I was sat in the widnes stand with my family today.... There was a bit in the second half when williams jumped up and caught a ball in the air, only to be hit hard... when he got up and played the ball he fell back down to the floor and held his shoulder.... at this point LOADS of Widnes fans all jumped up and started cheering a laughing. with one bloke in his 40's, 2 rows infront of us (who was with his 3 kids),shouted "lets hope the wire scumbag has broke his f*****g neck)

classy.... never come across that before !

More like 8 or 9 'guaranteed' starters. We have the likes of Brown, Briscoe, Cross, Hanbury, Pickersgill, O'Carroll, Clarke and White to come in who will make up the match day 17. Craven is turning into a good player as shown by his 2 try's and has the ability to cover the halves, full back and hooker. The rest of the lads on show will be bench/fringe players but IMO we need a centre and a back rower to stand any chance of a move away from the basement area this season. We're still a newish side and hopefully the team will gel more in the second season in the absence of more 'big name signings'.



Wouldn't condone any of that but there is a diffrerence cheering a big hit and an opposition player feeling the effects of the knock rather than jeering a player who is lay motionless on the ground with who knows what type of injury he has!

Also i thought that young ref had a good game. he seemed to get the majority of the decisions correct... Pulling wire back from the full length of the field try was an odd one though....

The stick he got off the widnes fans was unbelievable though...for a friendly as well... every time he gave a decision to wire, they were foaming at the mouth.... ive never heard so many ginger related insults in my life.

The one thing that i will take away with me from the game was the number of times i heard up to 100 (probably more) people shout FOOOOOOOOOOOORWARD in unison... They have deffo been practicing that one for next season. They even made the saints fans look conservative in their appealing, and THAT takes some doing.

Funny how the more trophies you win the more you get catcalled, booed and jeered by the opposition.

Hmmm, does that translate to catcalling an 18 year old kid for dropping a high bomb....not sure how successful he's been. Anyhoo, enjoy the catcalling, it shows success has come your way..........up until the last few years it must have been a little dull listening to the polite applause that came your way......



Too roo folks, roll on the season proper!

Was very impressed by our youngsters and yours by that. Not a true reflection in how the seasons going to go. Let's be honest, we all know if both sides had their strongest 17 out, you'd win every time by 40+ really. However we wouldn't be playing you every game.

I went yesterday to really see with injuries, how our strength in depth was against a very mixed warrington team.

Our starting 17 for me would be

Briscoe
Ah van
Phelps
Marsh
ISa
Brown
Hanbury
Cross
White
Pickersgill
Allen
Winterstein
Cahill

Ocarroll
Davies
Clarke
Mellor/craven

1,6,7,8,9,10,14 and 16 didn't play yesterday.

2,3 and 13 never started and usually would.

With hanbury, brown, briscoe and phelps we have some very good players, our problem is going to get them playing all at the same time. Our full squad IMO can best anybody like cas, London, Salford, Wakefield on the day.

We're a long way off however from challenging you boys at the top. 4/5 significant signings needed next year. Well done yesterday, brought over 1000 fans which was impressive. I'd have Obrien back in a heart beat also.

The ref played 3 years worth of rules yesterday how anyone can say he had a good game is completely beyond me!

Friendlies early doors are basically young lads wanting to throw it about / put it about and make an impression Stokes ruined that basically quite early on.

Biggest difference in the two sides was just how secure Wire looked even after any half break. At times big gaps just appeared in the Widnes line that where punished without question. The other end looked far more set and organised which is a credit to youth and also the experienced lads that turned out.

IMO our youngsters were brilliant yesterday, a few let me down with expectations, Danny bridge for me was immense! Currie had a solid game same did laithewaite, Dwyer and saltonstall werent as impressive as I'd hope but both looked dangerous and to get a result against a near full strength Widnes team is a massive boosts for the lads

Read my other post.

I've give your lads credit but a near full strength widnes side? Get a grip

You had like 5-6 players that didn't play...thats near full strength we had I think 5 regular first teamers in Riley, coops, carvs, higham and wood on paper your side should have won

A weakened Wire team is going to be stronger than a weakened Widnes side. Goes without saying for numerous reasons. Would be interesting to see number of SL games played in between the two sides tbh.

