The rugby barometer will tell us how good they are in a fortnight when they come to Wigan.

Let's not start pretending that whether or not a player's feet leave the ground is now some kind of criterion for a red card. Please, let's nip this imaginary problem in the bud before it becomes another millstone round the game's neck.

I you are out of control both feet off the floor and make direct contact with the head when the opponent hasn’t lowered his head or dropped height at speed it has to be red.

As far as I know any reckless contact with the head has always been red, difference in this case from others was perhaps the intention to do damage….which I don’t think there was in this case.

I do though think the tackle was made out of pure frustration and if Saints are not getting pumped I don’t personally think TM performs the tackle in the same way.

It is if he's bolt upright and makes direct contact with the head as it means there's no attempt to keep the tackle low! I can only imagine you're being deliberately obtuse if you can't see a player jumping into a tackle is more likely to lead to a high tackle. Or do you think a defender who lowers his tackle height by bending his back is equally likely to hit the attacker high?

Come on mate, use a bit of sense. I understand you don't like the rule but trying to argue that an upright player with both feet off the ground isn't higher than an upright player with both feet on the ground is bordering on the delusional.

There's nothing delusional in being worried about the way the game is going.

If you're absolutely 100% okay that any contact with the head should be classifiable as a head-shot and merit some kind of card, then fine. I personally think it'll ruin the game I grew up loving (in fact, I think it already is - fans pay good money to watch stars on the pitch, not sitting in the stand, suffering draconian punishments for 'offences' which in a contact sport are commonplace and often accidental). But each to their own. At least you're in synch with the current powers-that-be.

No doubt you'll want the final word. Fine. have it. I've said what I think and am done with it.

Woah! This is a completely different discussion to "it was never a red card" or whether being off the ground makes a high shot more likely. Whether you like the fact that it is a red card or not is irrelevant. I said previously that I understand that you don't. I can't say I'm keen myself but understand the thinking behind the new rules (if not always the interpretation).

Just to clarify my posts. You said it was never a red card. I said it was. That's the entirety of the debate as far as I'm concerned. If you want to discuss whether the rules are good for the game, necessary or anything else I'm more than happy to chat about that too but that's nothing to do with my posts on the subject to date.

As it stands by the rules it was a red and Tommy prob will get a 2 match ban to clarify it.
We may not like the way the game is going sometimes but these are the rules at the min.

There was probably more damage long term at our game yesterday with two accidental head clashes caused by their own team mate than most red & yellow offences this season. Both looked awful (especially the Hull FC one in slow motion with a head to the bridge of his nose).

and there'll be no sanctions fines suspensions because 4 defenders crashed into each other, accidents happen in a contact sport, this afternoon a defender will probably get a ban because they accidentally made contact with an attackers head, makes no sense.

I didn't really like the red card and thought it was a bit silly (Tommy went front on with his chest, wrapped his arms etc and the ref just decided to stop the game himself for no reason despite May wanting to play on) however, with the rules the way they are at the minute, I understood that it's technically correct.

Being banned for 3 games for it though is disgrace. Cannot ing stand the MRP, they are ruining the game completely

What were your thoughts on Byrne's sending off and subsequent 4 March ban on Good Friday?

Saints are to appeal the ban. https://www.sthelensstar.co.uk/sport/24 ... heard-ort/

Saints are to appeal the ban. https://www.sthelensstar.co.uk/sport/24 ... heard-ort/

3 games is ridiculous!

Feel for the lad, he’s been a great servant to the club and deserves better.

I agree with the red card but 3 game ban is absolutely not deserved.

Exactly, they were all singing and dancing back then.

I didn't remember the fact he got 4 matches until you just said it lmao, did he really?

My thoughts on it are probably in here. It was a clear red card, but I'd never have supported that level of ban for it, so I probably said that was stupid. I've been very consistent with my opinion of how much the MRP are an anchor around the game's neck

In fact I've been in here more than once over this year saying how I thought bans your guys' got and people of other teams have been ridiculous

We have a two tiered approach. Wigan and Saints seem to be in the firing line more than most other clubs.

Hull FC have joined the chat


I believe they've had most individual bans but we're neck and neck with them on accumulated matches

It would be interesting to see how Wire and HKR fair.

One of the fb RL pages, can't remember offhand which one, but it pops up on my feed does an accumulation every week, they call it "Only Bans"

and as of last week HKR had the fewest with Wire just above them, if it pops up tomorrow I'll see where Saints are in the table

Fair enough mate. It wasn't a loaded question, I just wanted to know. Where would you have placed it in the range of no ban to the 4 he actually got? I know you'll be answering in light of Makinson's ban but if you can try to be impartial I'd be interested to know.

For what it's worth, my own view is that both were reds and I actually see them as very similar. I'm not totally surprised Tommy got 3 because of his previous sending off but I'm still of the opinion that's it's harsh nevertheless. Byrne's 4 was a travesty and hasn't been repeated to my knowledge.

I've had a discussion with Cruncher on here about this where I said that I understand the thinking behind the current rules. However, I think if we're going to be fairly draconian with the punishments handed out it's imperative that the disciplinary is fit for purpose and I'm not convinced it is. There is still too much of a lottery feeling about the whole process. I still can't gety head around someone putting their fingers in someone's mouth being dealt with as no proof of intention. I've literally never known anyone to accidentally put their fingers in someone else's mouth...and leave them there

... unintentionally.

I’m not really for banning after the fact, however as they were both red cards, it would probably be fair enough for an automatic 1 match ban. I think anything over 1 match should be reserved for serious foul play.

I’ll be honest and say I don’t really remember the ins and outs of the Byrne tackle, but in terms of under the current grading system in regards to Makinson, I think it is clearly careless rather than reckless so again, I’d see it as a 1 game (someone with a better disciplinary record just getting a fine)

I said on redvee but there’s no evidence that says these MRP retroactive bans are reducing bad/head high tackles. The RFL have come out and said the data for this year has been that head contacts have been significantly reduced, but that clearly can’t be down to the MRP panel as they’ve been doing their crap for years without that effect. More likely, it’s due to the rules and interpretations being changed and being punished more harshly with cards on the day, with players trying to change to obviously not cost their team a game on the day. I don’t think there’s any need for the MRP system as it currently stands in any way. Perhaps a very streamlined system whereby they take a look at incidents of serious foul play that were missed by the ref at most. Other than that, just give a 1 game ban for red cards and an accumulation of yellow cards and be done with it

On a similar note, the fines are another absolute travesty that our players who are underpaid for what they do shouldn’t have to deal with.

Lomax getting £1,500 was an absolute joke, but they shouldn’t be dealing with these fines anyway. Imagine being fined for a mistake at work. ridiculous

That would make interesting reading.

Reports all over Aus that Kyle Feldt is joining us. Disclaimer- RobRiches I've not started this rumour.

My thoughts are as I put on RV to save me typing twice.

On the face of it signing a 32 year old winger to replace a 32 year old winger doesn't sound like a clever decision..

However when you read the comments of the NQ fans they are sad to see him go. I think he is currently on 18 tries this season so clearly he is not a busted flush and we all know the SL is not at that standard. 1-2 years of him here helping the young lads would be a good decision and he's obviously still capable of playing at the top level.

Not sure of his record for injuries but he seems very durable and for all Tommy M is a legend and rightly so he is beginning to pick up injuries especially on his foot.