Quote ="Tommy Duckfingers"You really need to do some research.... [i "A Challenge Cup appearance in his first season was followed by a comprehensive defeat of Wigan in what was to be the first of five consecutive Grand Finals. In 2003 he became the first Coach to win ‘all four cups’ in the Super League era when he led the club to Challenge Cup, League Leader’s Trophy, Grand Final victory and then a victory in the World Club Championship. In 2005 he became the first Coach to lead a side from outside the top two to a Grand Final success when the Bulls defeated Leeds at Old Trafford."[/i Taken from: www.bradfordbulls.co.uk/content/ ... an%20Noble What more do you want from a coach.......'" he is the ideal man, with Tony Durey at his side as he knows our youth would made the ideal partnership

Quote ="Tommy Duckfingers"You really need to do some research.... [i "A Challenge Cup appearance in his first season was followed by a comprehensive defeat of Wigan in what was to be the first of five consecutive Grand Finals. In 2003 he became the first Coach to win ‘all four cups’ in the Super League era when he led the club to Challenge Cup, League Leader’s Trophy, Grand Final victory and then a victory in the World Club Championship. In 2005 he became the first Coach to lead a side from outside the top two to a Grand Final success when the Bulls defeated Leeds at Old Trafford."[/i Taken from: www.bradfordbulls.co.uk/content/ ... an%20Noble What more do you want from a coach.......'" he is the ideal man, with Tony Durey at his side as he knows our youth would made the ideal partnership

I would say he is a very, very strong contender. His methods may be a bit outdated compared to the newest coaches from Oz, but we dont need somebody to get us into Grand Finals, we need somebody to turn things round and get the spark back - something that I have no doubt he would do.

Kear has done his job and been rewarded for it - he pulled off the escape and deserves much praise for it - but that doesnt buy him immunity for ever and ever, let him see out his time and regardless of if we are in SL or not next year its time for a change as we have gone stale in my opinion. Give him a good send off for the work he has done (and done well in the past) but I think his days should be numbered ready for a new man.

Quote ="Tommy Duckfingers"You really need to do some research.... [i "A Challenge Cup appearance in his first season was followed by a comprehensive defeat of Wigan in what was to be the first of five consecutive Grand Finals. In 2003 he became the first Coach to win ‘all four cups’ in the Super League era when he led the club to Challenge Cup, League Leader’s Trophy, Grand Final victory and then a victory in the World Club Championship. In 2005 he became the first Coach to lead a side from outside the top two to a Grand Final success when the Bulls defeated Leeds at Old Trafford."[/i Taken from: www.bradfordbulls.co.uk/content/ ... an%20Noble What more do you want from a coach.......'" FWIW my research is fine thanks. Look at the list of players that Noble inherited from Elliot, a team insedently which finished first in SL twice out of four years. He took the best team in SL at the time to their natural conclusion, what he didnt do, which he would have done if he wanted to maintain their dominance was to bring in enough new blood and let the ££ top heavy players go bit by bit, rather than all at once leaving a very average Macnamara to pick up the bits. Add onto that the fact that maguire walked into Wigan and took nobles team of losers to the title. That's why I don't rate him.

Quote ="Tommy Duckfingers"You really need to do some research.... [i "A Challenge Cup appearance in his first season was followed by a comprehensive defeat of Wigan in what was to be the first of five consecutive Grand Finals. In 2003 he became the first Coach to win ‘all four cups’ in the Super League era when he led the club to Challenge Cup, League Leader’s Trophy, Grand Final victory and then a victory in the World Club Championship. In 2005 he became the first Coach to lead a side from outside the top two to a Grand Final success when the Bulls defeated Leeds at Old Trafford."[/i Taken from: www.bradfordbulls.co.uk/content/ ... an%20Noble What more do you want from a coach.......'" FWIW my research is fine thanks. Look at the list of players that Noble inherited from Elliot, a team insedently which finished first in SL twice out of four years. He took the best team in SL at the time to their natural conclusion, what he didnt do, which he would have done if he wanted to maintain their dominance was to bring in enough new blood and let the ££ top heavy players go bit by bit, rather than all at once leaving a very average Macnamara to pick up the bits. Add onto that the fact that maguire walked into Wigan and took nobles team of losers to the title. That's why I don't rate him.

So, when the time comes, the panel of experts to pick any future coach would be Elston and Glover? Better than Peter Fox I guess!

In response to Vastmans comment about terrace coaches, I would ask the following questions :

1. Would you expect a SL coach to be able to sort the defensive structure of his team out? We have been susceptible to being caught out on the fringes for at least the last two seasons - the players have changed but the coach is the same.

