What I don't understand about Madge is how it hasn't kept on working for him in Aus.

He transformed Nobby's Wigan team and initially seemed to have a similarly positive impact at the Bunnies, but then things started going wrong.

I'm not sure I buy the criticism that he overloads the players with training. That seemed to work wonders for Wigan, and I can't imagine any NRL players complaining about how fit they are getting.

I'd have him back like a shot, but I can't help wondering if there's some other factor that means he never stays anywhere for long.

Didnt they only play in 2011?

Oh, need to check, but i thought they came mid season...

You may well be right, my apologies..

Signed mid season.... Again, apologies.

It's Ok but I get your point, back in those days Wigan could still attract a quality player or 2 and now we can't attract flies so it's difficult to compare hands. But just to side track, I will never forgive Finch for his last performance against Leeds in which he should of kicked for a scrum but instead went for a hail mary speculator which cost Wane a super league title in 2012. He actually jokes about how bad he played for Wigan on the Fox - Matty Johns show, on a weekly basis, which is equally funny because Johns was just as bad. Both of which are self confessed total alcoholics.

My memories is failing, as you can see... But i thought that the main reason they were available was due to cap issues in Oz...

Yes the storm had their title stripped from them for overspending

It is well known and I personally know of 2 players (1 from OZ and one from UK) who made decisions regarding joining or leaving a Madge coached team on the basis of the training methods.
In short it is Brutal (Much more so than under Wane) and works very well short term but has issues longer term.

A - World Class; B - Good; C - Useful; D - Average At Best; E - No Place For Him At Wigan.

Sam Tomkins - B (shades of A)
Joe Burgess - B/C (hard to judge to injury, was looking better with each game before his injury)
Dom Manfredi - N/A
Liam Marshall - C/D (Attack is B, defence is D)
Tom Davies - C
Oli Gildart - B
Dan Sarginson - N/A (harsh to judge at this stage)
John Bateman - B
George Williams - C
Tommy Leuluai - C
Sam Powell - C
Morgan Escare - C
Ben Flower - C
Tony Clubb - C
Ryan Sutton - C
Talima Tautai - D
Romain Navarette - C
Joel Tomkins - C
Liam Farrell - B
Willie Isa - D
Sean O'LOughlin - B

The choice of grading is particularly harsh.

Should be more like:

A: World Class
B: Very Good
C: Good
D: Average
E: Young with potential
F: Inconsistent
G: Poor

It’s also worth bearing in mind that though you would hope the squad would all rate at least C the reality of the salary cap means most squads will have a fair number of D, E & F’s

I think for some it's...

A. Wigan standard.
B. Would never have played in the 80's.
C. WTF is he doing here, send him to Leigh/Wakey/Cas.

I know it’s all about opinions but how u can class Williams and Powell as equal is mind boggling! I accept Williams form hasn’t been great but even on poor form he’s miles better than Powell. Still, it’s all about opinions.

Well the category was 'useful' and I think they've both been useful.

Wigan didn't.

Teams worked out a counter attack to his set plays and he couldn't adapt. The games moved on and even the most structured NRL sides have a different set of set plays these days. A lot of Maguire's plays involved using the dummy runners whereas the new type of structures are using the lead man to receive the pass and giving it straight back to the half (Or whoever passed the ball) to negate the offside rulings which have ruined the game in recent years.

We will probably start to use it next year when the Aussies are adept to stopping it. Thats why we struggle so badly at international level to break them down. Our attacking play is a year or 2 behind their defensive structures

Oh dear the same old tactic of pass it left because Powell can't do anything has kicked in already.

All f/g

I’m the opposite view, I think if given the opportunity he has shown that he can be electric at full back and his speed and elusiveness can be a nightmare for defences.

I would have preferred Escare to have been given far more opportunities at full back this season.

Madge was effective...but it was the most boringly predicable rugby I'd ever saw from them, which carried on until 2014 before you could see SW stamp upon them, imo.
Good grief that Wembley hame of 2013, that was so hard to watch.

....following GF and CC wins from Wigan were more, well, Wigan like!

We lost some much in the CC v Wire when Escare went to FB. He doesn't have the passing, decision making or rugby brain to be anywhere close to Sam as a FB. A potential 7, but no FB for me.

Absolutely right. Souths players were quite dismayed by Madges hard edge and over training. They're raving (and playing well) under Seibold.

I have said this many times in the past but was always shot down by the many Madge worshipers on the Rugby sites, glad to see someone else thinking the same

Running a structure helps players confidence and is effective...however, within a couple of seasons the opposition will have come up to speed with a game plan to counter. Madge was fortunate he only hung around Wigan for that pinnacle period and moved on....his first mistake at Souths was he hung around there too long thinking he wouldn't get caught out.

I certainly find it hard to judge a lad fairly this season based on the odd twenty minutes at Scrum Half when he’s a fullback. It’s the same as I find it hard to criticise a hooker playing at scrum half.

The common denominator in all this is Sam Tomkins and Wanes unwillingness to play him anywhere other then fullback. He’s a more natural halfback then either Escare or Powell but doesn’t want to play there. I personally think it’s time for Josh Woods to be given a run at scrum half and then Powell and Escare can start fighting for games in their natural positions.

I don’t think Amos Roberts had the attributes you have mentioned but on pace alone he was a genuine threat at the back just like Escare can be if given the opportunity.

It’s also not like Sam has had some below par performances at full back this season and unlike Escare he rarely looks to beat the first man due to his loss of speed.

Yeah it just makes you wonder what was the thinking when we signed him if there was little intention to give him a fair shot at full back rather than how he is currently being used.