They count for a great deal. How you start has a big influence on how you finish. Ever since the play-offs started and despite them changing format several times the sides that started well and finished at the top of the league and have gone on to contest the grand final.

Sides that start poorly, finish low down in the play-off positions as a result have not contested a single grand final. Fact.



I agree. We could have a bad second half of the season, finish low down the league as we have done in recent seasons and yet again miss out on the GF as a result.

Our current form simply makes the chance of a top two finish more likely and if we get one of those the chances of getting to a GF are miles better - as all the previous seasons since 1998 prove.

Dave

Whilst I agree with your second point, your first is based on circumstantial evidence.

Generally speaking, teams that start well, finish well.

HOWEVER, it is not always so (Bradford a few years back)


The one "unknown" about MM is his ability to handle the playoff system.

I hope he takes to it like a duck to water.

Tomkins long kicking game today was terrible, and hasnt been great all season. As for making the Grand Final, its way too early to tell, only a 1/3 way through the season...

Bradford finished third so their poor start still helped prevent them from a top two place so I think the evidence is far from circumstantial.

Of course they went on to win it but they are the only team to win a GF outside the top 2 and as I have said many times I have kicked myself for not having a bet on them winning it because of what happened to Leeds and Saints squads (decimated by injury whereas Bradford got a load of injured players back fresh for the play offs). I thought they would win it that year when I saw what happened to the likes of Long.

That said I don't really care how we get to the top places in the league so long as we do and its obvious a good start will get you a long way to that goal compared to a poor one.

As to MM and the play-offs he's been there with Melbourne so assuming we make them I am confident he will manage the situation well.

If we do finish in the top two and get a week off I am sure it will be put to good use and will be an advantage for us. I would not feel the same if Noble were still here as I'd expect us to turn out under-cooked and get beaten after a week off. Not so with MM.

Dave

Shame that for the first time in a decade we're on course to finish in the top 2 and its now far less of an advantage.

I've half forgotton how the current system works but I believe you only get a week off if you win your first game. I think if you lose you're back in the position of having to win two games to get to the final, the second of those being away from home.

Far less of an advantage than the top 6. All conjecture at the moment of course, only a 1/3 of the way through but we're on course. I certainly don't see finishing outside the top 4 now. Only 5 teams in my opinion were capable of that in the first place - Leeds, Saints, Wigan, Warrington and Hudds and surely Leeds are too far behind to catch us now especially when they still have many injuries to contend with for upcoming games.

I agree with the OP that Wigan are the leading contenders having beaten us, Leeds and now Saints I don't think we are not too far behind though our defeats against Wigan and Saints were close and came down to goal kicking.

Think my top five at the start of the season was:

Leeds
Saints
Hudds
Wigan
Wire

The only thing I didn't expect was Wire and Wigan to go so well from the kick off of the season and Leeds to be not at it like the past 3 seasons, right now I think Wigan will defo be top 2/3 I would like to think we could be in the top 4 or maybe 5 at least going on how we look so far, Hudds could be the ones to watch I know they got done by Saints last week but usually there defence is spot on and Brough whos scored a few tonight could be a big player in attack for them if he settles in.

good win for you guys today. there's five teams at the top now who can all beat each other (and not just the usual 'on their day') you put saints/wigan/leeds/warrington/huddersfield against any of the others any you genuinely can't pick a winner, you no longer need a team to have 'an off day' or 'a good performance' to win.

obviously wigan are out in front at the moment, but at some point they'll hit a bad patch, and they may not be able to keep at the front of the table, who knows, you might be able to sustain it till the end of the season..

just try to enjoy it

Something I have commented on all season. I was hoping Deacon would add something in that facet of the game.

I think Hudds have come on leaps and bounds under Brown but personally i do not feel they are yet serious title challengers. For me its still a case of wire, saints, leeds and wigan.

Failed to do so yet, as i put on another thread seems reluctant to boss it on the last, something he was brought in for you would expect.

Wigan have never failed to get to a Grand Final in the 3 occasions we have entered the playoffs with more than one chance. (i.e. not sudden death all the way)

The only difference between finishing 1st and 4th is 1st get home advantage.

Both can potentially get to old trafford with 2 wins, it's just 4th have to win the 1st game away from home, 1st place get's home advantage.

Outside the top 4, you need to win 3 games to get there, as opposed to the 2 games needed by the top 4.

The new system is really alot more open and pretty untested. Last seasons playoffs went fairly straight forward with1st and 2nd competing in the grand final but this seasons the top cluster of teams are so evenly matched it's alot more open.

and i've gotta say, I really don't envy who get's the club call this season because there won't be an easy choice.

Agree with the OP. Wigan are definatley leading contenders.

Wigan
Wire
Saints
Leeds
Hudds

- for me. I won't be writing Leeds off.

More than one chance = anywhere in the top 4!!

This is why I say wigan look certs to make the grand final.

Then you'd be very wise.

Do you know how club call and home advantage is determined for the final eliminators? Is it the league placings of the four teams that make it or is it simply the winners of the first week that get home advantage?

It seems to me that if the fourth placed team were to beat the first placed team in week one, any potential advantage you get for finishing first is wiped out.

It's the highest placed winner when the top 4 playoff.

so the games will be

1st v 4th
2nd v 3rd

if 1st and 2nd both lost their games 3rd, the highest placed winner would get club call and they and 4th spot would be one home game away from the grand final.

It's pretty open to be honest. I think we'll see alot more from outside the top 2 make it over the next 5 years.

Yeah that's pretty much it.

If that hgappened 4th place team would then get home advantage for the final eliminator.

If you take leeds, they only need to get into the top 4 to have a good chance of making the grand final.

that pretty much shows how ridiculous the top 8 system is. as a top 5 system there was a distinct advantage, you got a week off, if you won you go straight to the GF, if you lost you get a semi final at home, against a team who's played the previous 2 weeks.

as i've said a top 4 of say saints, leeds (or more likely huddersfield), wire and wigan there is no massive advantage to anyone.. if for argument's sake wigan finish top, then it's not beyond any of the others to beat wigan at home

I'm going to revel in today until Monday, but then it's another game. I'm keeping my feet firmly on the ground... Although I wasn't this afternoon.

I don't think it's ridiculous, it just puts a bit more pressure on the top 2 and gives 3rd and 4th a bigger shout.

Top still get's a week off - if they win the 1st game, they still get 2 bites at the cherry, they just have to win 2 games and if they lose their 1st game they forfeit home advantage for the eliminator if they get there.

I think after Leeds and Saints we now have to be considered contenders, and surely the team to catch.

Saying that, winning at Saints means nothing if we lose to Wakefield.

And why do they deserve that?

The top 5 was THE best play off system because each position higher up the league you finish the bigger the advantage. If you finished 4th you got home advantage over 5th but sudden death.
2nd V 3rd meant neither was out if they lost but 2nd got home advantage and so on. A very clever system that rewarded the teams for finishing higher up more so than any other system played so far.

The top 8 and club call nonsense has Nigel Wood written all over it and he is the single worst thing to happen to Rugby League in its entire history. He's a gimmick on legs and thinks everything about RL has to be a gimmick as well.

Dave

I know what your saying but in quite a few of our games this season we have only played well in patches, so i actually think theres more to come from Wigan yet

People have to realise that Wigan haven't been that far off in recent years. But thisb year with a new coach, improved fitness, application and discipline, they're the team to beat at the moment.