My point was people are suddenly heralding noble as the next messiah after some decent performances that came after he allegedly told the players he was leaving. I am merely trying to be open minded on the subject.

However , if by the "other site" (you make them sound like the enemy!!) you mean "WiganWarriorsFans" then I think you are being unfair as I do use that site and have found it to be fine.

A great theory, unfortunately the NRL use a similar top 8 system and four of the last six Grand Finals have been 1st v 2nd. One of the other two was 1st v 3rd and the only time the team that finished first after the regular rounds didn't make the GF was when the perennial chokers the Eels came top.

So based on what evidence there is out there suggests finishing positions are just as important in a top 8 system as a top 5/6.

It's not a theory. It's fact.

Your last sentance is laughable.

I have demonstrated the facts. You have chosen to ignore them (or more likely are unable to specificlaly tell me why I am wrong)

Instead you waffle on about the historical results in another country.

It's a bit like comparing the Premier League with La Liga.

Fortunately you are not the coach of Wigan RL, and if Nobby has done his homework, (which I am sure he has) then I expect a push come the playoff.

Basically because you would think that home advantage in the big games would be crucial, I'm not sure whether the stats back that up however.

People talk about how its now important to finish top 4 as it was top 2 last year but I certainly wouldn't fancy going away to Headingly or Knowsley Road in a playoff game. It seems unavoidable in this current season for Wigan if they're going to get to the GF.

We are 9th and the League Table doesn't lie!
Our start to the season was awful.
However change has occurred and with it improvement.
The signing of Martin Gleeson is a great boost for the squad being the quality player he is. We now have Tim Smith playing very well.
These changes together with Noble settling on Phelps at FB, stable 3/4 and halves that have TL starting 7 then to 9 are producing results, literally.
We look a far better team and a more balanced one too.
A far better attacking force with scoring an average of over 40 in the last three games.
The whole squad looks confident and that in itself can mean points on the board compared to a team lacking belief in themselves.
Noble and IL have turned it around with the signing of Gleeson and Smith's inclusion having been dropped has proved very successful.
If both BN and IL can sort out the pack then we can have a team competing for trophies.
We are not far off and if Ian Lenagan and Brian Noble can stay together then we may well be nearer the success we all want than we think.
The last thing we need is a change of coach and the disruption that will bring, it could set us back another 2-3 years.

You really do take yourself seriously don't you?

The only facts are those I posted - i.e. what has actually happened.

People basically have two options to base their position on:

1. What has happened in a comparable system used over a number of years.

2. A theory based on no evidence whatsoever, apart from the usual head in the sand rantings.

But it's not a theory.

I am stating how the playoff season works. It is up to the reader to make their own mind up.

Btw the Australian system is NOT the same as that in SL. HTH.

"Point 1: It makes very little difference where you come in the top 4. "

Is the first thing you said, which is a theory. I've shown what has happened in a comparable system which shows the higher up you finish has a relationship on whether you make the Grand Final.




I'm aware of that which is why I said it was "similar", not the "same". The principles are close in terms of the advantage it gives to higher placed teams.

If you need any help in the definition of certain words I'll gladly point you in the right direction.

HTH.

What a load of balls.

Why can the PL not be compared to La Liga?

The indisputable facts are that a team finishes as high up in the league as they do because they are consistently better than other teams. To win the grand final requires a team to be 'consistently' excellent for three games, something that a team finishing 5-14th is unlikely to do.

This mythical peaking at the right time has been harped on about for the last three years but our lack of consistency in the regular season has meant we aren't used to peaking for three games in a row. Noble apparantly always got the Bulls to 'peak at the right time' - but this was only ever from third or above.

It's not a theory, it's a fact.

Forget Austrailia. We are in the UK. Our teams are different, the level of competition is different.


There is a slight advantage to home vs away but in reality that's all it is. As slight advantage.


Much more important is the form a team carries into the playoffs.

Actually a more accurate description would be "they have over the course of a season performed better than the teams below them".

