Ahem.......and you were saying ...

Well beaten. ......
And saints back on song and putting distance between us in the league.

Back on thread title

More plop rugby
Brown stealing a wage
Gidley getting even worse, yet his fan club on here still blowing smoke up his Aris'
Evans still being rubbish
High kicks to opposition full backs
Poor discipline
Halves where no tries are scored
Dwindling attendances
Smith STILL here, deciding shirt numbers for 2018

Me still being a realist

more pain and anguish.

So with all teams having played 13 games we now have distinct subgroups emerging in the table.

Current top 4: Cas 20, Hull 19, Salford/Leeds 18
Challengers for the top 4: Wigan 15, Wakefield 14
Fighting to secure top 8: Saints/Catalans/Warrington 11, Hudds 8
Likely to be in bottom 4 and 'qualifiers': Leigh 6, Widnes 5

So the SL season for us probably boils down to trying to be in the top two of a mini league of four containing us, Saints, Catalans, Hudds. The win over Saints last week was really significant in this context - if they were on 13 and we were on 9 they'd feel a lot happier.

If we make it to the top 8, we'll probably find ourselves way off the pace of the top 4 and early on in the Super 8s we'll be out of contention. However, I'm basing that on averaging out our performance over the season as a whole. It has been two halves: 0 points from the first 6 games and 11 from the next 7. IF it turns out that the first 6 weeks were an aberration and the last 7 are more a guide to where we are, then the top 4 would still be on. If we pick up points at the same rate in the final 10 weeks before the split, we'd have 26 or 27 points which based on the last couple of years would have us a couple of points off the top 4 going in to the Super 8s.

I am sceptical at this point that we will do that but it is worth noting that the past 7 weeks have been a lot better. We have harder fixtures coming up now, so in practice for us to keep picking up points at the same rate, we'll have had to record wins over sides currently above us. Whilst this makes it less likely that we will...if we did, we'd have closed space on them all.

It's unlikely that we will make the top four but the run of harder games is paradoxically just what we need really since we can't rely on the top teams dropping points, we need to take them away.

I think a crucial aspect of the second half of the year will be squad depth and injuries. As a case in point look at Wigan, you would have to say that they were the favourites in February but they have been decimated by injuries and are now adrift of the top group. They will be hoping to merely stay in touch at the moment and hope they get their injured players back later in the season. In contrast we only have a couple of players with long term injuries (ATM) and we have decent squad depth. providing Wire can continue with their form we may have a chance of sneaking into the top four.

I can't see both Salford and Leeds hanging on in to the 4 Sally, one if not both will slip out by rnd 30.
This league is reading false after the disastrous period for Wire and now Pies. Saints are where they are and Cats will be looking for a new coach soon.
I believe a first choice Wakefield 17 to be stronger than that of both Salford and Leeds, and barring injury, could be the team that knocks on the door at number 4 and may doom either Wigan or Wire.

This league is reading false???? Best one since your pre season league prediction!

Wigan will be top four.

Realistically after round 23 we need to be within 2 points of whichever team is in 4th place.
It would be difficult (not impossible) to make up more than 2 points during the super 8 rounds.
At the moment Salford and Leeds are both 7 points clear of us.
So to be within 2 points of them we need to make up 5 points on them in the next 10 rounds.
Leeds play Cas at magic weekend so I guess they have to play them again after that which could help.
To get anywhere near the grand final from where we are now would be amazing. The thing is I think the group of players are good enough, if we click and somehow win our next 3 games then it could start to look achievable. On the same token on recent form (apart from the last 60mins against saints and they are shocking) we could loose all 3 then SL is pretty much over for us.

Funnily enough that's what I think as a cas fan and that's including if your the opposition.
Judging by your performance on tv today there's not one wire player what could get in the cas first 17

Well, since they've already lost arguably their best player, for the season, we'll never know...

If you believe a player is only as good as their last game then you are deluded, but not alone.

OK which Warrington players would be first choice at Cas, based on form over the full season?

My reasoning for it, is from the SL positions at present, it's a far greater challenge to Wire to make it in to the top 4 than it is for Cas, hence the odds at the bookies who also agree.
So as Wire are technically giving everyone a start being off scratch, it's a monumental task. So if they do it...they will win it.

I prefer to think of...... if Andy Lynch was on the open market at the end of the season which clubs out of the recent trophy winning teams Wigan Leeds saints Wire and Hull would snap him up? .. none...is the answer..

there are plenty of Cas players I would think "no thank you not for me".
We have one centre and I still wouldn't take Jake Webster for a gold clock. How far down the England Hookers Pecking order is Paul Mcshane...?

So who would get in the Cas side?

Clarke
Hill
Atkins
Any more?

Ratchford, Westerman, Cooper and Currie would 100% and you could make cases for a few more (Russell, Hughes, Gidley, Patton, Philbin)

Flip it round, who would I take from Cas at Wire? Gale, Hardaker, Sene-Lefao, Shenton, McMeeken... Think that's probably it

Realistically the squads are very closely matched but I'd say on paper Wire's is slightly stronger. Obviously your team is clicking and ours isn't, but I'd put that down to coaching. Powell is certainly doing an excellent job over there. Playing like a well-oiled machine.

to be fair Cas are top and we are 9th and a bit rubbish

in 2011 the positions were reversed, we were league leaders by a mile and Cas finished 9th we beat them 62 nil that year, and wouldn't have touched a single player of theirs.
So for 3 of ours to get in the says something ......

not sure what it says but its definitely something....

Straight off the bat...

Westerman
Hill
Clark
Ratch

Ratchford ahead of Hardaker? (Or any other position) In your dreams. Hill for Lynch, yeah, and maybe Clark on the bench but that's it.

Seeing as Ratch plays Centre, Fullback, Stand off, Scrum Half and Loose forward yes, he would most definitely get a starting spot somewhere. Westerman 100% walks into any team.

Clark on the Bench? Good one

Hughes - really?

Who would you swap out for Gidley and Patton?

In January I would have said Hughes 100%, he was awesome for us last year. Admittedly he's struggled for form this year in a team struggling for form, but I think his performances have really been picking up lately I think he'd feature in Cas' first-choice 17 at least.

I think you mean who would I take from Cas over Gids and Patton? If so at present I would swap Gids for Gale in a heartbeat and I really rate Roberts too. Patton definitely isn't quite there yet and really needs to start putting his stamp on games on a more consistent basis. Still goes missing a bit too much for my liking, but he's promising for sure.

seriously you've posted this the week after Wayne Bennett picked Ratchford at fullback for England moving Hardaker to Centre.....

Genius wind up......

No you said the following nine players could get in the Cas side.

"Ratchford, Westerman, Cooper and Currie would 100% and you could make cases for a few more (Russell, Hughes, Gidley, Patton, Philbin)"

I questioned Hughes, Gidley and Patton and asked who would you drop from the Cas side to play them.

Ratchford wasn't even selected in the squad until Widdop had to drop out. Do try to keep up.