For whatever reason we decided to play a predominently forward biased game, straight up the middle little or no offloads and lack of support any way which suited the Crusaders as it was easier for them.

The times we did spread it wide we scored as we stretched them and had too much pace and power.

Apart from the odd wrong option Shaul had a good game and showed his pace.

Cunningham was ok did the basics but a little wayward with his passing.

Don't think Moa and Manu would have made a lot of difference today due to our style of play and probably relaxed attitude to the game.

Cunningham started the 2nd half like a house on fire, he did OK overall. Our lack of passing fluency was painful at times today, though.

Not debating that, but he'll never leave France. Might as well have answered the question with Paul Gallen.

Our passing accuracy and speed was painful and boring to watch today and we coughed up too much easy ball.

I'm glad we didn't play anyone of note otherwise I don't think we'd be in the next round, unless of course this was Gentle's masterplan and style of play for today.

Possibly with the young front row it was a case of up the jumper and run. Tire the opposition and score down the flanks.

Agree it was boring to watch but tbh everyone expected an easy victory and we were bound not to play as well as i reckon even the players thought it would be easy. (No disrespect to crusaders, they played for the full 80 even though the game was lost).

Anyone see their scrum half though, showed some good pace and good passing Lol??

Whatever the result today it was a no win situation. Thought the pack was average at best today. The lack of off loads was very disappointing. We just played into their hands today.

He will probably crop up soon on a "rumour" thread. Will we also spend 100's of pages debating whether to sign the loose forward - needs some conditioning but can throw a decent pass!?

Second Rower on the right showed some rough and aggressive style of play. It was a good forward battle in all honesty. Crusaders just played there game and look good for there division. What position are they in championship 1?

Walmsley from saints looks a great prospect , would love him at Fc

Average player in a shi.te team

Ithink we must have the worst offload record in super league, i thought it was an Agar thing not to off load the ball, yet somehow we still dont seem to offload the ball more than once in an entire game. When you watch Leeds or Saints, and they're on the rack they will offload more times in one play of the ball than we do all season. (apart from Manu when he played)

2nd last season in offloads last season superleague.co.uk/stats/clubstats But this season it seems to have stopped, haven't seen yesterdays games yet, but think it has been much improved the last 3 SL games, hopefully this will continue to improve. As it stands are forwards are good, they defend very well and make good yards, but we are lacking a Hock or Manu type player.

2nd last season in offloads last season superleague.co.uk/stats/clubstats But this season it seems to have stopped, haven't seen yesterdays games yet, but think it has been much improved the last 3 SL games, hopefully this will continue to improve. As it stands are forwards are good, they defend very well and make good yards, but we are lacking a Hock or Manu type player.

I didn't go yesterday but this is one of the disappointing areas for me that gentle has failed to address

we have one, he's injured, hopefully back for London.

If you mean Ellis you're very wrong.

you don't think Ellis is as (if not more) creative than Manu or Hock?

I'm with Standee here, Ellis' attacking ability is massively under rated.

In his own way, probably. But he's still not the same type of player as the other two mentioned, though.

Not by me, but he's not like the other two and IMO we won't see the best of him if we try to play that way with him.

Quote ="Dave K."2nd last season in offloads last season superleague.co.uk/stats/clubstats But this season it seems to have stopped, haven't seen yesterdays games yet, but think it has been much improved the last 3 SL games, hopefully this will continue to improve. As it stands are forwards are good, they defend very well and make good yards, but we are lacking a Hock or Manu type player.'" He's called Gareth Ellis, he's out captain, and will playing very soon for us

Quote ="Dave K."2nd last season in offloads last season superleague.co.uk/stats/clubstats But this season it seems to have stopped, haven't seen yesterdays games yet, but think it has been much improved the last 3 SL games, hopefully this will continue to improve. As it stands are forwards are good, they defend very well and make good yards, but we are lacking a Hock or Manu type player.'" He's called Gareth Ellis, he's out captain, and will playing very soon for us

Are you kidding me? I think you need to watch Gaz Ellis for the past few seasons. He is unreal, especially in attack.

Ellis and Manu are completely different players IMO.. Manu you had his strength, ability to create something from nothing and generally a battering ram.

Ellis is an all round second rower. Strength, reads the game well, pick out a good pass when needed, basically a great player

Why are people interpreting 'different types of player' as one not being as good as another? It's nothing of the sort.

Exactly what I was getting at. Manu and Hock are mainly about brute force and blasting through opposition players. Their freakish strength at this means that they can often still be effective from poor team positions and slow PTB, and can produce something from nothing on their own. IMO Ellis is a much smarter player than either who runs better lines at gaps and chooses his passes much better, but this is more dependent on those around him helping him out and being on the same wavelength. If we do this he'll be brilliant for us, but if we continue to have a slow PTB and use 'pass it to Ellis to make something' tactics in the same way as we did with Manu I think we'll be sorely disappointed.

Ellis will make a huge difference to our pack, he's a great defender but also a very good attacking player. Add his leadership to his skills and he will lift us for certain.

That said our pack needs some work for next season, with Ogre and Ticks likely to go there is cash there for the right player.