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| Quote ="Stu M"Crumbled?
We go on to win this today and win our game in hand and we are level on points with you.'"
Above us after beating us next week Stu.
We're just lucky Wakefield are poor
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| Quote ="Egg Chasing"Well he's capable of playing as a prop with his size and can tackle pretty hard so the only thing stopping him being what you suggest is his hands is it not?'"
He is far too small to play prop.
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| Quote ="post"He is far too small to play prop.'"
Hooker it is then
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| FTR....I would play him at 11.
I think there's the potential for Powell at 13 with Cust/O'Neill at 9.
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| Quote ="Egg Chasing"Above us after beating us next week Stu.
We're just lucky Wakefield are poor
'"
Or 4 points behind us after we beat them again *
*May or may not be what I'm suggesting will actually happen. Unfortunately I don't have access to the internet at the moment so will have to clarify next Friday around 10PM
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| Quote ="Egg Chasing"FTR....I would play him at 11.
I think there's the potential for Powell at 13 with Cust/O'Neill at 9.'"
Powell is 5ā10, far too small. Donāt be quoting Paul Gallen either because he was as wide as he was tall. Needs to be over 6ft to play loose and over 95kg at least.
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| So by a "big stand off" you mean over 6ft and over 95KG.
Jesus......how many of them are there in the modern game? Sounds like GB in the early 00s of Faz at 6 and Scully at 13 and vice versa.
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| I kind of know where you're coming from. A 13 needs to be a 3rd prop (Gallen) or a ball player (SOL) depending on how you play. We tend to go with the 3rd prop option but don't have the 1st and 2nd props to do the first bit
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| We've lost our best two props, one for the season and one for a couple of months, there's no fix for this, if Salford made Dupree available I'd hope we'd go all in for him but if they want to keep him that's that.
Lack of grunt up front and the no.9 issue that's been done to death are the root cause of our problems.
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| Quote ="Phuzzy"Or 4 points behind us after we beat them again
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*May or may not be what I'm suggesting will actually happen. Unfortunately I don't have access to the internet at the moment so will have to clarify next Friday around 10PM
'"
Absolutely correct,on both points.
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| Quote ="Egg Chasing"Well he's capable of playing as a prop with his size and can tackle pretty hard so the only thing stopping him being what you suggest is his hands is it not?'"
To be fair for my money Smithies should be at prop and not back row or lock.
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| Quote ="100% Warrior"To be fair for my money Smithies should be at prop and not back row or lock.'"
He's not big enough
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| Quote ="Wigg'n"From what I can see we are also missing a captain.
Oh and also Briers.'"
That was one of the reasons I jokingly (I think) mentioned Tommy - not the greatest scrum half we have had but one thing he could do was organise and tell others what was needed - things this current team are very much lacking, we are crying out at times for an on field general.
I agree I think Briers is a big miss.
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| How many props were you missing today cat?
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| Quote ="Egg Chasing"So by a "big stand off" you mean over 6ft and over 95KG.
Jesus......how many of them are there in the modern game? Sounds like GB in the early 00s of Faz at 6 and Scully at 13 and vice versa.'"
Yes, a big stand off. So maybe a stand-off who is 6ft and can be bulked up 10kg. Iād say a lower grade Aussie who matches that description and can tackle, switch him to 13. Like your Brad Fitler in his latter years, or Sculthorpe/Farrell/Lockers.
Or a Prop with good hands, a stand off born into a props body so to speak like your Lee Crooks, Sam Burgess, James Graham etc.
There arenāt many in the modern game because the game has been dumbed down into middles, pivots and edges but there are players who can be shaped into that position.
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| Quote ="post"The benchmark for props is Jason Taumalolo or JWH both take it up twice a set and make 100m in the first half of a game. Can the Wigan props not set personal goals to do something similar?
It doesnāt help that Powell takes an extra second with getting the ball from the floor to the man, that second is an extra 1 or 2 metres that the defence line gains before contact therefore in a set we could be 5-10 more metres down the pitch.
I like Kaide Ellis, I think he needs another prop mate to bounce off, he looks like he isnāt enjoying his time here when heās on the pitch. Like Craig Smith had Pongia to spur him on Ellis needs a fellow Aussie prop to spur him on, bit of competition. I think Ellis could be a very good prop for us if given the right environment and coaching.
I think a lot of the problems within the team stem from the whole edges, pivots and middles classification of players because to pigeon hole players into these categories it takes away their skill, expertise and nous to play rugby league and makes them robots to what the coach wants and if the coach gets it wrong then the team loses.
