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| Another example of why rl will be in the shadows of ru. Sam's arrival plastered on sky and headline on BBC news.
Sickening whilst rl does its publicity on YouTube.
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| Agreed. It amazes me sometimes. On BBC yesterday morning they had a Sale fan who was moaning that he couldn't get tickets for the next RU World Cup and a RU representative saying they were doing a ballot for tickets!
Our game (IMO) is far superior to RU yet we're miles behind them in every sense!
I tweeted the RFL last week saying they need to try to do something to encourage our elite players to stay in SL and if they can't, at least to stay in RL. Their response was, players come and go!! They said we need to concentrate on developing young players and that the teams who have won the GF recently have the best youth set ups. I replied by saying that there is more to RL than the GF and we also need to focus on retention of those players.
They said throwing money at the game and big pay rises doesn't help anybody which razzed me right off. I said it's not done RU or the NRL any harm and I told them I'm 44 years old and never seen us win a series involving the Aussies. I got no reply to that!
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| yea I watched this too, they tried to make him say it had been his ambition to play in the RU world cup. Clearly it hadnt, just there for a challenge and the cash.
Interesting to see they class Farrell as a dual code failure, maybe if he had gone at 25, rather than being at the twilight of his career and crocked.
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| A couple of things tickle me about this whole charade. Firstly, the media are blatantly creaming themselves about his arrival, which clearly says they appreciate what a talent he is, yet how many of them bothered to report on his exploits whilst he was in the NRL?
Secondly, there have been numerous pieces recently looking at previous converts from League, and many have branded the likes of Tomkins, Farrell, Paul and Vainikolo as flops. Granted, none of them set the world on fire, but every single one of them won England caps. How on earth can you be a flop if you get selected by the national team? It's especially baffling as nearly all of them crossed over when they were past their prime, some by quite some way.
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| The main reason they took Farrell was to get Owen,
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| Dyson will be happy.
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| Farrell also played in a world cup where an unfancied England got to the final so I think it is slightly harsh to call him a flop.
I think that Sam is a better player than those listed at the time they went to RU so there is a greater weight of expectation there.
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| I thought that Justin Webb on BBC Radio 4's today programme, was fawning so much over "Slamming Sam" that he was going to do something unnecessary in his underpants.....
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| Quote ="Wigan Peer"I thought that Justin Webb on BBC Radio 4's today programme, was fawning so much over "Slamming Sam" that he was going to do something unnecessary in his underpants.....'"
Rather more sensible discussion on 5Live - Bath will use him where they want/need, but that could well conflict with how the England squad is shaped.
Pointed out that Billy Whiz made the England team in something like 4 months, but nobody's putting their lunch money on SB repeating it.
(but still absolutely zero mention of the match on Sunday)
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| Quote ="CyberPieMan"Rather more sensible discussion on 5Live - Bath will use him where they want/need, but that could well conflict with how the England squad is shaped.
Pointed out that Billy Whiz made the England team in something like 4 months, but nobody's putting their lunch money on SB repeating it.
(but still absolutely zero mention of the match on Sunday)'"
Maybe they will, but be honest, I don't care if they use him as a tea boy.....
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| Farrell is so much a failure he's been the England assistant coach for years now.
The BBC News man is a soccer man. He hasn't a clue about Rugby whether it's League or Union.
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| Quote ="Wigan Peer"Maybe they will, but be honest, I don't care if they use him as a tea boy.....'"
TBH - it's all a bit of a love-in isn't it?
We've got exactly 12 months of this 'til the WC finishes a year tomorrow - then stand by for SPOTY if the rah-rahs get anywhere near the final - gods help us if they actually win again.
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| I was thinking earlier today that Burgess could/should be in the running for Sports Personality of the Year. I can only think of Rory Mcllroy that's had a really good year, as an individual, with the Ryder Cup team a shoe in for team prize. Surely Burgess should make the shortlist seeing as he's just won the World Player of the Year gong in addition to his GF win?
