a prop who is fit,play for at least 15 mins each half,a no7 who can create somthing,lee and moa dont fit any of these.

You really think those 2 are the answer to our problems?

Did we play free flowing rugby in 06 when we got to Old Trafford? I think we all know the answer is no, but nobody was complaining then. The difference was we had a couple of props who could bend the line and get the team on the front foot.

Nobody on this board is saying that their over the moon with our performances but yesterday was an improvement on recent weeks.

I agree, some fans ( I don't really think you can call them that ) are never happy. We were never in the game for the first 20 against Cas yet WE WON ! They are a good side and will be more disappointed not to have won due to the amount of possession they had. We fought hard for a victory that a few weeks ago would not have happened so give the team some credit. If your a serial whinger go whinge somewhere else.

I wish you'd get to the point.

I just wish you'd fook off

I have been away so watched the game today,for the first 30 mins we were average at best but were still only 6 points down.Things did improve a bit after this but not much.Houghton played well as did Danny Washbrook.Cas should be the more worried of the two teams after dominating and failing to put the game away in the first half.

Moa apparently played around 60 mins for the reserves a couple of weeks ago.

HTH.

Two wins albeit not great performances but wins are what is important right now and in particular staying with the group on the 14 point mark.

Could do better but happy to be winning again.

Some people want to see free flowing attacking rugby, that doesn't win games though. You only have to look at warrington for that. This year and to a lesser extent next year is about rebuilding. starting with getting the defense in order, which on the whole this season has been ok. Our goal line defense is a big improvement on last season. Then after this we can start to be more adventurous. All good teams start with good defense.

No need. Bad man.

Cas were not at there best same with you guys, but a toss pot ref once again spoiled the best game this weekend .

Our defence was worse after Sharp left, up to then it was better than most despite the defeats in 5 games by 2 points or less.
We are leaking points early on in games recently, that IMO is down to Agar changing our starting props, Cusack and Dowes have proven very hard to break down and pretty much error free, to change it for the sake of change is wrong, if it ain't broke then don't fix it.
Starting Thackray isn't 'safe' IMO as Thacks defence is hap hazard and he makes most errors either in handling or defence.

Saints played free flowing rugby ..but they got their back side kick

I don't get what the thread starter is on about, nobody is being that negative about our win

there's a big difference between pointing out things that are still wrong (such as Thorman being completely shocking) and being negative, there's still errors and problems with the side, but we definitely made a step in the right direction this week IMO we even started throwing balls out in the tackle (not always successfully!) something we haven't seen since 2007 really.

Agreed that i'm happy with still being with the main group. As Paul said our performances haven't been great, despite winning yet only against Salford and Cas. I was very happy to see more willingness to throw the ball around more. We tried a few offloads and expansive play against Cas and i think you would all agree that is an improvement. Hopefully we can kick on after a weeks rest and pull up a good consistent 80 minutes against wire.

Hardly his fault if the coach subs him is it? Did Thackray go off after 13 minutes yesterday?

Those who say this is the worst they have ever seen Hull play, have certainly got short memories

What about the second half at Quins or the Wigan game away last season? Then what about the games at Wigan and Saints in 1999!! We conceded a total of over 130 points in those two away games!! For me personally, remembering how I felt after those games I would rather at this time be playing dour stuff and winning than losing and playing sparkling rugby.

On the plus side the Salford game was a win and the Cas game was an improvement, against a team that have shown that if you don't close it down they will cut you to shreds and who were undeafeated away from home this season. Then there is also the fact that all the team are trying hard and at least no one appears to be T*ssing it off at present.

There are of course plenty of things on the down side though, there always will be particulaly if your looking for them!!! They are mostly for me, centreing around the fact that we don't have enough pivots, and until the abysmal play from 7 and the lack of creativity at 13 is addressed that will stay the same. Our rugby will be one dimensional and our kicking game predictable and easy to read. For me the change over the last two weeks has been caused by the unpredictability of Horney coming into the line and creating another pivotal position! However after all that is said, 4 points from two games would have done for me two weeks ago.

Finally it is very apparent I think that some folks just enjoy moaning, for some reason, and probably long for a couple of seasons under David lloyd!!!

I think that when you are a supporter of any team, you have every right to complain particulaly when you pay your money to watch players who are not trying, that is unforgiveable. However most supporters always look for positives from the team they love, and 4 points from 2 games is just that, a positive! A vocal few however just look for negatives, they thrive on running their club down and and are obviously by their comments dissapointed with 4 points!


Just of course my opinion!

People were saying that Cas were a better team than us. They were higher in the league than us and we beat them to leapfrog them in the table.

I can see why everyone's so disappointed - we must be... what.... 100 points off the top spot by now.

We have 2 props who are more than capable of breaking defences.
Thackray and Moa.

Thacks can be devastating when he runs hard and straight at defences but he does'nt do that enough these days.
He needs to get back to this and stop running sideways so much.

Anyone watching the Wakey game would realise we certainly aren't the worst and if anybody starts touting Broughy on here ahead of Thorman just go back and watch that game, when that kid has a mare he really does have a mare!

Thacks did well second spell against Cas. Helped Houghton get on the front foot with some good runs and fast ptbs. Agree he needs to do more of it.

I think whats becoming apparent now is that people are getting fed up with our style of play. They pay their money and want to be entertained but instead week in week out we are seeing slow up the middle winter stuff.

Yesterday was much more positive in particular the offloads and the fact that we're finally using Calderwood to our advantage. On the negative we're still not getting the best out of our left side or in other words Yeaman / Manu.

You mean some people having different opinions?

I watched all 7 games over the weekend and it was evident how poor a team we are. Still, we won.

With the amount of ball we had in that game, especially the first half, any side with a decent attack would have put well over 40 on Cas. Over the 80 minutes, that performance was arguably the worst we have come up against from an opposition side this season bar the odd flash of good play and yet we still only won by 8.
If SL was a 27 game season, whoever wins the most are the champions, then winning would be all that matters. But with the play-off system you need to be able to win, and win well. I dont mean win with lots of flashy play but be able to dominate teams, and finish games off when they are there to be finished. We have done that once this season (Catalans at home). No matter where we finish if we get into the play-offs, I would be very suprised if we win a play-off game the way things are going at the moment.
Things arent as bad as they were a few weeks ago. The effort seems to be improving now. The returns of Cusack and Burnett, Lee starting at 9 and Berrigan been dropped seems to have inspired this imo. Also Washy getting involved more seems to have helped too.
We really miss Raynor and Tony though. Apart from Briscoes first couple of games, we have really missed a left winger (even though we dont use them enough) and Raynor returning wil really help. Hall looked uncomfortable at fullback, and I feel Horne would carry on playing like that if moved back to halfback, and Tonys yardage would help us fantastically. Washbrook has to stay ta halfback though and I would drop Thorman. He has looked goodish against Bradford and Salford but for most of the season has looked poor and Washy looks much better there at the moment