We need a 6 that is a runner off the 7 or 1, that can put kicks in normally short kicks and has that turn of pace. Field lacks the kicking game and Cust lacks the speed.
We need a 7 with a long kicking game, a massive gob that doesnāt shut up organising, probing, testing, scheming and can spot weaknesses in the defence and use a few plays to build up to a move/attack. Smith has the kicking game and can spot weakness but he lacks the gob and organisation skills and seems to lose confidence pretty quickly, Briers worked wonders with him so appointing another coach that would help Smith would be cheaper than getting rid. Iām thinking someone along the lines of Sean Long, Kevin Brown, Danny a rough etc eg an ex-SL player who could organise with a rugby brain.
We donāt need YouTube props, Iām sick of us buying them. On the pitch we need a metre eating work horse like Terry OāConnor/Coley along side someone with a bit more punch/size/aggression with an offload like your JWH/ Fielden but the impact player should not be a Feka or a lazy 1 drive and an offload and then off.
We need proper back rowers, Isa is too small and I donāt think understands the game enough to be a top drawer back rower, utility player yes. Smithies, Farrell and Shorrocks all lack size. Nsemba lacks experience but looks like the back rower I like, his try in the cup prime example of what a proper back rower can do when they run a good line, a try that only Liam Farrell could have scored.
Loose forward, should be a prop with good hands or a big stand off that can tackle. Smithies is neither, Smithies should be moulded into a hooker in my opinion. Shorrocks is not big enough to play 13 either.'"
I thought you had stopped watching Wigan?
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| Quote ="TheWarringtonWolve69"I thought you had stopped watching Wigan?'"
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
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| Quote ="post"Yes, a big stand off. So maybe a stand-off who is 6ft and can be bulked up 10kg. Iād say a lower grade Aussie who matches that description and can tackle, switch him to 13. Like your Brad Fitler in his latter years, or Sculthorpe/Farrell/Lockers.
Or a Prop with good hands, a stand off born into a props body so to speak
like your Lee Crooks, Sam Burgess, James Graham etc.
There arenāt many in the modern game because the game has been dumbed down into middles, pivots and edges but there are players who can be shaped into that position.'"
Do you think that is potentially a bit ambitious?
The players you name are up there with the best to ever play the game, not running around in park football in Australia.
Our biggest issue at the moment is lack of props due to injury and a 7 whose confidence seems to be on its aris.
We get props back we will fine despite the ropey spell we are going through.
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| Just take the goal kicking duties off Smith, easy call, take some pressure off him, if someone else misses, they miss
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| Quote ="apollosghost"Just take the goal kicking duties off Smith, easy call, take some pressure off him, if someone else misses, they miss'"
I agree give it to Field he can miss aswell.
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| I haven't seen it mentioned in here but Field's defence is atrocious. You could see King and Nsemba both trying in vain to cover him, he is literally a speed bump. Some pathetic efforts on Whitley, Mourgue and Romano in particular.
Not sure what it means for French but Field surely can't defend in the line again.
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| Quote ="SFW"I haven't seen it mentioned in here but Field's defence is atrocious. You could see King and Nsemba both trying in vain to cover him, he is literally a speed bump. Some pathetic efforts on Whitley, Mourgue and Romano in particular.
Not sure what it means for French but Field surely can't defend in the line again.'"
Very tough to watch, hopefully itās just down to rust.
Wonder if Bevan could defend there and Field at full back?
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| I'd be absolutely stunned if Field defended in the line again against Saints. He looked terrified.
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| Quote ="FearTheVee"I'd be absolutely stunned if Field defended in the line again against Saints. He looked terrified.'"
Saints will get Sironen one on ones all game on Field.
Field will be at 6 though. Peet seemed to indicate that after the game.
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| Quote ="NSW"Saints will get Sironen one on ones all game on Field.
Field will be at 6 though. Peet seemed to indicate that after the game.'"
Peet's clear preference in his time as coach has been to play Field at fullback and French on the wing. He had plenty of opportunities to do so before he was essentially forced into it with Cust's injury/lack of form. I doubt he'll revert to type on the back of that one game but I wouldn't rule it out. The mismatch in the two forward packs is the main concern though (again!).
Amazing how one round of games can completely change the outlook. A loss isn't the end of the world but a 2nd successive heavy defeat would be a disaster with the Challenge Cup game coming up (as well as being grim to watch of course).
I can see Singleton coming in, perhaps for Nsemba.
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