Following on from the off piste Chris Hill discussion…
This season is obviously even more difficult for young players given the lack of Reserve grade but some issues are glaring.
As FMC pointed out, why play a prop on the wing rather than give a youngster a go?
Why re sign a player (Robson) to not trust him. Why have a player on the bench and not play him? Why have a reserve hooker who has clearly advanced and not give him more game time, even if it means DC at 13 for a part of the game?
I appreciate the coaching staff see more of the players than we ever will, however if the answer to an absent winger is to play Sita who can’t do a half decent shift at prop then either we have a complete set of duffers in reserve or something odd is going on in the coaches mind.

It's simple. Price has his favourites and your face either fits or it doesn't. His sheer arrogance is also holding the team back not only in his team selection but in his tactics too. But that's not a discussion for this thread.

Though I am far from excited about Powell as our next coach, I do hope he puts more trust in our young academy players and allows them to express themselves on the pitch.

I'm interested to see the list of players who have been denied opportunities at Warrington. Surely if they were so good they would be ripping the league up with another club by now?

I think under Price our youth development has come on leap and bounds from your Pat Moran's and Jack Johnson's of this world that previous coaches had left him with. Powell will be getting a damn site better hand to play with in respective of young talent than Price had when he joined.

The likes of Thewliss, Longstaff and Wrench are a class above anything we have produced since the days of John Bastian. There are others younger players pushing through as well but we shouldn't forget just how young those three named are. There is a duty of care to these players with the longevity of career in mind owed to them by the club and it is good to see that Price is not over-exposing them.

Isn't Robson getting high praise at Bradford ? All good grounding i suppose ,coming up against some of the old stagers in that division.

Simple.
Our coach is not very good, at all. Decent and a lovely bloke but not a top line coach here or elsewhere.

I'm not saying you've not got your finger on the pulse 9, but he's been recalled been in one of match days squads and been at Salford on loan for a month.

Obviously ,my pulse is feinter than i thought . I must have missed his return .

I agree that the 3 players mentioned have the potential to be great players.
There’s also a saying if your good enough age doesn’t come into it. They need to given regular games. As mentioned in above post why didn’t Connor Wrench play instead of a prop on the wing.

Ben Currie was a great example. He played because from the age of 18 onwards he was simply undroppable. Toby King was given a regular chance, proved his worth and it was thanks Ryan Atkins we don’t need you anymore.

Look at Jack Welsby and Lewis Dodd at Saints plus Morgan Knowles previously. Saints have played them a lot more than our youngsters too the point now they are first team regulars. Lachlan Coote and Theo Fages and James Bentley can move on. It means they can use their salary to sign a class NRL centre.
I read on our forum though that we can’t let Chris Hill go. It would leave us a lot worse off. It possibly will but if Butler/ Robson/ Doro had been given more chances in lesser games maybe they too would be ready.
It’s because we have this anchor round our necks of not winning Super League, that we have to stick to experienced players all the time.
I’ve mentioned in previous posts on other topics that I believe James Harrison has been signed by Powell to play not be a bit part player.

I’ll give you an example and it’s totally my opinion. Joe Philbin for me hasn’t done the business this season, he has stagnated since signing a 5 year contract. For me,a chance to play Longstaff. It gives Joe a kick up the ar$e and improves his game knowing his 1st team spot is not assured.
Competition for places his what brings success.

Thewlis has played more Super league minutes than Dodd despite being younger.

Why would Wrench play on the wing? He played all his academy rugby in the pack and is currently learning to adjust to centre. Sita has played wing in the NRL and against Wigan a physical presence to make yards off your own line is important. He was our biggest yardage maker on the night which supports his surprise selection.

It is your opinion that we play a 19 year back rower as a prop in lieu of a current England / GB international. I'll concede that it is an interesting opinion to have, probably best left on an internet message board.

Fair enough. Saints if the rumours are true are letting Theo Fages go having a ready made replacement in Dodds despite the fact he’s played less minutes than Josh Thewlis. They think he’s ready.


Connor Wrench played and played and played well at the DW stadium. 40 points to 14 l recollect. We didn’t need Sita’s physical presence as a ex NRL winger that night. At home I didn’t say Sita didn’t play well, but to give Connor a lad for the future another chance to impress we could of quite easily of moved Jake Mamo to the wing and give him another chance.

I’ll accept Longstaff isn’t a direct replacement for Joe Philbin but the point I’m trying to make is players have to be given a chance. The topic is about young players opportunities and when there going to get them.
Ellis Longstaff as extended his contract by two years, if he doesn’t get the opportunity how can he prove he’s worth another contract. This is where we definitely need a good reserve league competition. Going out on loan for me doesn’t help. You need a reserve team playing the same structures as the first team and players can step in when needed. Training is all well and good but it doesn’t replicate match pressure.

Not my point at all. The question was whether we really don’t have anyone more suitable than Sita to play on the wing? Does Danny Walker only merit 10 minutes off the bench in a game like Leeds? Do we really lack depth to the extent that someone is selected on the bench but not trusted to play?
The answer to these will give a pointer to whether we have an issue with strength in depth or there are issues regarding selection?

On the subject of young players, the majority on here think that Matty Ashton will play wing next year. Unless I’ve missed it can anyone confirm he’s been given a new contact next year. I thought his present one is up in November.

Also as mentioned in a previous post without a reserve team how does Riley Dean prove he worth a new contract

How does Riley Dean prove he’s worth a new contract without a reserve team.
We know that next year Widdop and Williams are our half back partnership and unless there’s an injury when will Riley play. The club have only given him to the end of next year.

