'stayaway' fans that have been let down.
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| Quote ="Smiggs"Of course there will be other factors at play but the main one will always be what happens on the pitch week in week out, maybe those staying away have simply been worn down over a period of time.'"
Bingo.
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| Quote ="Lostyorkie"he's failing to see that the dropping attendance is down to him and his decisions. We're bored of his empty promises and inability to make good decisions in terms of recruitment.
No pass for me this year but I'll be there first game of the season. I just hope I'm made to eat large portions of humble pie.'"
Ditto. I'm still genuinely hoping that I've made the wrong choice and end up paying more in match-day tickets than a renewal would have cost.
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| Can you listen to a recording of the forum online? FClive or something similar?
I don't like the stay away fans quote, it's very very simple. Give the fans what they want on the pitch each week and the crowds will sort themselves out. AP selling the club to the fans with prediction of top 4, stating he will not stand for top 8 mediocrity then delivering 11th position what do the club expect?
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| Quote ="The Hollywood Frasier"I'll hold my hand up and say I'm 1 of those fans that Pearson is trying to blame instead of taking any responsibly for his terrible investment whilst he has been in charge of the club.
Personally last season I found myself going to the stadium out of habit or feeling like I should be there despite the fact I was rarely looking forward to the game or ever coming away feeling like we are heading in the right direction.
I started picking and choosing my games and did feel really guilty about it at the start but by the end of the season I felt like I had made the right decision.'"
I'm exactly the same and don't feel guilty about it all.
Had a pass season before last but, like you, went to some games that season feeling like i should go because i had already paid but didn't feel any enthusiasm to go.
Didn't get one this last season and didn't regret it at all. Picked and choosed my games and some times felt i really can't be bothered to go tonight so didn't.
Obviously the performance of the team is the main contributor to that feeling but i am also cheesed off with the whole KC stadium and Allam situation. When i go these days it just doesn't feel like home. Too many Tiggers signs about and barely any mention of us.
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| Produce on the pitch Adam , and the fans will return , simple as that !
Most fans are sick and tired of the dross of the last few seasons.
Cut the propaganda and produce on the field , your missing fans will return then Mr Pearson !
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