Indeed, but if we never did anything for fear that things might be worse, we'd all still believe the earth was flat and the moon was made of cheese.

It's catch 22. agar isn't good enough and will lose plenty of games this season. Personally I'd rather it happened now and we got rid and tried to make something of teh season, or at least put us in a better position going forward. FWIW, I haven't said I want to see us lose, merely if we did and it hastened his departure then it would be worth it

The less the better for me. Makes getting in and out much easier

That's an interesting point actually and TBH in the most traditional sense of the term then, maybe I'm not a 'true supporter'. I could easily argue though that I have far more desire to see us be successful than a 'true supporter' does, as he is only looking out for the short-term.

I think 'long term' and 'short term' need a little more definition in order to be useful in this situation TBH. Most supporters have a mixture of long term and short term goals, and your assumption that everyone who has the short-term desire to see us win the next game lacks the long-term desire to see us lift silverware is a classic false dichotomy and could even be deemed patronising by some.

For instance, pretty much everyone in the 'pro-Agar' camp is also supportive of the steps the board has taken to put us on a [ilong-term[/i viable financial footing. I'd also argue that every fan posting on here wants us to win silverware ASAP, let alone the long term. The difference is that some of us feel that it's disrespectful to the players and to the club to actively wish for us to lose matches, not to mention the emotional imperative to win every game.

I'm not sure it is a false dichotomy and I don't mean to say the two desires are mutually exclusive. I don't doubt every fan wants to see us win things, but this is a question of what the best way to achieve that goal is and what you are willing to sacrifice to get there. Some are willing to sacrifice being seen to be 'respectful' to the club and the 'emotional imperative' to win every game and others are not. I might be being a bit patronising but the logic is on my side and I've been patronised too by those who take the traditionalist view. The most frustrating aspect of it is that pretty much everyone has the common desire to see a proper head coach in charge, and this issue is only going to get more and more divisive until we get one.

I don't think it's true at all. People on here have activley said they would like us to loose, for one reason or another. To me that just goes against the whole idea of being a fan or supporter. Yes, I want the best for our team in the long term, but I would never wish anything negative on our team at any time, be it low attendances or losses or whatever. To me it's about supporting your team through thick AND thin, and I am not preaching here but what's the point in only supporting our team when we're doing well? It's not what being a supporter is about IMHO.

Are you not able to grasp though that this isn't a question of not being willing to carry on supporting through the 'thin' times in the way we did when we were at the Boulevard and in financial crisis, or the way Wakey fans are doing now for example?

This is quite a specific issue of the club having everything in place to compete at the top, other than the self inflicted issue of employing a sub-standard coaching set up. In this kind of situation, taking the 'I'll just go and cheer the lads on regardless cos that's what fans do innit' stance only serves to help maintain the status quo. Nobody can criticise you for that because as Kosh says it's traditionally what fans do, but I just think it's very daft to try and be critical of those who want to be pro-active about the situation.

'I'll just go and cheer the lads on regardless cos that's what fans do innit'




I aren't going to pick and choose games I go to just because I might be 'maintaining the staus quo'. I'm going attend every game I can. Sorry if that doesn't agree with your way of being a fan, it seems to be bugging you that I don't have the same opinion as yours, once again.

You are an expert at deliberately missing the point.

If someone told me years ago that id be cheering my OWN team to lose I would have laughed at them. But this is how bad Agar and the Stubborness of the board has made me do. I hate to say it but I can only see us getting rid of the out of depth Agar if we keep losing. This club should be a massive force in Superleague but the Board keep going for a cheap option as coach instead of going for a Brian Noble or a big aussie coach oh a coach what has actually won a few things on his CV. Agar is a failure it is quite clear to see he has won us nothing and bar a flukey run in the cup will never bring us anything but boredom and heartache. He has no gameplan and his interchanges must be the worst in the game. But the most worrying thing is he never seems to learn from his mistakes. Add to the fact his best supporters are the kr fans says it all really. AGAR OUT!!

Look through the thread.

I asked a poster why they said they wanted a low attendance, and explained why I wanted a bigger attendance. I also explained my motives of attending and why I wish to attend. Even though me not attending could speed up some process of Agar being sacked due to low attendances, that's not what it's about for me. What have I missed?

Tommy I think your missing the point I dont want them to lose ever but thanks to our board not wanting to let Agar go seems like they have to lose to get rid of agar because this club will never go forward until he is gone.

And if that means losing some more games then so be it

The point that this isn't an issue of 'fair weather fans' refusing to keep supporting their team during the 'thin' times, but a quite specific issue of the only profit making club in the competition quite clearly short-changing it's fans and some of them not being willing to tolerate it any longer.

That I can agree with

Even you're right once in a while

well over a year ago on airlie night I spoke to james rule and said that the style of rugby we played was boring and that if it did not change people would start voting with there feet.
I then saw record season pass sales last year and was confused. I think with pass sales down (i can only assume) this year. and attendences looking as though they will be down on last year. Something has to happen. I almost bought a pass again this year but did not and I cannot see myself going again until the style of rugby changes I have got to the stage that I have more important things to do with my money. I went to my first games in 1963 so I am not a recent supporter. The sad thing is like I said on Airlie night you are in an entertainment business and I am not being entertained.

Thats the problem too many fans will "lose the habit" and once it is broken there is no going back. That is the one thing that has deeply worried me for a long time, the effects of this current regime could set Hull FC back a whole generation.

I've said before that apathy is by far more dangerous to a sporting club than anger, as at least with anger the passion is still there. For myself at least, and others I know and probably more beyond them, this regime has got the apathy setting in. If people stop going the next potential development is to stop caring, and that's when the risk of the setback you mention rears it's head.

I'm halfway there now and there's also a fair few at work thinking the same who don't use these boards.

It says a lot when people who have been supporting the club for 50 years have had enough.

im a 25 year veteran, and im at home not goin till agar and certain others are gone

If the car park's anything to go by 4,651.

You may feel able to pick and choose when you will feel respect for the players. I don't. Respect is earned and lost by the actions of the person it refers to, not on a whim. I don't give a to$$ how badly we all want Agar away from the club, the whole time there are players pulling on the black and white and trying their best to win [ifor us[/i I will give them my respect and will not be hoping that they lose.