I get what you’re saying but if we applied that same thought process, Escare should start before Hardaker. We brought Sammut in for a reason and he has to be given a chance to prove himself otherwise bringing him in was pointless. I am in the same boat as you and I wasn’t particularly chuffed when we announced his signature but I’m prepared to give him a fair crack and in order to get a fair crack, he has to play.

Not being a training ground stalker I wouldn't know but if Lam was running with Williams and Sammut in pre-season wouldn't it make sense to get them together again asap ?

The attendance was 5.5% up on last years home game v Leeds!!

AND

4% on the first home game at the DW v Widnes, who brought more fans then than Leeds did on Friday hth.

But that game was on a Thursday night mid-season. Let's not try and dress it up as anything other than poor.

Yep, probably best part of £100k short in what IL had hoped for in gate receipts.

There's enough people on here and other social media dressing things that aren't poor up as poor, why not try and do things the other way for a change?

That attendance is in line and or better than the Home Leeds attendances we were getting in 2000/2001/2002/2003 when we had some of the best players from all over the world, proof that things weren't always better and bringing very expensive stars over doesn't always improve the crowds.

If we were to get a 20k crowd on Sunday there will be some people dressing that up as Bad - When it will be as good or better than what we have done in the past and/or what Leeds/Saints etc have achieved at their Home Grounds i.e. Headingley or Langtree pk

My hands still haven't thawed out from that game against Widnes!

How about we do neither and just call a spade a spade?

I certainly don't talk the game down for the sake of it. Yes the sport will have peaks and troughs but I don't think its unreasonable to hope that the sport's latest relaunch would result in a boost in attendances.

Anything over 20k on Sunday would be great.

This talk of a ‘relaunch’ makes me laugh.
What’s been relaunched? What’s been changed? The league structure? In that case we see a relaunch every 3 or 4 years.

In my case it’s the constant relaunches which has bored me to tears and one of the reasons I’ve gone from season tickets and 95% of away games until circa 2012, to a maximum 2 or 3 games a season last year.

Away from the league ‘issues’ and back to Wigan, as a general question related to all this, whatever happened to efforts like ‘The Big One’? Do the (much cut) marketing team come up with events like this now?

I don't think you fully do get what I'm saying as you're discussion is off the mark.
Cronk is an obvious improvement on any half in the UK, he has the pedigree and success to support that, at the highest level playing origin and winning world cups and NRL GF, the list goes on. So yes of course I've have him playing our halves.
Again it isn't the same thought process to select Escare over Hardaker. Hardakers ability, stats MOS award etc is way above that of Escare. Escare last season wasn't even a starting member of our 13 when we went on such a run, it was Sam Tomkins who was our starting full back.

Can we say the same about Sammut? Does he record, credentials or anything state he should warrant a place over our halfbacks who went undefeated through the playoffs and won the GF? No absolutely not. How would they react to be dropped after only losing 1 game in god knows how many to Sammut? Who, if it weren't for Wigan wouldn't probably be even playing RL at all! Or at very most be in the lower leagues.
I don't mind the signing, but he's no Cronk or Hardaker, to compare him to either is just silly.

For me, he has to earn his place in this team, it would be a crime to Tommy, Williams and/or Powell for him to step above them.

Lam said from day 1 we need to bring in a half and he’s done exactly that. It might not be the one some people wanted but he’s a half. He’s trained pre season alongside Williams and none us us know how he’s performed but I’d say it’s safe to assume he’d have been playing had he not been banned and that Leuluai would be at 9. Powell May get a bench spot at best.
I’m fairly confident we’ll see him start soon and be given a run to prove himself.

Why do Williams, Tommy and or Powell deserve to be dropped for Sammut? Look at their record in the last god knows how many matches?

There was no point in buying Sammut unless we were going to give him a shot. Unless it's being suggested that he's been brought in purely as injury cover, which hardly seems realistic, especially as we have promising youngsters coming through.

Serious question, this. Not an attempt to trap you or anything ... but why have changes in the basic structure of the game caused you to stop watching Wigan?

Why has tinkering with the format bored you so much that Wigan are now paying the price?

The Wigan experience hasn't changed a great deal. With the exception of the odd blip year like 2017, they've continued to compete at the highest level the UK game has and still don't charge extortionate prices. From a fans' perspective, there've been lots of trophies, the cherry and white legends rolls on etc.