I think it is Riley Dean's 20th birthday tomorrow (Wednesday). Widdop was 21 before he made his first team debut and only played three games that season.

We shouldn't expect too much too soon from young players.

Personally I like the mix we have at the moment. It does look as though some of the more elder members of the squad will be moving on and we will have an overall average younger age next year. Furthermore, I wouldn’t be too concerned about the opportunities to come given Powell’s decent track record with youth development.

In relation to the elder players on the way out:
i.e. Clark, Austin and possibly Hill moving on they are all in their 30s. (Lineham is 29 next month and looks certain to be on his way)

So I would expect the likes of Thewlis/Ashton to get more game time on the left wing spot. If Hill does leave, we have Butler and J Harrison ready to make the step up off the bench with Mulhern/Philbin starting. Williams is obviously 5 years younger than Austin.

With the likes of Walker, Wrench, Longstaff, Doro and Dean on the back of that I think those players will get their opportunities throughout next year under Powell. I would suspect a lot more then they would have under Price. Powell has more of a focus on developing and bringing on young talent - it was only a few months back he gave a 17 year old a starting spot on the wing to make his home debut, in which he scored an impressive try.

I think the difficultly Powell will face next year is having to knit the side together, there is a lot of comings and goings along with a fairly new HB partnership, which may take time to develop.

Lets be honestt, Powell has played a lot of younger players through necessity with a smaller squad at cas and quite a few seasons with a long injury list (which I hope won't be replicated here). Price has done similar last year, before the cup final and when we fielded a young team to get games on for a spell. His reputation for giving youngsters a chance is a little exaggerated, however what he will do is allow the players who look the part to keep the shirt and force their way in to his plans where they can flourish (Truema for example) which is I suppose what we have been guilty of, again long injury lists do help the youngsters cause.

Those are the sort of opportunities that younger players have to take, they can't shy away or just do the basics, then hey have to show something to catch the eye, that could be no errors, good control of tackled in the ruck or a few good eye catching tackles, line breaks, catches under pressure, support runs etc etc, basically anything that puts the team on the front foot. Thewlis, Longstaff and Dean (good vision for a pass and a gap) have IMO, Danny walker did too (even though I wasn't his biggest fan to start with, still think its obvious where he is going with that big foot plant). Robson and Doro haven't taken their opportunities IMO, rightly or wrongly my overall impression of doro is that he's too small to be a prop and he doesn't make much impact and robson is unspectacularly steady. I appreciate that may be an injustice to them both but they have to earn the next opportunity by showing they can have an impact at superleague level, even if they make a few mistakes, same goes for all younger players really. The more impact they have the more quickly a second opportunity will arise, I can see why there is no rush to get them back in the first team as they aren't moving ahead of anyone else through performance. I doubt Powell will be rushing younger players to the front at the expense of fully fit first team players but I do hope he will blood younger players who catch his eye in training to keep the first team on their toes fighting for their shirt.

Hmm, not sure I agree with that, the first part, cas fans have complained about his reluctance to bring academy players through, unless he absolutely has to, let's also not forget the initial rejection of the elite academy award, due to lack of production.

You can point to Trueman and Foster, but they were Bradford products brought in during their latest demise.

He's another coach that makes 4 changes to cover 1 player dropping out.

It’s a valid enough point. When the contract extensions to the 6 youngsters were given out though Riley Dean was only given to Nov 2022. Next year Widdop and Williams are our half backs. Unless Widdop is given occasional rests without an established reserve grade I worry that Riley won’t given the chance to prove his worth for 2023.
I only bang on about Riley Dean because what I’ve saw of him I think he has every chance of making it.

You say you don't agree then agree!

I said the long injury lists are what has given cas youngsters more opportunity and it was a similar situation here last season.

I honestly feel younger players have a great chance when they come in to the first team, they have to demonstrate no significant weakening to the team against an established player who is likely paid an awful lot more money than them in a salary capped sport. Toby King came in and offered no significant weakening against Ryan atkins who will have been on a shed load more cash so King gets a run of games. I remember early on against wigan King on the last play dabbed a kick through with nothing on and forced a drop out, that's a really big play for a young player under pressure showing composure and an ability to play what's in front of him. That's the sort of thing younger players have to do to catch the eye.

Demonstrate no significant weakening and a next chance will come sooner. I think longstaff is knocking on the door now, very young but he's looked the part to me as well. I'm a little dissapointed that Dean hasn't had a few more chances as he looked good when he played. I also understand the sentiment behind sita playing on the wing when wrench could have been given a go but we won the match so hard to criticise the coach too much.

It's terrible how few games youngsters are playing at the moment, no wonder they struggle to break through.

Out of all the contracts given out to the youngsters who have played first team, there’s only Nathan Roebuck and Matty Ashton who don’t seem to have deals for next season. It could possibly be a last minute deal for Nathan.
Is there any news on Matty or are the club waiting for him to prove his fitness.

CW what chances has Robson had that you don’t think he has taken? I genuinely can’t recall the times he has been given an opportunity this season, that may be a reflection on his performance or my memory to be fair.

I think the number of interchanges may be a factor in why Wrench didn't play any part at Headingley. If were now down to 10 (correct me if I'm wrong) then Hill and Cooper going off and then back on again takes up 4. If two further forwards also go off and come back on again, that's another 4, which leaves just 2. Not a lot of wriggle room if there's a knock or two to factor in.

Good point.

Absolute priority is getting young players and players returning from injury a game of rugby. If the reserves becomes part time or there are"friendly" games between clubs who can get a team together well so be it. Your playing life is relatively short and you need to be turning out every week.
It's a bad habit training and just watching others playing.