Somebody at the game last night said it was Wigan's longest run without a league win for 100 years or something. 8 Super League games without a win now.

Does anyone have the exact stat on this as surely there must have been a worse run in 1979-80 relegation season wasn't there ?

Worst winless streak in league games since 1903.

The relegation season, our worst winless streak was 7 games. We've gone 8 league games without a win (2 draws, 6 losses).

I hate stats like that. Taken without context it looks appalling, but we all know the reason for the run.

Forget the context the cold hard facts are that we haven't won a super league game in eight attempts regardless of who played and who didn't

Sorry, auto-correct making me look like a happy clapper.

I meant it's the worst Wigan team in 100 years!

Exactly right.

There's been some poor moments in that run but there's plenty of reasons behind it and I doubt any of our other teams who had similar runs had as many problems nor would they have won a World Club Challenge with still not much like their first choice team.

While I won't deny that these stats make difficult reading, it's important to remember that we already have one trophy in the cabinet and are only 80 mins from Wembley.

Theoretically, we're only two wins away from having a more successful season than last year, even if we don't make the top 4.

I suppose it's all about perspectives.

So mid table maybe in the middle 8's, win a glorified Charity Shield game and get to a CC final is a better season than finishing in the top 4 and a chance of winning the GF.

Perspective is we lose on Friday to Widnes we will be in with the shout of a relegation fight.

How is that for perspective. Never mind get to CC final and all will be more than happy for this shambles to carry on next season. And it will.

Injuries are now back and we had the same as the Giants out last night and they are not good enough for the top 4. And neither are we.

Nothing will ever be as bad as losing 70-0 one week to Leeds and then 75-0 to Saints the week after

Did I miss a memo - Sunday innit?
Agree with the sentiment though, personnally I'm losing patience with the lot of 'em. And there must be some reason for the appaling injury catalogue, someone's not looking hard enough.
I'd say we have to win the next three or we could well be looking at 9th.
World beaters to religation fodder is a headline I don't want to see.

My memo got a mis type your right.

Well, that is definitely one perspective.

You're entitled to it of course, but I wouldn't give up quite so early.

If someone had offered me a Challenge Cup win and a WCC win at the start of the season I would have snatched their hand off.

I'll guarantee we will not lose to Widnes on Friday!!

What about Sunday

Hit the nail on the head. Things need to change.

Other then injuries taking a running jump and the odd minor tweak (that even the best side of all time would look for) what needs to change?

It can't be much considering we sit here with the Grand Final and World Club Challenge in the cabinet and have a chance to win the Challenge cup which will mean we hold all the major trophies we play for (discounting the tea tray) at one time.

Dear me its time to forget about past glories,they are now part of the clubs rich history time to move,i know its still current but for only a matter of weeks,it really is time,its getting as boring as Treble winners 2015 was for Leeds.

What needs to change?

A decent half,cover for the centres a long hard look at the prop forward situation for meNaverrette wont make it,FPN doesnt seem bothered,Clubby god love him is more machine than man and thast just for starters.

The squad was for me,always unbalanced Tommy was a mistake sorry he just is utterly wasted playing where he is,we need an 80 minute hooker surely,theres cearly something not right with Budgie and the rise of Marshall and Davies adds even more lop sided aspect to the squad.

To me the WCC hid a lot of the issues,Salford the week before had exposed Wigan and its rather shaky defence the week following Widnes again exposed the defence with the thrilling game over at their place its been the story of the season if we're being honest with ourselves.

The point is we are no way guaranteed a CC final spot, let alone a win. I can't believe you would snatch anyone's hand off to see our worst league run since 1903, even allowing for our injury situation. I don't care what else we win, it's seeing us wallowing in the lower league positions that's ruining this season for me. Eight league games without a win is unacceptable in any circumstances.

It's been one of the worst seasons for injuries I can remember. Without that we'd still be comfortably in the top 4. As far as I'm concerned we've coped with it better than most teams would. Sometimes just plain old bad luck means you don't have the season you want, but with the possibility of a CC trophy still on the cards I think we need to look on the bright side.