Surely you can see that a key problem the club is facing at present is fans who find reasons not to attend?

Williams and Leuluai don’t deserve to be dropped at all. Powell is the weaker of the 3 players mentioned in my view although he works his socks off and in no way should he been seen as a scapegoat of any kind. However,

Leuluai is a better scrum half than Powell.
Leuluai is a better hooker than Powell.
Leuluai is a better hooker than he is a scrum half.
Williams is a better half back than both Powell and Leuluai

We have yet to see what Sammut can do but Lam brought him saying from day 1 that we need a half back.

I agree the run last year and winning the grand final was excellent for the club but it doesn’t mean we can’t improve on it. Sammut might not be your cup of tea but he must be Lam’s or he would never have brought him to the club. We need to see how we go with Sammut & Williams at 6 & 7 with Leuluai at 9 and Powell on the bench. If it doesn’t improve us, we can bring Powell back in and Sammut provides injury cover.

Tommy was blowing out his backside Friday - At his age understandable
Asking him to make 58 tackles like Powell does every game won't help us!
In the current climate having a 9 that can play 80 minutes and make 50+ tackles a game is invaluable - Especially as he's covering a lot of our front Row deficiencies in the tackling department.
I know people go on about him not scooting or being creative etc, but our Points for doesn't seem to suffer too much compared to other teams, the halves and 13 make a pretty good job of that.

I'm not against the Sammutt signing and agree that at some point he will have a big part to play in our season, but for now especially with his suspension he may just need to bide his time.
And I suspect when he does come in it will be for Tommy at first in games against a London type team for example - Just to keep Tommy fresh for what will surely be his last season?
Another reason to stick with Powell at 9 (Cue some experts saying that's not a reason to stick with Powell - Fair enough, go sign another 9 then, but until we do it's quite clear that the last 2 coaches have preferred Powell at 9 for now).

Matt Parcell at Leeds is apparently surplus to requirements, might be worth a shot

I’m not convinced the last 2 coaches preferred Powell at 9 though. I think they realised he was just not good enough at 7 and we got more out of him at 9 and had little option but to play him there to facilitate Tommy going to 7. I believe Tommy is a better hooker than Powell.

None of the 3 deserve or should be dropped. Considering our winning record. It would be a disgrace for any of them to be dropped for Sammut. You keeping talking about approving, and I agree we can improve on the halves, but currently Sammut from his record and calibre in comparison to any of the 3 discussed does not deserve to leapfrog them in the pecking order. Not a chance. What a terrible message that would send to the rest of the squad.

And for Sammut as a signing? I question it, don't forget we know for a fact he was at LEAST 3rd choice, we know we chased Hastings then Lachlan Lam. I honestly think they offered Sammut a low contract, of which Sammut jumped at, as it's a golden opportunity to keep playing for a living, in this case with the champs.

Everything needs to be in context.

From what you’re saying no player should ever be dropped because it would “send a terrible message to the squad” what you’re forgetting however is last season Sam Tomkins took over game management and the kicking side of the game, 2 things which neither Tommy ot Powell are any good at, and from what I’ve seen Sammut looks like he can organise us round the park

No I'm not saying that at all. Please read my posts more carefully before wrongly putting words in my mouth.

You've misunderstood the point.

I also have reservations about Sammut. However, I’m prepared to give him a fair chance to prove himself.
We can’t say really compare him to players operating in SL as we haven’t seen him at that level in our squad yet. Look at Bullock. A player who we released and brought back from lower leagues and after 2 games is arguably one of our best forwards.

My point is purely that at the end of last season, the vast majority of us wanted us to bring in a scrum half. We have done so and he deserves a chance to succeed or to fall flat on his face. We don’t know what Lam sees in him, or how he is in training. If Lam thinks he deserves a go, I’ll back his judgment. That said, I think it’ll be the same 17 on Sunday.

I do see your point. I just think there's a bigger picture. Sammut should earn his place in the team, there's no justification to have him leapfrog the others who are part of a winning team. The 3 in discussion don't deserve to be dropped.

How can he earn his place if he isn’t given a chance to play? We shouldn’t wait until there is a serous injury to a player before giving him a shot.
I’d also argue that there is no need for anybody to be dropped from the 17. I’d give Powell a bench spot.

Like everyone else. Like TT or any of the younger lads coming through.
You pick your best team, if people are performing you can't just drop them, if the team is winning, especially to make way for someone who has no right to leapfrog the others.