If he did, I wonder if he'd be branded as a League player or Union?
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| Quote ="CyberPieMan"TBH - it's all a bit of a love-in isn't it?
We've got exactly 12 months of this 'til the WC finishes a year tomorrow - then stand by for SPOTY if the rah-rahs get anywhere near the final - gods help us if they actually win again.'"
Only blessing is that the Rugby Union World Cup is on ITV. I'd imagine the old farts in their tweed jackets will have to get their tv's tuned-in to pick ITV up for the first time.
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| Quote ="adi"I was thinking earlier today that Burgess could/should be in the running for Sports Personality of the Year. '"
Nah - won't be on anyone's radar. It'll be Lewis Hamilton if he wins the Scalextric championship or one of the gymnastics team from earlier in the year or I'd actually have a couple of quid on Jo Pavey or McIlroy.
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| Quote ="Paul Youane"the old farts in their tweed jackets will have to get their tv's tuned-in to pick ITV up for the first time.'" won't they have it there already for Downton, or the re-runs of Midsomer Murders?
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| Quote ="Father Ted"Farrell is so much a failure he's been the England assistant coach for years now.
The BBC News man is a soccer man. He hasn't a clue about Rugby whether it's League or Union.'"
Another reason why they got him, they never really wanted him as a player, but did a typical " business" deal.
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| Incredible amount of publicity generated. He got in one day more publicity in this country than he's had in his entire career. The difference in levels of coverage between the two codes is hardly fair but Union provides an international scene which League can't offer at the minute. Israel Folau is a classic example: League is bigger in Oz than Union, but because of the better international scene it was worthwhile for him to jump ship.
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| Sam Burgess will be back in the NRL for the start of the 2016 season - I'd put my house on it. This is the worst thought out most ill conceived transfer in the history of Professional Rugby Union.
Sam hasn't played the game, he is RL through and through. Looking at the interviews prior to the GF, he is going for an easy life. He fancies a bit of lower intensity sport for a while with the possibility of some glory and plenty of dosh.
But the thing is - learning a completely new game in a matter of months in order to get in the World Cup squad will be next to impossible. He won't get in the Bath team for starters let alone the England squad. They don't even know where to play him!
The thing is it'll turn out to be good for us. This car crash in the making will put Union off raiding our game for the foreseeable future.
I'd be interested in the views of anyone who actually knows something about Union (I admit I barely watch it). Does anyone disagree with me - do you think he will be successful - and why?
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| Quote ="Murray"Incredible amount of publicity generated. He got in one day more publicity in this country than he's had in his entire career. The difference in levels of coverage between the two codes is hardly fair but Union provides an international scene which League can't offer at the minute. Israel Folau is a classic example: League is bigger in Oz than Union, but because of the better international scene it was worthwhile for him to jump ship.'"
To add to the money there is also the comfort in knowing that League will roll out the red carpet if Union does not quite work out for them.
How many players would make the switch if going back to league was not an option?
I don't blame players for looking after themselves but its frustrating from a supporters point of view.
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| Quote ="Aboveusonlypie"Sam Burgess will be back in the NRL for the start of the 2016 season - I'd put my house on it. This is the worst thought out most ill conceived transfer in the history of Professional Rugby Union.
Sam hasn't played the game, he is RL through and through. Looking at the interviews prior to the GF, he is going for an easy life. He fancies a bit of lower intensity sport for a while with the possibility of some glory and plenty of dosh.
But the thing is - learning a completely new game in a matter of months in order to get in the World Cup squad will be next to impossible. He won't get in the Bath team for starters let alone the England squad. They don't even know where to play him!
The thing is it'll turn out to be good for us. This car crash in the making will put Union off raiding our game for the foreseeable future.
I'd be interested in the views of anyone who actually knows something about Union (I admit I barely watch it). Does anyone disagree with me - do you think he will be successful - and why?'"