This is a very short sighted opinion IMO. At the start of the season we played fast, open and slick rugby league. We blew Salford away and had the game won by half time and took players off (rightly) with an eye on the WCC. We were awesome against Cronulla and the Widnes game was always going to be tough on tired bodies after such a big game.
The season started to go down hill when so many players got hurt and that's just tough luck. I don't believe for a second that our training methods are to blame as most of our injuries have been collision injuries.

The players you refer to, Leuluai was superb at the start when he had experienced 3/4s and second rows running great lines. He guided us around the park very well and that allowed Williams to wreak havoc. He broke his jaw and came back after 4 weeks with no experience outside him. Navarette is a very big, young prop who looks great going forward. Yes he needs to work on his defence and fitness but he's a project player, just like Gelling was. I'm not as critical of FPN as others. When he's on his game, he's really good but I agree we need more out of him. As for Clubb, I'm not sure how u can be critical of him? The lad had vertebrae removed from his neck following a crusher tackle and has now had a kidney removed due to an unrelated illness! He's one of the best props in the league when he's fit and he's back next week. I think you need to reserve judgement for a few more weeks and see how he performs when he's match fit!

Our position isn't great but I agree with SW, there are legitimate reasons for it. Tomkins and Bateman will be match fit in a few weeks, if Burgess is carrying a knock it isn't serious enough to keep him out and I'm just glad he's playing for us and not against us!

I'm not sure much needs to change going into next season. We are champions and world champions, still in the CC and top 4 is still mathematically possible (although unlikely).
A bit more luck with injuries and we'd have got to the GF in a canter.

@bigredwarrior..

Not qouting our conversation as itll get too big..

Right first things first in what way was i being critical of Clubb? looking at my post i perhaps should have seperated him from the other two i mentioned,yes i should have,so appolgies for that,but how much can he do though he's 30 now and has to start looking long term and keeping himself healthy i fear if he does something irreversable thats all,the man is solid as a rock and has been missed.

I stand by my comments about Naverette and FPN though,big frank in particular has disappionted time and again.

I feel you're being at best disingenius about Salford,true on that freezing cold afternoon Wigan had a great first half but then they simply crumbled as Salford found their footing,a footing thathas led them to second place,its unfair and simply untrue to say they came back that afternoon because Wigan rested players.

Tommy had=s forme,and again i respect your opinion utterly average,quite who hes aiming the high kicks at im not sure yet time and again match after match he hoists them up,its the same week after week,but i always thought he was a better hooker than half but thats just me.

I dont know what caused the injuries and we will never know,training,black cats,and frankly its a subject done to death,the only thing for me you dont,under any circumstances sign injured players as the club did last season with Sam,look at him now he looks very nearly fully fit *whisper it*whareas last season he simply wasnt,so maybe some good has come out of the wire game last season.

I dont think Wane should go,but i do think some change is needed and stand by what i say in my first post,but i just wanted to claraify my comment on Clubby and well you get to thinking about other stuff.

As I mentioned there are some tweaks that are needed and you've nailed some right there but when people are sitting there and saying 'things need to change', I don't think they mean some as simple as changing a couple of players. I think they think there's more deep rooted problems but imo there's no major problems other then that we've not been able get our best side or anything approaching that on the field in enough games. Us having a better side over the past two weeks (although still missing 5 starting players on Friday) was never going to be a magic fix. Lads aren't match fit, others still look like they're carrying knocks and they still need to gel as a team. They will get there though because they're too good not to.

Am i happy with how the past couple of months have gone? Clearly not. Do I appreciate the reasons behind it? Without a doubt. Do I think there needs to be wholesale changes? Not at all. Do I think we could tweak the squad? Without question. We have three players who are really starting hookers (Powell, McIlorum and Leuluai) and we need a scrum half but other then that there's nothing major needs changing.

I totally agree that Salford upped their game but it was like our game v Hull FC a few weeks ago. We came back and the score looked respectable but we were never gonna win it and neither were Salford. The beauty of a forum is differing opinions and perspectives and I have no issues with any of what you said.

Last season I was one of the most critical Wigan fans you could meet but I have learned my lesson. We are nowhere near to where we need to be but there are reasons for it. Now that we have more of a senior squad to pick from I expect a big improvement and if it doesn't come, then I'll be critical again. We need to keep the ball and stop giving penalties away. If we do that, we'll not lose many games!