2. Would you expect a SL coach to pick the right players in the right positions? Again although the players have changed, Kear has had a habit of picking players in the wrong positions or picking people on reputation (and dropping people who have done nothing wrong) even when said players are not match fit.

3. Would you expect a SL coach to be able to use the interchange bench properly? Again prior to this season, I seem to recall Blaymire a specialist full back on the bench against Leeds at Headingly and coming on after 20-25 mins and earlier this season again against Leeds two players on the bench who did not come on until after an hour - meaning the work load was not shared evenly and other players were knackered.

4. Would you expect professional RL players, a number of whom are experienced SL players or young players from good RL environments under the guidance of a SL coach to be able to execute a less predictable attacking strategy than up to 5 drives and a kick?

5. Would you expect a SL coach to have a plan B when predictable plan A is not working?

6. Would you expect a SL coach to be able to see the things us terrace coaches can see and put measures in place in training to eradicate or minimise the potential of the same problems occurring repeatedly?

IMO the answer to all is YES and if we were talking about someone other than Kear (whose past achievements seem to affect peoples views of his performance over the last 12 months) would more people on here answer the above questions in the affimative. Again IMO they would.

OK, so let me get this right - you don't rate him because he took Elliots side to the Grand Final 5 years on the bounce and won it 3 times (and had a much better record than Elliott)? Don't forget all the other trophies they won too when Nobby was coaching (many more than Elliott)

He then went to Wigan and took a team that was bottom of the leage to safety and then on to within 80 mins of the Grand Final the next year, then the year after took the side to within 4 points of a Grand Final and the same the year after?

After this he then went to a new club and put together a scratch side on (presumably) very little budget and took them to the play offs?

Deary me, there's plenty of drivel written on here but to say you don't rate him shows you are either very, very, very difficult to please or you don't really understand what you are watching.......

Two of the finest rugby brains in Britain

Firstly his first season, he broke the salary cap signing fielden, if the RFL had argued it's case better/properly they would have been adequately deducted points and relegated. Following that his team finished sixth, fourth and sixth again, with a team that maguire coached to champions, mediocre I'd say.
Secondly my point about his time at the bulls was without doubt a success, but it was one built on the success firstly of others, where I think he failed is in his ability to further develop the side he inherited from Elliot. IMO he was only able to sign high profile expensive players to fit into a side of players on increasing wages, sooner or later the salary cap was going to bite and when it did Macnamara was left holding the baby.
Your point about the crusaders is a difficult one, as I have little confidence in anything to do with crusaders being fair and above board, thousands was spent on RFL support forming much of their debt, clearly money they did not have to spend.
Perhaps if JK could spend money he did not have his record over the last couple of tears would be improved.
For me Noble is 100% not the right man for WT in our circumstances, maybe if we are in SL next year and we are awash with money he may be, but I can't see that we will be.
I don't think he is quite as good as his reputation suggests under any degree of scrutiny of that record.
Just my opinion.

I'm of the exact same opinion. In fact, I couldn't believe that there was only me who saw it like that. When he took over at Crusaders they were so poor that any improvement would appear greater than it really was. And lets be honest, it's not difficult to improve a poor performing team; maintaining and improving even further is much harder. I think thats why he left, before he got found out.

How can you possibly argue he didnt improve Elliotts side when the facts say that he did? Its a crazy argument.

The other fact is he turned Wigan into a side that went from stone cold last in the league to the final elimination 3 years on the bounce - oh how we would have loved some of that mediocracy the 3 years after we was bottom of the league.....

Also Crusaders go into admin after Nobby has left them and its his fault for spending money he didnt have, but we go into admin whilst Kear is still in charge and its nothing to do with spending money? Nice comparrison.

Another crazy argument to suggest that when the coach who follows him into a job fails (McNammara) it is down to Nobby, but yet when the coach takes over from him wins the competition its shows that Nobby was poor all along?

Surely the same could be applied to Kear and the great escape, when inherriting Tony Smiths shower of .

I would rather have PW before Noble.

its not that i dont think he improved on Elliot, its more that he inherited the best team in the league, and took them on to their natural conclusion, look at the players rosta for Elliots final season and its basically the side that dominated that era of SL.
Where his failure as a coach lies IMO was the short sighted lack of fresh blood and cutting away of the high earners before he left, hence leaving macnamara, an average coach with a much weaker squad.
Had the RFL acted correctly IMO Wigan would have been relegated, they cheated, and IMO that is not what makes a great coach.
As far as i remember the Crusaders owed the RFL for coaching costs/fees, around £700k. If he was such a great coach, why? Again in simple terms he cheated, spending money you dont have we could all be far better at our jobs if money is no barrier.
the reason macnamara failed was nobles short sightedness, the reason maguire succeeded was because he was a far better coach.
All the traits that i have listed, would be no good for a club like us, he wont be building on a world beating side, we cant afford to cheat or spend megabucks, so he is not the man for the job.
Not crazy or drivel, just my opinion based on the facts as i see them.

