King and Hoffman for Joel Monaghan and Menzies for me but it's not a million miles off bar those.

As for the Roby/Monaghan debate I think the right player was selected tbh. I've stated on the VT and our board that Monaghan can count himself very unlucky as he's put in the best seasons worth of performances I've seen to not be selected in the dream team but Roby is a freak. He has put in a seasons worth of super human efforts that have kept Saints in the top 4.

But you miss a vital point in this assessment. We have been playing with two rookie halfbacks this season plus frequently changing combinations including a number of young players at a time. Simmons has been directing the team to play off Roby because of the inexperience we have had. That policy has taken us to third in the table and, had we won our three draws, would have left us right up there with Warrington and Wigan. It's not really been a policy detrimental to Saints has it? Mainly it's been our inexperience that has undermined us at crucial times.

Can't complain about Roby.
Monas has had a fantastic season for us though.

Very very suprised that King was left out.
I'd have to put him above Joel.
It might be his versatility cost him - 2nd row, wng, centre

I can only think that the huge chunk of games that he missed at the start of the season has counted against him because he's been brilliant this year.

Kings only played just over half a season and in them games has only been named at centre 3 times , so hard to pick him over Yeamo.

Out of interest, does Joel Monaghan play left or right wing or hads he played both regularly

joel's been right wing, kingy's played left and since coming back from injury he's been exceptional.

Joel's quietly gone about his business this year, done well, finished off well but apart from one or two tries you wouldn't say he's had the wow factor about him, whereas Matt has been killing it, knocking people on kick returns and really really putting a shift in, and so slapping some props around as well.

Joel's had a great first year but King has been awesome and should be in instead. Other than that can't really complain about the selection. I think Manu is unlucky not to be included.

I think this is spot on regarding Joel vs King, but considering that this is Joel's first SL season I think he's done brilliantly well. When you consider what King's first season was like, he's settled in perfectly.

Incidentally, I take it that one of the tries with the wow factor was against Hudds at home. I'm still not sure how he kept that in.

correct

That's very true.

I'll start by saying I haven't read this whole thread so apologies if I'm repeating a lot of what's been said.

I was surprised at M.Monas being left out. Then realised King had been left out. Surely not. Then Atkins hadn't been picked either.... Hmmm.....

But when I've sat and thought about it, as a Warrington fan I could pick an entire SL dream team from the Warrington squad, we've had so many stand-out players, but that's because I watch them week-in-week-out and see the talent, skill and effort they put in. I can imagine there are no fans out there who see enough neutral games to have a decent, objective view about whether players from other teams are better than our own. Most fans will only see the opposition players a handful of times a season, in home and away games plus Sky/BBC games, and even then the coverage (in the latter half of the season/cup) is biased towards the 'better' teams. The rest of people's opinions are usually formed by the thoughts/reviews of others; from the media or internet message boards. And that, as we all know, is very subjective.

We're all complaining that M.Monas has been left out because he's been so immense for us this season. But how many Warrington fans have seen more than 3/4 Saints games and can honestly compare Roby & Monas in an equal light? Or have your opinions of Roby's performance this season been formed by what you've read in the press? Or on here?

The same goes for other players. Why Yeaman and not King for example? Look at it this way: maybe the SL dream team is like fantasy RL. You can't have more than 3 players per club


If the SL dream team had in the players that many Wire fans seem to think [ishould[/i be in there, then that'd be half the team made up of our players.

The whole team should be Warrington: we ARE the SL Dream Team.

...And you call yourself a fan...

Agree with all of that bar Carmont. We have two centres that have been far superior to him in Atkins and Bridge.

Yeah, I thought the selection of George over Atkins and Bridge was a bit of an odd one - I hadn't realised he had been that good this year. As noted above, it's hard to be objective about these things. People are either biased or simply skewed towards their own team on the basis that they've seen more of them in the flesh.

It is indeed a strange one... if you put both centres up against carmont... they both have

more tries
more assists
more tackle busts
more clean breaks
less missed tackles

bizarre selection.

and yet when people say roby is better than monaghan and quote his stats as proof, you lot are up in arms...

I can't believe that Matt King, Michael Monaghan and Ryan Atkins didn't get in.

Matt King has been outstanding and minimum i'd have put him in ahead of Joel Monaghan on the wing, Ryan Atkins is showing a lot more consistency now and i'd say he's the most leathel centre in SL, Michael Monaghan is consistently pure class.

I would have gone for the following side.

1. S Tomkins
2. M King
3. K Yeaman
4. R Atkins
5. T Briscoe
6. L Briers
7. R Chase
8. G Carvell
9. M Monaghan
10. J Graham
11. J Tomkins (Yeh he's currently at centre but deserves to be in)
12. B Westwood
13. S O'Loughlin (Not a fan but their is nobody currently better at 13)

no one is really up in arms are they?

people just have an opinion..... if you look at stats then roby does go in ahead of monaghan.... so bridge and atkins should have gone in ahead of yeaman and carmont.

which way do you want it?

I wonder if the votes were split fairly evenly between them? I think the journos who voted for this got to pick a top three in each position and maybe they didn't want to vote for both of the centres at a particular club. Both Atkins and Bridge have had great seasons and it would be difficult to choose between them. Carmont and Joel Tomkins on the other hand...

Or people didn't have their Wire blinkers on, and can tell that George Carmont is a great player having a great season.

Quite correct. The journos nominate 3 for each position - 5 points for 1st choice, 3 for 2nd and 1 for 3rd - though wings, centres, props and second-rowers are a little hard done by in this system. There's twice as many of them, compared to the other positions, yet they only get the same amount of votes.

I didn't say he wasn't, I was just saying that he's far and away the best centre at Wigan, but it's more difficult to decide which of Wire's centres has had the better season.

its no wonder bridge or atkins didnt get in then.

There are good reasons for the vast majority of people's preferences. Club loyalty usually ends up as the determinate factor. The only player that doesn't deserve to be in the 'running' for me is Joel Tomkins. His defensive is bobbins.

It is at centre, just doesn't have the intelligence (yet hopefully) positionally with regards to overlaps, although the fact that Charnley is outside of him doesn't help either.

Not sure why anyone would be considering him for the dream team either at centre or 2nd row this year though.

Roby is more of a runner from dummy half where as monas takes up more of a role in the kicking game and is more of a passer from the play the ball