I believe from what I've heard in interview if Agar goes then Collis is able too aswell, it was the one where you had to click on a link to listen by the club.

We are probably the thickest team I have seen in 38 years of watching RL and Mathers is clueless. We never read a game or the opposition tactics. We make the same errors over and over again. We cannot play the same side next year. I won't be there if we do cos I can't stand another season of this. Side needs a shake up and a new coach. We can't just sit there for another year; this is going nowhere

The Clueless on the last tackle comes down to Tim Smith I would have to say. His last tackle kicks and other plays are awful and often have been all the time he's been with us, no matter how much he gets bigged up. How many times has he run it and we get caught on the 6th? How many crap kicks, kicks that end with a length of field try fo the opposition? All part of the dismal thickness that runs though the team

Nothing will change until the coach goes I'm afraid. For me it all comes down to his decisions, we have the players to be a top 8 team but he doesn't use them. For instance in the first half of today's match Tautai started getting fired up running hard and showing a bit of talent in what was possibly the worst 40 mins of rugby I've ever seen. Agar subbed him. Now I'm sorry and all I'm for spelling players to get the best out of them, but when there's only a handful of players on the pitch looking dangerous you do not take one of them off!

Do you think Agar tells them to knock on, pass forward, kick out on the full etc? It's those silly mistakes that have cost us points in recent games, take away those errors and we would be higher up the table!

Agar should have brought young Goulding on at half time as we were creating nothing.Tim Smith is all about doing the creative plays himself and thats no good he needs someone to help him out if not the opposition mark him out of the game and we do nothing.I was willing to give Agar a chance and hes had 2 seasons and his substitutions baffle me at times.Why bring a player in when you are lacking in one area and leave him on the bench apart from the last 10 - 15 mins.

Just be thankful he brought him on at all.... wouldn't be the first time this year we've played with 16 men.

He's too busy coming up with master strokes like playing washbrook in the halves - still it only took 2 games before he worked out that was dumb - or consistently playing vera lyne in the team while shipping out people like mariano to fev.Said it before and I will say it again any half decent coach with the squad we have currently got would have been in the 8 by now. Total disaster to give a failing coach like him a 3 year deal - unbelievable.

Any coach with a brain will come no where near this club.

Who the hell in their right mind would take our threadbare squad on into the dog fight of next season ?

You may get the odd chancer without a job or someone with very little experience but you will not attract a top coach.

Bet John Kear would

Is our squad really that good??

At the start of the season i like most, thought we would finish somewhere between 8th & 12th.
8th, much like last year if we could keep a settled side and get lucky with injuries. If not, one of the places below.

Yes we should be better than Salford and probably London, but our squad on paper (taking the rose tinted specs off) is pretty much at a similar level to Cas, Widnes, Bradford & Hull KR.

How many of our players would get taken by the sides near the top of the league to be anything other than a squad player? Kirmond definitely Amor, Aiton & Collis maybe.
I think with the budget he has had, Agar has done an ok job in his first 2 years. Im not his biggest fan and i didnt want him at the start (Daryl Powell was my choice), but he hasnt been that bad.
Yes, 1st half yesterday wasnt good, just like Bradford the other week, but over the full season, Im really not sure what people expect??

For people to claim they are not going again, not renewing season tickets etc etc is just plain daft.
Those who watched in the 60's may feel different but ive been going since the early 80's and for me we are where we have always been, a mid to lower end of the table team at best. We have the odd good year and the odd bad, this is certainly nowhere near the worst of the bad!!

The best post of recent times....common sense and reality returns!

I've watched since the fifties and it certainly is not the worst season in that time .
I agree that to 'abandon ship' now will not do the club any good at all.
Yes we are all frustrated but we are not that far off being a decent side.
Cannot believe , by the way, how people are still over critical of Lynne after that try demonstrated his potential.
The try was pure class.
I think that as he was brought in by Agar and to some people played ahead of home grown he will never get credit even if he goes on to play for England.
Some people are so blinkered and biased its not true.
Kay seems to have pace as well, so all not doom n gloom.

It was a good try, in fact it could be said it was a classic wingers try. Which is what happens when you play a natural winger on the wing rather than at centre. Who is it that has been picking him out of position all season?

Lynne took the chance well. To be fair though as it happened in front of me Cockayne needs credit too, he created the half gap space for Reece to run through. For a 70 yarder it was well taken and finished by showing his pace and determination. If Cockayne hadn't done what he did then it would not have happened. I'm not knocking Lynne, just portraying it as I saw it.

Agreed, it was a nice piece of play from Ben. He played a bit of centre in his time at Fev and I would be opposed to him and Lyne switching positions. Ben though does need to stop crabbing accross the field and thinking he is a stand off though. That he definately ain't!

Can't be having any of that on here

The killer passes need to stop too.

Ben isnt a centre IMO. I understand he gets a free role but he should be on the wing in defence, not much bothered about attack as the ball rarely gets thrown out to him there. Should Fox be brought in and Cockayne dropped with Kay on the otherside?

I think Lyne has shown if he has a future at the club then it should be on the wing. Both slots may be up for grabs next year.

There were a few glimmers of hope. I thought Goulding looked interesting when he came on - he tried a few things that we haven't really seen before; those attacking kicks that almost came up trumps were great attempts and if he featured regularly, that aspect of his game could take some pressure off Smith.

Kay for me is a dead set replacement for Foxy - he doesn't necessarily make the metres that Foxy does when running into traffic, but he appears to be as good or better at just about everything else; he holds his position in defence, can take a high ball and is way quicker. And that's before he even gets near SO, which is his actual position.

Tautai showed much better ball security and some of his runs were real barnstormers - there were several occasions when they couldn't put him down. I'm guessing that his short stints are about fitness and conditioning - hopefully he'll be on the park for longer next season.

Big Ali's reverse flick out the back of a 3 man tackle was a lovely touch - there's life in the old dog yet!

Lyne finally opened his legs and showed a bit of what he can do when he backs himself; more of that would be welcome.

Amor was immense and Kirmo, despite looking a bit jaded, made 2 try savers in one set, the first one having tracked back 40 metres to get involved.

We're going to finish about where I expected, but I agree there are a few players who need to be replaced if we're going to play a part in next season's do or die relegation scrap.

I agree with bren and if Kay put abit more bulk on he would do what foxy did well. If Lee Smith is staying then stick Lyne on the wing and thats our back 4 done IMO.
Although Mathers played bad yesterday, I could tell he was injured with how heavily the arm was strapped up.

Kay looked ok, but for me he is definately not the long term answer for a wing spot. As for been better under the high ball than Foxy, on yesterdays showing im not sure???
Having seen him play various positions for the academy/reserves/Donny, i personally think he has looked his best at 6. Good enough to play SO at the top level im not sure?

IF RM was that injured yesterday, why the hell was he playing, in a game that based on the 1st half performance (and the league table) meant pretty much nothing?

There's only one way to find out I guess - stick him in there next week and see how he gets on.

I thought it was tough on Foxy being singled out as, in my opinion, we seem to leak more trys down Cockaynes wing.
Any knowledgible statisticians about?