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| Quote ="Who are ya!!"Great, How many trophies or finals did you get too last year?
Answer's on a postcard and correctly answer this question right for a bonus point, why should of Bridge been sent off against Huddersfield?'"
One trophy same as Wire, strangely the same one Wire won in 2011. |
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| Quote ="Rogues Gallery"One trophy same as Wire, strangely the same one Wire won in 2011.'"
Funny that, as most Wiganers didn't see the LLS as a trophy, 16 months ago.
Looks like Brian has missed out on his bonus point, as he failed to answer the question regarding Chris Bridge.
At least the contestants on Mastermind had the good manners to say "PASS" to Magnusson/Anderson/Humphrys, when they couldn't answer the question. |
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God, this is terrible banter.
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The loss of Hock will be as beneficial to Wigan, as the gain will be to Widnes.
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Forgive me but why has Hock fallen out of favour at Wigan?
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| Quote ="Fresh Prince of Chesh-air"Forgive me but why has Hock fallen out of favour at Wigan?'"
Have a peep at the Wakey board. They have a very interesting thread running on the reasons.
THE HOOF |
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Quote ="Fresh Prince of Chesh-air"Forgive me but why has Hock fallen out of favour at Wigan?'"
Have you seen Ian Lenegan's comments in the press release. I've never seen a Chairman be so explicit:
www.wiganwarriors.com/WContent.a ... 869&type=1
- Twice since his ban Hock had threatened to leave and Wigan had increased his contract to keep him.
- He put in a request to go to Australia for a change of competition and social environment and Wigan agreed to that providing a financially beneficial approach came in to Wigan.
- Eventually good offers came in but now Hock doesn't want to go to Australia
- He is not happy about having his no.12 jersey removed
- He refused to turn up to pre-season training or rehab
- He has made it clear to the Chairman he is refusing to play for Wigan
- A line in the sand has to be drawn, Wigan would not let him go to a direct rival so they are sending him to Widnes
What a mess.
Even when Gleeson left, Lenegan did not air all Wigan's dirty laundry in public. I reckon Lenegan is really peed off that Hock has taken the mick out of them and has just vented in an official press release.
That is serious disrespect for the cherry and white jersey. Hock is now going to be hated by Wiganers forever and has basically erased his place in Wigan history. |
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Quote ="Fresh Prince of Chesh-air"Forgive me but why has Hock fallen out of favour at Wigan?'"
Have you seen Ian Lenegan's comments in the press release. I've never seen a Chairman be so explicit:
www.wiganwarriors.com/WContent.a ... 869&type=1
- Twice since his ban Hock had threatened to leave and Wigan had increased his contract to keep him.
- He put in a request to go to Australia for a change of competition and social environment and Wigan agreed to that providing a financially beneficial approach came in to Wigan.
- Eventually good offers came in but now Hock doesn't want to go to Australia
- He is not happy about having his no.12 jersey removed
- He refused to turn up to pre-season training or rehab
- He has made it clear to the Chairman he is refusing to play for Wigan
- A line in the sand has to be drawn, Wigan would not let him go to a direct rival so they are sending him to Widnes
What a mess.
Even when Gleeson left, Lenegan did not air all Wigan's dirty laundry in public. I reckon Lenegan is really peed off that Hock has taken the mick out of them and has just vented in an official press release.
That is serious disrespect for the cherry and white jersey. Hock is now going to be hated by Wiganers forever and has basically erased his place in Wigan history. | |
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| Quote ="Rogues Gallery"You know exactly what I meant. Wigans top 16 metre makers v Wire top metre makers.'"
What as in 1st v 1st, 2nd v 2nd because that isn't right as that would put for example Farrell with 1,908 against Monaghan with 1,945.
So what are you on about?
As for comparison between Hock and Westwood then you have to take in account how many games each played. According to the Superleague site Hock play 25 and Westwood 18 which mean Westwood's stats per game for metres and tackles are way above Hock's.
Anyway Hock is a good signing for Widnes and a further weakening of the Wigan squad. Funny you mention Warrington's aged players above. Last year you reckoned Warrington would have to go through major recruitment this year whilst Wigan's squad was going to be consistent. Funny how things have turned out isn't it? |
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The Wigan press release just confirms what most people have always suspected - Hock's a nasty piece of work on and off the pitch, doesn't know the meaning of the word loyalty and has no respect his teammates, the fans or the club that pays his wages.
I'm not a huge fan of Lenegan or Shaun Wane but I think they've handled this very well and shown Hock up for what he is.
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| Quote ="Paul Youane"What as in 1st v 1st, 2nd v 2nd because that isn't right as that would put for example Farrell with 1,908 against Monaghan with 1,945.
So what are you on about?
As for comparison between Hock and Westwood then you have to take in account how many games each played. According to the Superleague site Hock play 25 and Westwood 18 which mean Westwood's stats per game for metres and tackles are way above Hock's.