Consistency is a seperate issue.

Both the above are not as important as peaking at the right time.

Why should we forget Aus? It's the only example of a top eight play off season in rugby league to hand. The gap between first and eighth in SL is 4 points. The gap between first and eighth in NRL is 4 points.

Unless we have an excellent last half of the season we are going to struggle in the play-offs due to the inconsistent early season form. Do you not agree with this point?

Do we need to add the word "fact" to the list of words you seem to need help on?

The evidence I've listed in terms of finishing positions, both in a top 8 system and from what we know of the previous system here show finishing in the top 2 means you are significantly more likely to contest the Grand Final.

I'm sure you'll be dying to show everyone these "facts" you have and the evidence they're based on?

Aren't you bored of his rants?

Who RHJ

or jonh? I assume you mean jonh..I think he makes some very valid points....it's all a matter of opinions not everyone one will agree.

In my opinion, I'd keep on Noble for another 2 years, at least.

At first I was sceptical about keeping hold of him at all, but actually thinking it through, I think we need some consistency for once at Wigan.

A new coach would want a different squad - to change this current set up would be daft. Wigan have, in the past, fallen in to the trap of piling the blame on the coach and pressing the red button far too quickly.

Noble clearly likes his job at Wigan and we, as the fans, need to respect that and accept it. Wigan need a stable platform and Brian Noble is the man to deliver it.


[size=75Disclaimer:
I'm up at 4:27am by the way, because I have lots of Uni work to do and I'm 100% sober. [/size

From what i have been hearing for the last 2 weeks Noble will be here for at least another 12 months if not 2 years. Heard yesterday the Betts could be on his way back to join the coaching staff how true it is i dont know but it could fit in with what i have been hearing about a big shake up of the backroom staff at wigan that B.N. and I.L. want to do.

OK - so it doesn't matter where you finish in the play-offs as long as you peak at the right time, which Noble has done for the last couple of years.

But Wigan haven't made the final, despite peaking "at the right time". Why? Because they left themselves too much to do by finishing too low down the table.

You'll have to do some serious "peaking" from 9th too.

Anyone who doesn't think regular season positions are important is seriously deluded. In fact, I wonder whether they have ever actually watched a play-off series, here or in Australia.

We will finish in the top 4 only just halfway through the season lots of things can happen between now and the playoffs a few weeks of bad form and you drop like a stone its very competitive this year 2 weeks ago you were 4 points clear and now your just 1 point clear

Absolutely agreed, anything can happen. I reckon you'll finish top4 too. Just making the point that the higher you finish, the better your chances - the mantra that all that matters is making the play-offs is tosh.

Wigan might make the top eight but there are too many teams above them that are playing better.The roblem with your squad will be when injuries occur to your already threadbare forward line especially your forward pack.

They already have in a way, O'Carroll has been out for a while after being arguably our best prop for the first few weeks.

As for the 2nd row i think we'd only hugely miss lockers and hock, but just the same as if saints don't have wilkin or leeds pelatua and sinfield.

On the contrary. We've got a bigger, better squad than we've had for several years. We have five props - all pretty useful (one of whom is injured but not too far off recovery), three hookers, and five back-rowers.

Injuries can strike anyone at any time. But to say that Wigan are less prepared than others is extreme wishful thinking on your part.

If Wigan play to their best for the majority of the remaining games we'll walk into the top 8. If every side in the league played at their best for the rest of the year only Leeds and Saints best would be able to beat ours as proved by our two 3rd place finishes in the last 2 years.

Also we have plenty of depth to our squad. We might not have the same quality in the first 17 but we have more back up then a team like Saints which is encouraging.

from our side on Saturday we had the players below sat in the stand-

Ainscough
K Pryce
Goulding(on loan at Salford but only short term)
O'Carroll
Riddell
Hansen

theres plenty of first team experience there and we also have quite a few youngsters that could hold their own if needs be so we're not too badly off.