Jsst reading a BBC interview with Sam Tomkins, and he's clear that to the players, a trophy is everything, and the style doesn't matter. Is he right? Are falling crowds partly due to boring games, even if winning? www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/41027784 Quote ="Sam Tomkins""I don't care what the game is like. I don't care what the fans think, if it's dire, if there's no tries scored. All we want is to pick that trophy up," he said. "People say 2013 wasn't an entertaining game. Well you know what, if you're a Wigan player it was as entertaining as you want it. "Fans looking in want flashy tries and they want a massive highlights reel. As a player you don't care. I don't care if there's no tries and we win by a drop goal, I just want a trophy."'" To me, yes - I walked away happy in 2013 even though the game was totally forgettable. I was gutted losing the GF in 2015 even though it was a thriller. I'll settle for a 2-0 win on Sat! But...will fans continue to come if it is in fact as dire as he suggests it could be?

Jsst reading a BBC interview with Sam Tomkins, and he's clear that to the players, a trophy is everything, and the style doesn't matter. Is he right? Are falling crowds partly due to boring games, even if winning? www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/41027784 Quote ="Sam Tomkins""I don't care what the game is like. I don't care what the fans think, if it's dire, if there's no tries scored. All we want is to pick that trophy up," he said. "People say 2013 wasn't an entertaining game. Well you know what, if you're a Wigan player it was as entertaining as you want it. "Fans looking in want flashy tries and they want a massive highlights reel. As a player you don't care. I don't care if there's no tries and we win by a drop goal, I just want a trophy."'" To me, yes - I walked away happy in 2013 even though the game was totally forgettable. I was gutted losing the GF in 2015 even though it was a thriller. I'll settle for a 2-0 win on Sat! But...will fans continue to come if it is in fact as dire as he suggests it could be?

Surely that's a no brainer? Who the hell would prefer their side to lose a thrilling final ?



P/s good luck on Saturday.

He's 100% correct. Winning a final is all that matters regardless of the manner of victory.

I don't think anyone has an issue with the entertainment value of any of our final wins. It's the bread and butter of the weekly rounds where I think most people would like to see a bit more excitement.

Why is there no option for a thrilling win?!

Is it really too much to go into a final hoping for a win and a level of entertainment that does the sport and both clubs on the field justice?!

People outside the heartlands know the sport and Wigan mainly because of the Challenge Cup final.

It is no coincidence this year the teams that have played an entertaining and expansive style of rugby have in many people's eyes over achieved.

Comments from within the club like this make my blood boil. It is symptomatic of the level we are bringing this great sport down to. Fans of the sport were not attracted to the sport in the main to watch 80mins of dross win lose or draw. The falling numbers on the terraces at Wigan are an indicator of that.

Win lose or draw I will be happy if I am entertained and am able to watch a game fitting of a final where players are able to showcase the skills they have and of this great sport to a wider audience.

A few things really concern me about stories and direct quotes from inside the club like this. Firstly is it too much to expect to play an entertaining style of rugby and win matches? Is that really an unrealistic goal?! I personally don't believe so. Secondly this is a bit of a 2 fingers up at the teams customer base, basically saying in my opinion, "stop moaning, or if you want to carry on moaning we don't care as your opinion doesn't matter!" Hardly a great message to send to your customers especially when the reality is despite the trophies they are walking away in numbers.

Edit as it will not let me submit my vote for some reason, as a rugby league fan first, Wigan fan second I voted for thrilling loss given the options presented.

No brainier!! The record books won't remember how exciting a game was but it will remember the winners. I'd take a boring win over any type of loss every time! Hard to believe people could even contemplate the alternative.

Entertainment provides memories. The 2013 final was such a snorefest that I rarely ever think back to it and often completely forget about it when I think about Wigan's past achievements.

Completely agree with Jonh.

My stance above is based on being a fan of the sport over being a fan of Wigan.

I don't judge the sport on the record books. I judge it by what occurs on the field.

The record books show we beat Hull in 2013 and 1985 finals.

Interesting the 85 final is still the game everyone talks about.

Yes I want Wigan to win, obviously but there is a responsibility to do the game, event and clubs justice.

Well said, John.
It's been a very boring season watching Wigan. Even though I've watched them for about 60 years, I'm not going to Wembley because of this.
They did improve last Friday but Salford were poor.
I've always recorded the Wigan finals so I could watch them again but I didn't record the last one against Hull because it was so boring.
I'll be watching it on TV, hoping for entertaining rugby and a Wigan win.

Poor comments from Sam Tomkins IMO. If I was a neutral weighing up whether to buy a Wembley ticket/start following Wigan, this would probably put me off. He is an exceptional player, but I would question whether he values the fans, given these comments and the tweet he sent to Bilko. I suppose they can't all be like Kris Radlinski.

I've no issue with them taking the approach that gives them the best chance of winning the game, if that is percentage rugby, then so be it. Having said that, we have S.Tomkins, Burgess, Gelling, Gildart, Williams, Farrell and Bateman in the team, who are all well suited to games were we chance our arm, so would boring rugby even be the best approach? I think it plays into Hull's hands as they have bigger battering rams than us, but fewer game breakers.

It can depend on why it is boring. Scenario 1 is when both teams cancel each other out because of the intensity and high quality of their play resulting in a close match that many would find boring. Scenario 2 is the knock on fest or stop start game where nothing goes right. Scenario 3 one team dominated and there is no contest and S4 is where both teams go through the motions or lack intensity. There are other scenarios. Some are more acceptable than others.