Anyway Hock is a good signing for Widnes and a further weakening of the Wigan squad. Funny you mention Warrington's aged players above. Last year you reckoned Warrington would have to go through major recruitment this year whilst Wigan's squad was going to be consistent. Funny how things have turned out isn't it?'"
What I said is that Wire will have to go through major recruitment, and they will. I didn't say this year.
On the head to head metre makers
Taking each clubs 1 - 17 (metre makers to make it simple for some) 
Wigan 13 (including the top six) Wire 4 (including the bottom one)
As usual PY you take snippets of posts and try to make them into something they are not.
HTH |
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| Quote ="Rogues Gallery"On the head to head metre makers
Taking each clubs 1 - 17 (metre makers to make it simple for some)
Wigan 13 (including the top six) Wire 4 (including the bottom one)
As usual PY you take snippets of posts and try to make them into something they are not.
HTH'"
You said:
Quote ="Rogues Gallery"In fact Wigans top 16 meters(sic) makers all made more than their Wire counterparts'"
I now have no idea what you are on about. Its not comparing like for like players, its not comparing 1st v 1st. Its not comparing squad number v squad number.
I think all this un-rest with Hock is getting to you. |
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| Quote ="Rogues Gallery"Yet Hock only gave away two more penalties than Ben Westood and made three hundred metres more with the ball.'"
Stat's are only half the story though Mr Gallery? The reason(s) that I wouldn't want him playing for us are probably to do with the way that he handles himself on and off the pitch, the fact that he appears not to be a team player.... Westwood on the other hand enthuses our team and fans with his raw commitment and effort.
So no his 'extra' 300 metres come with a price that I wouldn't pay |
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| Quote ="morrisseyisawire"The Wigan press release just confirms what most people have always suspected - Hock's a nasty piece of work on and off the pitch, doesn't know the meaning of the word loyalty and has no respect his teammates, the fans or the club that pays his wages.
I'm not a huge fan of Lenegan or Shaun Wane but I think they've handled this very well and shown Hock up for what he is.'"
and for nearly 10 years they've made excuses for him again and again and allowed him to keep on being a dick.
maybe if they'd actually let him be suspended and not keep him on tap he would've realised how close he was to losing his career, it would've given him the kick up the to sort his life out, instead they've molly coddled him to keep him onside so he wouldn't sign for anyone else.
Its not surprising whatsoever. |
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| Quote ="Thelonius"I can understand, and even agree with Wigan's, decision to keep a hold of his registration to prevent him moving to one of Wigan's main rivals (though I'm not so sure whether any of their main rivals would take a chance on him). But to include a clause preventing him from playing against Wigan seems extremely petty.'"
It is a bit petty.
It will give him a game off and let him take a rest. Tony Smith has been very shrewd in his rotating players over the last few seasons. |
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| Quote ="Rogues Gallery"Yet Hock only gave away two more penalties than Ben Westood and made three hundred metres more with the ball.'"
here are some stats on last season, just for you Rogues, seeing as you like them so much.
Westwood Carries 243, meters 1932 = 7.95 meters per carry
Hock Carries carries 331, meters 2238 = 6.76 meters per carry
Westwood - games 18, tackles 481 = 26.7 tackles per game
Hock - games 25, tackles 427 = 17.08 tackles per game
Westwood carries - 273 = 15.1 carries per game
Hock Carries - 331 = 13.2 carries per game
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Does anyone else think that this headline and story wouldn't be a surprise in July...(ala Tevez and Man City....
[size=150Hock returns to Wigan[/size
Gareth Hock has made a sensational return to Wigan Warriors today after a hit and miss loan spell at Widnes. Hock, who has played only 10 times for the Vikings this season, is ready to return to the DW Stadium after being shown the exit door only eight months a go. Wigan Chairman Ian Lenegan publicly slammed Hock after the second rower was accused of turning his back on the Cherry & Whites by refusing to go to training sessions or rehab after a shoulder injury. Lenegan said "A lot of water has passed under the bridge since then and we want quality players at this club. Gareth will strengthen our bid for a league and cup double". Wigan, who play Hull FC in this weekends challenge cup semi final can call upon the service of Hock as he sat out Widnes' 4th round 78-0 thrashing by Swinton Lions meaning he isn't cup tied and is eligible to be selected. Hock will also look to help the Warriors, who are currently 5th in Super League, to a strong finish and a Grand Final push.
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| Quote ="Fresh Prince of Chesh-air"Does anyone else think that this headline and story wouldn't be a surprise in July...(ala Tevez and Man City....