I have watched Union all my life and got into League 12/13 years ago when I moved to Wigan and much prefer league. The main reason why most league players don't have the impact of say Jason Robinson/Chris Ashton who in my opinion are the only players to successfully make the switch is down to space and time. Robinson/Ashton went into the same positions in RU as they played RL and that allowed them time and space. The likes of Farrell, Tomkins, Harris etc all went into positions on the gain line where they have no space or time. In RL you get 10meteres all the time every time in RU the hindmost foot. I am not convinced Burgess will make an impact at centre, and I have never understood this mentality that second rowers in league make good centres.... they are generally not quick enough nor have soft enough hands to craft openings. Time will tell
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| Quote ="Aboveusonlypie"Sam Burgess will be back in the NRL for the start of the 2016 season - I'd put my house on it. This is the worst thought out most ill conceived transfer in the history of Professional Rugby Union. '" Can someone put a marker on this post for reference in 12-18 months' time please (talk about setting yourself up for a battering ).
I don't see any reason he won't get into the Baarth team (as prop?), but I'd be amazed if he got anywhere near the England squad on merit (I suspect they might draft him in as some publicity gimmick regardless of whether he's ready though).
The problem he's got is that he's got to buck the trend, there's only Jason Robinson who's made the switch successfully - Ashton hasn't really pulled up trees lately & his early promise seems to have gone. Plus there's plenty of existing talent & Lancaster isn't exactly scratching around trying to pull a squad together.
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| Quote ="Carneys Cover"I have watched Union all my life and got into League 12/13 years ago when I moved to Wigan and much prefer league. The main reason why most league players don't have the impact of say Jason Robinson/Chris Ashton who in my opinion are the only players to successfully make the switch is down to space and time. Robinson/Ashton went into the same positions in RU as they played RL and that allowed them time and space. The likes of Farrell, Tomkins, Harris etc all went into positions on the gain line where they have no space or time. In RL you get 10meteres all the time every time in RU the hindmost foot. I am not convinced Burgess will make an impact at centre, and I have never understood this mentality that second rowers in league make good centres.... they are generally not quick enough nor have soft enough hands to craft openings. Time will tell'"
That's interesting. I can't see him playing in the forwards because he'd have to learn a completely new set of skills, so it must be the backs. But as you say, he probably isn't quick enough.
Joel Tomkins' experience is evidence that it can work (to an extent). Joel was good enough to be picked for the national team, and that took some doing. But I don't think he was considered an option for the World Cup, hence his return to us. I don't think he'd have come back otherwise.
Do you think Sam has a realistic chance of success?
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| Quote ="CyberPieMan"Can someone put a marker on this post for reference in 12-18 months' time please (talk about setting yourself up for a battering
).
I don't see any reason he won't get into the Baarth team (as prop?), but I'd be amazed if he got anywhere near the England squad on merit (I suspect they might draft him in as some publicity gimmick regardless of whether he's ready though).
The problem he's got is that he's got to buck the trend, there's only Jason Robinson who's made the switch successfully - Ashton hasn't really pulled up trees lately & his early promise seems to have gone. Plus there's plenty of existing talent & Lancaster isn't exactly scratching around trying to pull a squad together.'"
Ashton has more tries for England than any other active player, and all of the other so called flops played several times for England. Granted, none reached Robinson levels, but I'd hardly call selection for England being a flop.
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| Quote ="CyberPieMan"Can someone put a marker on this post for reference in 12-18 months' time please (talk about setting yourself up for a battering
).
I don't see any reason he won't get into the Baarth team (as prop?), but I'd be amazed if he got anywhere near the England squad on merit (I suspect they might draft him in as some publicity gimmick regardless of whether he's ready though).
'"
Are you serious - as a prop???
Although I don't watch union much, it can't have changed that much since I played at school. Not in a million years will SB be played at prop.
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