As aboveus says, at least Wigan have made a real effort to bring youngsters through (to the benefit ultimately of other SL clubs, as well as us). Most SL coaches don't seem to have the faith in their youth that SW does.

Anyway, the only ones on that list I really rate are Walsh (always liked him at the Panthers) and Carney. And Carney, anyway, in my view should never have been let into SL. Why should we take the rejects that (even) the NRL think are unacceptable?

The NRL haven't actually banned him though after Cronulla sacked him for a leaked social media photo that showed him urinating in his own mouth, no other NRL club offered him a deal.

I suppose the simple fact is that whilst we may not particularly like him and whilst we don't rate him very highly as a role model, he is free to work here. And the bottom line on this is - Super League is far inferior to the NRL, so if a player as good as him becomes available, someone will offer him a deal.

I am looking forward to seeing him play and I hope, just like Joel Monaghan did, that he manages to turn over a new leaf. Though I think you'll get short odds on him not lasting too long at Les Cats as he does seem to be a lost cause.

We took some frightful stick from over the hill about us playing with two overseas halfbacks around the times of Barrett and Leuluai but in truth I can't blame Saints. They produce as many young players as anyone pretty much and haven't had much luck on the young halfback front.

Saints and Catalans have the best halves for me but I'm happy with our lot especially the options and depth we have.

And like Gelling...............

The NRL may not have banned Carney, but they would surely have had to approve any contract with a new club, and, as Blake Ferguson and Russell Packer have found out, this is not (rightly) a rubber-stamping affair. Joel Monaghan was a bit of a different case, and, as you say, he has applied himself well at Warrington. Carney has had plenty of 'last' chances.

And if SL is as inferior to the NRL as some suggest, it's hard to imagine why the like of Asotasi and Pettybourne weren't instant world-beaters over here. Whereas in fact...

It's not that hard to imagine at all.

Asotasi came over for one last payday, underestimated the challenge and couldn't adapt to Warrington's style after the ultra conservative approach of the Rabbitohs.

Pettybourne played his NRL career as a second rower. After his success playing prop in the World Cup SW played him there exclusively. However, in hindsight he was probably played out of position.

More instructive of the relative merits of the two leagues might be the case of Luke Walsh. Journeyman pro with Penrith, nowhere near representative honours in spite of NSW losing run (before this season), yet lauded over here (rightly) as the standout scrum half in Super League. In his time the likes of Pearce, Maloney, Carney, Soward, Kimmorley, Jamie Lyon, Wallace, Campese and Trent Barrett were all picked at half back for NSW.

Wasn't Luke Walsh in the top 10 of the vote for the Dally M player of the year in 2013?

I remember reading that when he got installed as a 50/1 shot for man of steel.

Luke Walsh was in the top 10 of Dally M voting in 2013, joint 7th I think. Hardly a "journeyman pro" status mate.

It isn't nice to think about but I must admit the Walsh & Burns partnership has the potential to be top quality in modern day SL standards. A relative of mine who lives in Sydney and is an avid Penrith Panthers fan was telling me about how well they clicked with each other in their 3 years playing together at 6 & 7 a few years ago.

Although I worry about the hole that Blake Green's absence leaves for us I am genuinely excited about George Williams. Although he is young, the rate of improvement shown last year was superb and he could really go to the next level with the starting spot. Throw in Matty Smith who has improved massively to become a top organising halfback and a pivotal part of our team; we have a really good, all English mix.

Hopefully, now Williams is playing 6 as opposed to 9 he won't be doing as much defensive work and he'll avoid the burn out he seemed to have midway through last season. We can always put Powell or Hampshire in if he is due a rest.

Exciting times!

Ok. Poor choice of words. The point remains. He's the best half back in Super League but didn't get near the Aussie or NSW rep teams did he. Not knocking him. But the poster was suggesting that Super League is on a par with the NRL I was using the example to illustrate the relative strengths of the competitions. Which I think you know anyway.

In all honesty mate I hadn't read the full thread so probably didn't take the comment in context. I just saw that comment whilst scanning through.

Looking forward to see how Daryl Clarke goes this year.