[size=150Hock returns to Wigan[/size
Gareth Hock has made a sensational return to Wigan Warriors today after a hit and miss loan spell at Widnes. Hock, who has played only 10 times for the Vikings this season, is ready to return to the DW Stadium after being shown the exit door only eight months a go. Wigan Chairman Ian Lenegan publicly slammed Hock after the second rower was accused of turning his back on the Cherry & Whites by refusing to go to training sessions or rehab after a shoulder injury. Lenegan said "A lot of water has passed under the bridge since then and we want quality players at this club. Gareth will strengthen our bid for a league and cup double". Wigan, who play Hull FC in this weekends challenge cup semi final can call upon the service of Hock as he sat out Widnes' 4th round 78-0 thrashing by Swinton Lions meaning he isn't cup tied and is eligible to be selected. Hock will also look to help the Warriors, who are currently 5th in Super League, to a strong finish and a Grand Final push.'"
Can't see them being as high as 5th in july tbh. |
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| Quote ="morleys_deckchair"here are some stats on last season, just for you Rogues, seeing as you like them so much.
Westwood Carries 243, meters 1932 = 7.95 meters per carry
Hock Carries carries 331, meters 2238 = 6.76 meters per carry
Westwood - games 18, tackles 481 = 26.7 tackles per game
Hock - games 25, tackles 427 = 17.08 tackles per game
Westwood carries - 273 = 15.1 carries per game
Hock Carries - 331 = 13.2 carries per game
'"
Now add the penalties, which is how this discussion began. |
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| Quote ="Rogues Gallery"Now add the penalties, which is how this discussion began.'"
someone said hock is a penalty machine, then YOU compared him to westwood and boasted about how he 'made three hundred metres more with the ball'.
I was then correcting you and showing Westwoods superiority with ball (and in defence)
But, if it makes you happy....
Westwood penalty's - 22 = 1.2 Penalty's per game
Hock penalty's - 24 = 0.96 Penalty's per game
So both players average 1 penalty per match
what was your point again? |
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| Quote ="Fresh Prince of Chesh-air"Does anyone else think that this headline and story wouldn't be a surprise in July...(ala Tevez and Man City....
[size=150Hock returns to Wigan[/size
Gareth Hock has made a sensational return to Wigan Warriors today after a hit and miss loan spell at Widnes. Hock, who has played only 10 times for the Vikings this season, is ready to return to the DW Stadium after being shown the exit door only eight months a go. Wigan Chairman Ian Lenegan publicly slammed Hock after the second rower was accused of turning his back on the Cherry & Whites by refusing to go to training sessions or rehab after a shoulder injury. Lenegan said "A lot of water has passed under the bridge since then and we want quality players at this club. Gareth will strengthen our bid for a league and cup double". Wigan, who play Hull FC in this weekends challenge cup semi final can call upon the service of Hock as he sat out Widnes' 4th round 78-0 thrashing by Swinton Lions meaning he isn't cup tied and is eligible to be selected. Hock will also look to help the Warriors, who are currently 5th in Super League, to a strong finish and a Grand Final push.'"
Can't see Widnes keeping Swinton to a score that low. |
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| Quote ="Paul Youane"You said:
I now have no idea what you are on about. Its not comparing like for like players, its not comparing 1st v 1st. Its not comparing squad number v squad number.
I think all this un-rest with Hock is getting to you.'"
Why feed the OAP troll ?
Hopefully the silly old fool will go strangely missing from this board when his team struggle this year. |
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Even if Hock was superior, he doesn't play for Wigan anymore
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| Quote ="morleys_deckchair"someone said hock is a penalty machine, then YOU compared him to westwood and boasted about how he 'made three hundred metres more with the ball'.
I was then correcting you and showing Westwoods superiority with ball (and in defence)
But, if it makes you happy....
Westwood penalty's - 22 = 1.2 Penalty's per game
Hock penalty's - 24 = 0.96 Penalty's per game
So both players average 1 penalty per match
what was your point again?'"
I am an appreciator of statistical analysis as anyone, but I think you may be misguided in this assistance.
Whilst penalties per game can be a reference point, I would argue penalties based on an average of tackles made would be a more accurate ratio. |
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| Quote ="Horatio Yed"Even if Hock was superior, he doesn't play for Wigan anymore'"
...........and isn't likely to play for them again. |
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| Quote ="Rogues Gallery"Now add the penalties, which is how this discussion began.'"
Quote ="morleys_deckchair"
Westwood penalty's - 22 = 1.2 Penalty's per game
Hock penalty's - 24 = 0.96 Penalty's per game
So both players average 1 penalty per match
what was your point again?'"
I'm a massive fan of stats, they allow the unintelligent to talk about the game of Rugby league as if they understand it... .......like the time Gareth Hock received a penalty for a punch on Ben Harrison.............one game one penalty in the world according to Rogues thats slightly better than Benny Westwood....
to normal people that watch the game with eyes and common sense and understanding Hock then got banned 5 matches for eye gouging.....that's not on a stat anywhere is it..........is it............   |
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