fair enough on both Points I'm a big fan of Bowen I think Wigan fans Will finally realise Tomkins actually wasnt the second Best full back in the World....... Bowen Will do a very good job....

and yes I do believe there will be a bit of transition for us, especially If we are finished with new signinigs then I think we may finish 3rd or fourth...........but i'll take that, as Ive been around to see previous seasons of transition which was us avoiding the bottom four...

its not the end of an era, or the end of the world..we are getting rid of some old players and replacing with younger........

We will still be a good team but not a top team. I doubt we will be anywhere near the final again for the foreseeable future.

I do...
we have like for like in props.
A back from Leeds.
we have been over run with 2nd rowers last season and this, we've shifted a few on to make room.
Still, there a surprise is in store after releasing Hodgson from the quota!!

we did that last year, people said we were belittling the league.

We've also been trying to manage our 20s from last year by utilizing swinton, again, people said we've been making a mockery of the situation, but its allowed us to get decent game time for the likes of Glenn Riley and Danny Bridge and a few others who aren't as close to the first team, those two will definitely be int eh first team squad next season along with laithwaite and brad dwyer, rhys evans and GOB.

You cant teach talent. you can advise what you should do in situations but whether they will do it is a different story. If you think by having someone learn from Tomkins and Bowen then you'll have created another Tomkins then I feel sorry for you.

You'll have a steady fullback who will no doubt have good positional play but in terms of flare you have no chance. Players like Sam come round almost never.

Sadly I think out chance of GF glory has now ended. We will be a 5th/6th team for the next few seasons and alas Smith will move on. We've had our chances and fell at the last hurdle. At least we can look back at the fantastic CC wins in 09, 10 and 12.

There's hope...i remember everyone including myself saying that about the pies after they let leuleui leave last season!!

And it's not like you to be off the mark!!

''You'' - I'm a leeds fan, so in reality i couldn't care less how it works out. But i've seen the young lad they have and he looks like he has alot of ptential. With experience he could be a quality player.

I think we will be much stronger next year without a doubt. Lets see who we bring in. I am waiting to be pleasantly surprised. I would like to see evans in next year ahead of bridge and hopefully with penny and any new signings speed up our back line and give us a threat from anywhere on the pitch. The warrington board have said that they aim to improve year on year. I have been impressed with glenn riley and think he will get better. Not seen much of asotasi or england. Dwyer has looked good in spells also. If we can get a couple of quality signings on board we will be back at old trafford next year. We were getting to old and a shake up will be good for the club.

I think we are pretty well covered but another prop and a top class half back would be on my shopping list

Why will Smith move on, surely the chances of Smith moving on would have been increased had we won, a case of mission accomplished? The defeat for me means unfinished business for Smith and of course the club why would he leave now?

Smith will go after next season, when the Red Devils sack Nobby. Also I think he will have taken us as far as a can.

Now, ladies and gents, here we have that very rare commodity on RLFANS,......................

................common sense

well done, biscuit!

As I've said previously, on other threads.
Morley. A SHADOW of where he was only a year ago. Adrian should have announced his forthcoming retirement (end of this season) in June. Unfortunately, he's prolonging it by another season. The fella is a legend. But, it's time to stop, now. But, I fear the "good" Doctor's cash me just be too much of a temptation.

Hodgson. Never let us down, despite his 9 stone frame. The guy epitomises commitment, and it's been a pleasure to see him in P&B for 3 seasons. Again, I think it's time he hung his boots up for a well earned retirement, but "Uncle" Marwan's cash might have swayed him.

Carvell. Now, I'll contradict myself (not for the first time), but I think he should have stayed. He's STILL devastating. A sad loss to our team. He's well capable of STILL doing a job for us.

Cooper. Ta for your efforts , lad. No complaints from me, bar you never really "kicked on" from an increadibly good start to your Wire career. I wish you good luck in your new career. I hope you haven't made a HUGE mistake, Aussie is tough.

Now, the "treachery" bit.
I think Briers and MonaghanM should have joined them

Briers is the same as Morley. It's been a season too far. His great games this season are few and far between. Likewise MonaghanM. His performance v Leeds in the play-offs was huge, but, like Briers, it's the exception rather than the rule.

This would've freed a ton of room on the salary cap. I think we've missed a trick.

To all those who are leaving........................THANK YOU.

You can't seriously think Simon Moran will let that happen do you?