Hull fan here in peace.

Firstly I want my team to win. If its a boring win I'll take it.

Was there in 1985 - great game for the neutral and Wigan (and hkr fans) but I cannot say I look back on it with any fondness

I was also there in 2005 - Great game for the neutral and Hull FC, but I am yet to speak to any Leeds fan which looks back on the game with any enthusiasm.

Was there in 2013 - from my point of view, at about 6.30pm on that day, I took in a deep breath, closed my eyes, drew a metaphorical line and let it go. The reality is, the huge down pour spoiled the game. That said, was it really any more of a boring game to watch than Leeds racking 50 past a hapless hkr??

Was there last year for a close win, nerves were shot, fantastic to get the monkey off our backs.

I do think that for many Wigan fans, familiarity of winning the trophy so often has taken the shine off this as an occasion. This is clearly evidenced by disappointing ticket sales from your end (so we are lead to understand).

From a Hull Fans point of view, the novelty of winning at the national stadium most definitely has not worn off and I am buzzing already about the final.

Ideal work, the final is not riddled with niggly penalties, there are some great tries scored and there is less than 12 point between the teams at the end of the game. Real world is that I would still want to see Ellis lift the trophy at the end, even it its a 13-0 trudge in a mud bath.

I think it's a terrible attitude to have that you have to play boring rugby to win. Where is the confidence in their abilities? Especially as this season Cas have rinsed everyone and played exciting rugby. They've only won the shield so far so remains to be seen if they can win the big one but the notion that to win trophies you have to not be expansive and not express your abilities is shameful.

I remember the 85 final, best one played at Wembley, yet still have nightmares about it, give me a win any day, in a perfect world it will be a cracker but come on most would drather have a boring win than a fantastic loss, I would, safe trip down lads and lasses,

last year, we, fc, were good for the last 20 minutes which won us the game, i didnt care about the first 60 afterwards!

obviously id love us to win it on saturday with flair and free flowing rugby, weather looks good so heres hoping, but if its another scrappy win, so be it

Nobody wants to be on the losing side but jon is right. We want (and need) a match that does the sport proud.

It's us fickle fans who pay Sam Tomkins' wages, so I can so without the lecture, thanks.

It's a disgraceful attitude to have towards the tens of thousands of fans making the trip down to pay his salary and bonus. I can't believe it's coming out of one of our senior players mouths, and previously one of the head coaches.

Why is it disgraceful? He's being totally honest.

I'll take a 1- 0 or 2-0 win over a 30 - 28 defeat.

Of course we'd like a great open game, but a WIN is what will go down in the record books, and what matters most.

Spot on Rogues. Every fan of the game wants a fast, exciting spectacle that will live long in the memories. The players probably want the same but like Sam, I'd much prefer a dull game and bring the trophy back than be on the wrong end of an exhilarating defeat!
Sam is saying it how it is and all this talk of being disrespectful to those who pay his wages is pure cack!!

Disgraceful is a bit far, and I don't really buy into this "We pay their wages" stuff. It's not like we have all clubbed together to give IL the money to pay him. We are just paying money to watch rugby games, that's a fair exchange, not something they owe us for.

I just think it's unwise for him to say things which are likely to irk supporters and put off potential new fans ahead of our showpiece event, even if he is just being honest. I think "I hope the fans enjoy the game, but the most important thing to me is to win the cup." comes across a lot better than "I want to the cup, I don't care what the fans think.", do the club not give them any sort of guidance about interviews? I can't imagine IL or the marketing team really wanting that to be the message we send out.

Because it's selfish? Why should I waste my weekend spending a few hundred quid to be bored for 80 minutes just for 20 minutes of celebration at the end? A win will go down in the record books but no one cares about boring finals. Like Jonh, I'd completely forgotten we even won the 2013 final, it was such a non event that I'd subconsciously wiped it from my memory.

Like I said, you can play nice rugby and win. It's the defeatist attitude that we can't do both that annoys me when we have some of the best talent in the league.

I get WHAT he's saying. He's a professional sportsperson, and his job is to win at all costs - as long as it's within the laws of the game.

I'm surprised that he's actually saying it. I thought he'd had media training, so I'd have expected him to be able to avoid foot-in-mouth comments like "I don't care what the fans think".

People shouldn't get confused between a good game and a high scoring game. I've seen great games that are 8-6 and dire games which finish 48-38. Ultimately we would like a low error, tight contest which the ref lets flow and tries need to be earned through good play rather then being given via errors. Many people rave about State of Origin and they're exactly that!

People are going back to 2013 a lot yet not mentioning the weather that day (as pointerd out above) which was abysmal. In the main our final wins and defeats have been pretty good games and I think we all know a big game Wigan team is a different animal to the one we see in the weekly rounds.

If both teams play on saturday as they did in the semi I think we're in for a treat but if it's a borefest and we win 7-0 then so be it!!

I'm pretty sure Sam wants the game to be exciting, same as we all do... But if it isn't and Wigan win, so f'ing what.

This.

And me. To tell people giving up their hard earned money that their views and opinions mean nothing to him - especially given how little he has given back since his return - is pretty poor IMO. Plenty of fans have been extremely patient with his injury situation, particularly the last one where the cause of the injury has been the subject of much speculation. I would have expected something a bit more diplomatic from him, to say the least.