He got a lot of attention last year and to be fair I had not really taken much notice. However towards the back end of the year it was pointed out that he shows a lot in attacking from the ruck, but does he have other elements to his game? With a move to a new club will he flourish or will he flounder. Also how will that impact on Warrington as in Daryl and Higham they have 2 similar styled hookers.

Were as when they had monaghan you could argue that they had 2 different styles to throw at teams.

Surely Todd Carney is the best half back in SL? I'm looking forward to seeing him play.
Clark will be interesting as he's now a fish in a big pond. Wire look strong with great talent and strength in depth. Russell looked good last year maybe he'll kick on in 2015.
Ryan Hampshire is a very exciting player and can't wait to see how he goes this year. Tautai's always looked talented, it will be good to see how he goes in a better team with better players around him.
No particular player stands out at Saints but with Longy coaching their backs and halves they should be very much improved and different this year.

No player stands out? In Luke Walsh and James Roby we have two of the best players in Super League. Surely you aren't that blinkered that you can't acknowledge that?

Ps I don't feel we need that much improvement and difference in all honesty and Cunningham won't be looking to make huge changes. We did OK last year.

To be clear: I wouldn't go so far as to say that SL is on a par with the NRL; what I would say it that the top SL sides (like Wigan) are competitive with the best NRL teams, but the overall standard in the NRL is clearly higher. As for Luke Walsh, I've always liked him, I did at the Panthers. But regardless of whether the NRL is "better", I do think that English clubs generally play a more attacking style than the defence-minded NRL. Because of this, I thought Walsh would suit SL. And he has.

Roby is Roby and does what he does. Wigan and Wire know how to handle him.
The Walsh/Burns combo looks good. Walsh has to hit the top by staying injury free.
Still reckon Longy's coaching will have a greater effect than either of those two.
With Manu, Soliola and Laffranchi gone that really could affect the pack, so how the halves and backs perform will depend on how the pack goes, as with all teams.

Know how to handle him? That's genuinely funny. Good one mate!

Laffranchi won't be a miss at all. We have brought in Vea and Luke Thompson has huge potential. Don't worry about us, we'll be fine

In the League Express, Ian Lenagan said he felt this is the best squad he has had at Wigan since his tenure began. Can't say I agree but interesting to read the comment.

In truth Roby has had a pretty quiet time of things against a Wigan side that has clearly targeted him in the past 2-3 seasons but he looked back to his very best towards the back end of last year.

I agree on Laffranchi, awful player in his time at Saints but Soliola and Manu are big losses and it's far from certain a player like Vea can plug that gap. There seems an air of confidence over St Helens way and why not but I see a real weakness in that back row and it's an area I think Wigan especially can exploit. Vea is unproven, LMS has always been rocks or diamonds, Wilkin is solid enough and Young Thompson, whilst a cracking young talent will get far more attention this year.

The quality in the rest of the side is high though and I see you going close to all the trophies.

I think most Saints fans have been saying we'd like an extra forward in an ideal world but I think we'll be OK.

You're right about LMS, he's one of the most inconsistent and frustrating players I've ever seen. What I would say is that most of his poor games have come at prop and his better games have been in the back row. It's expected he won't play much at prop this year so hopefully we'll see the best of him for larger chunks of the season.

I think 2011 we had our best squad, full of experience.

S Tomkins
Charnley
J Tomkins
Carmont
Richards
Finch
Deacon
Mossop
Leuluai
Coley
Hansen
Hoffman
O'Loughlin

Lima
Farrell
McIlorum
Hock

Most looking forward to - seeing how Rocky has progressed.

I'd go with 2011 as well, although Prescott was generally on the bench rather than Hock, who wasn't really much of a factor until the following year. Beating Wire, Saints and Leeds one after another within a month to win the challenge cup was a hell of a feit. Even more impressive considering it fell within a 13 game unbeaten streak which also included league games against Saints, Huddersfield and Leeds.

Season ticket sales must be struggling now.

Roby is a fine player but not one that I personally fear. Your fullback offers more in attack and if he gets an injury free season is the player who I would genuinely fear and would have to be a serious candidate for regular representative honours.
Just an opinion