The sight of Tommy Johnstone under his own posts trying to run the ball out against 3 Wigan forwards is criminal. The number of times Lee Kershaw runs the ball out against opposition forwards, if he ever gets a chance to run the touchline I would imagine he'd be too knackered to do what he's there for. We have 6 forwards plus 4 on the bench, wouldn't you think 10 forwards to see through 80 minutes should be enough. With what Tommy has gone through over the last couple of year's he needs to be protected or managed better to get the most out of your main asset . Tommy's job is to use his pace to make and score tries, seeing him drive the ball out of defence like he is doing is as I have said, criminal.

Most teams use there backs to get them away from there own line it is to give there forwards a bit of a breather and cos back are quicker and can sometimes make more yards like cockaynne and fox did.no matter how many forwards you have in your squad still can only have a 17 match day squad

Don't forget that out of those 10 forwards 2 of them are hookers, and you can only count 5 forwards on the field as the others are sat on the bench and are destined to come on at pre scheduled times, and not just when we are trying to get off our own line, so at times somebody has to help out, and it's not as though Johnstone, Lyne, Arundel and Kershaw are lightweights as against Woody.

It's standard practise. Every team does it.

If you don't your forwards will be more tired than the opposition. It's pretty simple.

Any kick return is a direct result of the forwards tacking and then having to chase back.

There is a technique to it that some need to learn but to be honest Kershaw is excellent at it. If you take that away, faster players will take his place.

You keep saying this and I don't agree - other teams may utilise it but not to the degree we do imo. And also it's not utilised as much when they are completely on the back foot in their own 10, you simply must have you forwards driving it out then or you just get completely dominated in sets. Often it's backs scooting when there has been a quick play the ball, we have the wingers running on to the ball 5 yards out getting hammered it's absolutely crazy

Think you have to see the game situation when any team are coming away from there own line it goes without saying the big guys are wanted to make the big hard yards but this isnt always possible so the backs have to help..of a team just defended 3 sets on there own line its generally the forwards doing most of the defence so come getting hands on ball forwards a shattered through all defence they done and need the backs to take on the extra work

Yes and I do, it's nothing to do with the game situation it's just a matter of course pretty much every set. We do some sets where we are getting hammered and yet on the 3rd tackle in our own 15/20 we still have a back running onto the ball, often Johnstone. And then do we try and get our best player the ball in space where he should be getting it, on his wing? No! that would be madness!
I'm not saying that backs sholdn't return the ball, of course they should. Especially after the opposition have kicked deep and we can get a quick play the ball for them to scoot and eat up some quick metres. But not like we do where we do it against teams who are completely set and for 3 sometimes 4 tackles in our own 20.

I didn’t feel TJ was removed from the field quickly enough

Quote ="DanielPe"Tommy has gone through over the last couple of year's he needs to be protected or managed better to get the most https://nicelocal.com/new-york-city/bea ... _piercing/'" I don't think eyebrow piecing will make him any less susceptible to injuries.

Quote ="DanielPe"Tommy has gone through over the last couple of year's he needs to be protected or managed better to get the most https://nicelocal.com/new-york-city/bea ... _piercing/'" I don't think eyebrow piecing will make him any less susceptible to injuries.

I don't mind TJ being used at times to help the forwards, as has been said, all teams use their wingers to do this.
What is criminal is that we still cannot unlock Tommy's pace, as we should - we get glimpses of it as we did against Wigan when Max lobbed the pass to him, seeing he was unmarked and the try followed.
I know he's a marked man but, particularly on the wide BV pitch we should be finding ways to get the ball to him - perhaps sometimes using the long kick as we used to do years ago for the likes of Andy Mason?

Was it against Widnes??? when they hit the post from a pen, Finny kicked it almost straight away TJ chased it and scored......
Simples! :

Think you may be thinking of the catalans one.if its the one where finn kicked it fromm just in front of the sticks at changing room end..he didnt kick it too far but enough to give tj the chance which he tool

thats the one.

Catalans penalty right on halftime, so they went for 2 points, missed and we scored that quite remarkable try, still we managed to lose the match.

Using wingers in this way seemed to start in the days of Fox and Cockayne on the wings, and appeared to work to good effect It doesn't seem to work with all wingers although we still employ the move all the time.

I dont mind them using wingers on first couple of rackles what i object to is then going down that wingers line while he is out of position and we do it almost every time makes no sense if your attacks not ready or in position

I think what people are forgetting is that the winger probably hasn't just done 3-4 big tackles in the previous set against the big men. So that first drive or two probably gives the forwards much-needed recuperation time. It also instantly puts the opposition on the back foot,

That's how I see it anyway.

And that's how saints saw it last night......

Rumour is James Roby is still holding down a player in the tackle from yesterday. Some pretty criminal laying on thiat second half from saints going unpunished. Also found it amazing how Coote pushed Marshall (who had no hands in and was at marker) and Child gave Saints the penalty. The crawling forward on knees after held (sometimes gained up to 5 yards) was criminally allowed too. I hope we don’t find saints get that much leniency at the ruck on Friday or it’ll be a tough night for the trin.

Anyway, I think it’s necessary to have backs running on the 1st/2nd after kicks downfield but maybe we could employ our centres more to take the carries. It does frustrate me sometimes when the winger takes a run in on the 2/3/4th and then we try spread it to that wing before he’s had chance to get back in place but I don’t think we are alone in that.

According to the papers Warrington are trying to reduce their salary cap to be able to sign Williams and are trying to offload Akauola with Salford interested… I’d hope that Trinity would be interested in signing him aswell as he’s just the type of tough hard running no nonsense prop Trinity need. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sitaleki_Akauola

According to the papers Warrington are trying to reduce their salary cap to be able to sign Williams and are trying to offload Akauola with Salford interested… I’d hope that Trinity would be interested in signing him aswell as he’s just the type of tough hard running no nonsense prop Trinity need. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sitaleki_Akauola

Quote ="asmadasa"According to the papers Warrington are trying to reduce their salary cap to be able to sign Williams and are trying to offload Akauola with Salford interested… I’d hope that Trinity would be interested in signing him aswell as he’s just the type of tough hard running no nonsense prop Trinity need. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sitaleki_Akauola'" I said the same weeks ago that he is exactly the type of strong running prop we should be looking at for next season. He’s about the best of what’s available imho. I would be straight in for him and then try and find a good English prop from somewhere.

Quote ="asmadasa"According to the papers Warrington are trying to reduce their salary cap to be able to sign Williams and are trying to offload Akauola with Salford interested… I’d hope that Trinity would be interested in signing him aswell as he’s just the type of tough hard running no nonsense prop Trinity need. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sitaleki_Akauola'" I said the same weeks ago that he is exactly the type of strong running prop we should be looking at for next season. He’s about the best of what’s available imho. I would be straight in for him and then try and find a good English prop from somewhere.