Whilst he's around you'll be competing in finals because he'll back you.

he can back us, but as has been discussed many times on your , who is there to sign at the moment

I think chairmen can only influence so much, sport is cyclical and as much as any one chairman wants to be competing year on year sometimes there is a bit of a fallback whilst the team reestablishes itself.

Players like Morley and carvell aren't easy to replace, though Warrington have signed replacements it's hard to see how Asotasi and England are gonna improve on those two (no disrespect at all to those two players they just have big shoes to fill) so the money gets redistributed around through contract renewals and the teams a little weaker.

You then go through the same process next year with briers and Monaghan next year and your salary cap becomes a bit imbalanced and it takes a few years for it to become rebalanced and compete for the very top prize again - as someone else said saints have been through it over the last couple of years and I expect them to start coming back stronger next year.

Warrington will be up there no doubt but I think they may miss out on a few finals over the next years

Beetle you dont half talk tripe. How much have you seen morley and carvell play over the last year .... how much have you seen of asotasi and england. If england is like our last lower league prop then many wont be complaining. Have you seen much of glenn riley or ben currie. Gatcliffe has stated that they plan very early to build on the last year. There is no way that warrington will be weaker next year. Morley carvell and hodgson it was the right time for them to leave. In comparison to saints - the main difference is that we have a fantastic coach.

There are good players out there if your prepared to pay for them. We've proven that with Green and Taylor and there's now lads rumoured to be available for cash like Kirmond and Clark who would improve any team in superleague. What positions do you feel you need to recruit in? I'm sure whatever spot it is (bar maybe centre) there are lads that could improve you.

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Certainly not as much as you have, no question, but over the years they have been fantastic servants to Warrington and those types of players aren't easy to replace, whether it's a year too far or not

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Haven't seen much of England except what's been on TV - if he's as good as carvell he's a hell of a signing and great for Warrington but you can't say he definitely will be that strong

I've seen a lot of asotasi over the years, and he's had a decent season this year, and the reports I've seen say he credits a lot of that down to Michael Maguire - you just have to look at how he turned Wigan round to see what a fantastic coach he is and how well you can coach him to that level I don't know - also he is only a year younger than carvell so why get rid of one and sign another?

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Big if though isn't it

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Same can be said of all youngsters breaking in all teams - it doesn't give you a particular advantage over the likes of Wigan saints and Leeds are all bringing through players who have great reps in there academy and fans are excited to see get more first team action - who develops into internationals won't happen over 1 season (at least does very rarely).

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Coach saying they're looking to build shocker ... No one involved in any club will ever say we're gonna be rubbish next year

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In your opinion, I'm not saying I think you're a lot weaker, but I think you have a lot of players who are gonna looked to be replaced over the next few years and that inevitably causes problems

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Agreed - that doesn't make it any easier to replace them though - that' was my point to begin with




... I won't bother to get into a my dad's bigger arguement, saints management is as good as they come (hiring is more than just the coach) but have made mistakes that maybe Warrington will avoid

Navigating losing major players isn't easy no matter how past it they are

It's just my opinion

If Koukash sacks Noble next season then its pretty safe to say Simon Moran and Warrington present a better career choice than Koukash and Noble.

But if Noble was available then I would be less worried about Smith moving on elsewhere as we would have a coach of the same calibre available to pick up.

In fact if Smith moves on in the next few seasons to the NRL or whatever, Noble would probably be my top choice, he would no doubt love the chance to coach at a big club again.

There isn't enough depth of talent in the Academy teams to replace these players. Sintellins, Wigan and Leeds still are the clubs producing the volume young players capable of playing at the highest level and they are receiving coaching and support (for instance the St Helens U19s have just gone on an Australian tour) that we can't offer.

Warrington unfortunately will still have to bring in players to bolster the future of the club.

With regard to Smith, I am questioning where would he want to move on to?

Could that be down to John Bastion?
He didn't seem to be in favour of lads from Warrington. I think sts and Wigan have more lads from Warrington than we have?

Correct me if incorrect, heard that from a junior coach.

They don't favour lads from elsewhere but it is simply down to the fact there aren't enough players in Warrington playing at a good enough level. I am certainly not aware of that many players from Warrington being at other clubs Academies, I can only think of two or three. I am sure Warrington would love the Academy to be populated by players from the community clubs but I can't see that happening anytime soon.

Problem being when Warrington do bring players in from other local areas the cream of these players will already be signed.

However, whether we want to accept it or not the Academies at Wigan, Leeds and St Helens are are graded 'A' by the RFL for good reason and ours isn't. Why this is should be open to debate according to the criteria of measurement.