Didn't seem to work for the old regime here! The question is, does a coach arrange the contracts and balance the books, or is that for someone else to do. A coach should advise on which players he wants to sign and fit them into a winning side.

It wasn't just the great escape though was it, start of 2007 we were awesome and carried on his 2006 miracles. 2nd in the league after game 7 ...but then we played Huddersfield, got hammered and Kear showed the continuing weakness that should have seen him leave at the end of that year. Lack of belief and motivation.
Kear and the squad once more showed that year they have the skills but again on reaching a playoff spot later in the season a defeat or two saw us giving up and losing the last 4 games.

So did Kear "cheat" becuase he spent money he didnt have?

If JD hadn't got out of the in goal area at Bradford we would, most probably, have been relegated, if Cas hadnt fluffed it at Salford we would have certainly have been relegated - would that have made Kear a bad coach?

Didn't we turn the ball over anyway after the JD magic? but I suppose seeing a team mate do that gives you heart for the next 6 you face. Heart is a powerful motivator...

Youv'e totally lost me on the bit i've highlighted in red!


JD didn't cheat to do it did he? so it's a bit of a duff comparison really.
I dont understand what your trying to get across really, whatever you think Kear or JD or god knows who did/didn't do, it doesn't alter the fact that i don't think Noble is the messianic coach some (you) do or that he would be any good for us.
You, in your post i originally answered mentioned Millward, wasn't he the one Noble replaced at Wigan who took them to the bottom of the SL in the first place? and presumably that why you rate him so highly??
TBH i'm just getting a bit confused.

All i can really remember from that game apart from the "JD Magic" was Solomonas try and how good Latu was, the rest was a euphoric blur!!!!

Sorry, wasnt clear (just read it back and it doesnt read right, sorry). They was 2 seperate points, kear about spending money we didnt have and "cheating" was a seperate point to the JD one.

I have just reread your earlier post and I reckon I have misunderstood it and gone off on a tangent answering a point about relegation that you wasnt actually making. Ignore the JD/relegation point, I made a mistake.

Did Kear "cheat" by spending money we didnt have like you suggest Noble did?

I also suggested Millward as a potentially improvement on Kear for us - have suggested it for well over a year.

Yes Millward has got flaws in his game (as has Noble) and if we was Wigan, Huddersfield or Warrington the neither of them would be the answer, but seen as we dont have the pick of the crop we need to be sensible about who we can possibly get. It has to be somebody available and both Millward and Noble are, presumably, available.

I am not suggesting that either of them are the messiah, simply that they are probably available (and have been for a long time) and would both be an improvement on what we have at the moment.

That depends on wether or not he (JK) knew or not i suppose, and i suppose we will never know (i certainly dont know).
Im fairly certain at the time Noble knew he was overspending (hadn't Radlinski had to play for love/free, after retiring just prior to Fielden's signing because there was no room in the salary cap?) so therefore he knew what he was doing was wrong.
What i am not trying to do is compare Kear with Noble or make him out to be a better coach, just to clarify that point.

I remember Ned Catic scoring a good try as well and the massive cheer that went up when they put the Cas score on the big screen.

IMO neither are guaranteed to be better than Kear, and both or certainly Millward anyway, would be available for a reason, nobody in SL wants him.
Noble could well be waiting for a bigger club than us (or won he considers to be bigger anyway) I don't know.
If Kear is to leave, I would love to see a hungry young Aussie coach to come in.
If we are to make ground, we need new methods, hunger and someone who has the inside track on talent down under aswell as the ability to bring the best out of British talent.

If we was a mid table side looking to kick on to get to the next level (like Hudds, Wigan and Wire to a certain extent) then I agree completely - a young up and coming coach from Oz, maybe an assistat, would be the way to go without doubt - I reckon to get to that elite level the British coaches at the moment aren't good enough to do it.

Trouble is, I dont think we are near enough to that level yet, and we need to improve to be a consistent mid table side - to be like Bradford or either of the Hull clubs are what we should aim for first (you know, play offs just about every year) then after a period of stability try to get to the very top via an australian coach.