Our starting 1,6,7 and 9 probably had less than 30 SL games between them etc. That lack of an organiser certainly showed too.

The Widnes side arguably reflected our likely SL side more but was still a very mixed 13 on the pitch throughout.

Yet again, FFS, read my post, I named At least 8 of our starting 17 that didn't play yesterday.

Doesn't really work though when we were missing 14 - Hodgson, Chris Bridge, Atkins, Joel Monaghan, Briers, Myler, Morley, Michael Monaghan, Waterhouse, Westwood, Harrison, Grix, Ratchford, Hill.

It shows that putting the time, effort and money into youth development does work and provides great strength in depth.

don't get me wrong you've upped your game immensely in that department and hopefully for the game it will pay immense dividends. But lets face it for the amount of time spent in Super League Warrington have hardly led the charge here!

That's correct. In the early 2000's we were miles behind. We identified it, rectified it, and we're reaping the rewards. We've won trophies in each of the last 4 years and home grown players have played a massive part in that. We're likely to win, or compete for, trophies for the next 10 years. Expect, at least, 50% of our 17 each week to be academy products.

I think lolling at this point is a bit like doing a Nelson Muntz about 12 years too late.

We had 6/7 of our home grown lads playing yesterday who by and large will get regular game time this season. Granted you had a lot of young lads out there who were impressive but when the names off your list, of which I'd say only one at best is home grown are available, how much gametime will the younger lads get?

Not a tremendous amount next season - one of the awkward side effects from having a team that was about 20 minutes away doing the double. As players retire, these will replace them. Evolution.

Well yes, that's what it should be about but in reality, after all this time in SL I'd have thought your 17 would include a lot more of your academy products. I'd say 4/5 of your regular 17 are home grown? We're in the position of having to play them along with a greater percentage of 'signings' due to our recent history.

We've put a lot of effort into youth ourselves and we have 1st team regulars who are youth development products and that's after not having the 'pick' of the youth in the game due to being out of SL for so long.

Oh, also I'd say out of Listers list of non starters for you, I'd say there were just as many Widnes academy players as there were Wire

!

Yet again you missed my point. I was never contesting the fact ho many players you were missing? I was contesting the fact that it WAS NOT near a fully fit widnes side that you beat. Obviously we had a mix of first team players in there but far far from our starting team.

Why? We were on our knees in 2001 - we were playing in a ground which cost us a 6 figure sum each year just to exist in. Our average gates were, what, about 6k? We were trying to move stadiums to safeguard our future. We had practically no youth development at all really, save for the odd lucky rafting. We had to create a fans group, Squadbuilder, to help grow that part of the club. Turning that around in 10 years to the point where almost 1/3 of our team are home grown is pretty good going. As I say, this will continue to improve - expect Currie to become a regular first teamer in 2013 - he's got the lot. We're still not where we need to be but we will get there. There were 8 home grown players in the team that dismantled yours last Easter remember.

The other point I made is valid. We have an excellent team, it's that much more difficult for players to break through. O'Brien would walk into your team. Actually, he did. He's on the fringes of ours because he has Myler, Briers and Ratchford in front of him (although Ratchford will replace Hodgson at FB so its Briers' shirt he should be after). I appreciate that may make me sound like an **** but honestly, that's not my intention - but it does illustrate my point rather.

As for having the pick of youngsters, I'm sure that will get easier the more established you become in SL/the top flight. If you're still here in 10 years, and there's no reason to suspect you won't, the quality will improve. One thing is 100% true - widnes' approach to recruitment and youth this time round is so much better than your last stint in SL.

My initial point by the way was more about certain Wire fans trying to preach they are the model youth club when in reality as later stated your only just starting to look at that talent pool as your first port of fall for back up players. Which is great and will he good to see how the likes of Currie, Evans and O'Brien (not sure he'd be first choice half at us but still quality and would most sides outside playoffs).

Warrington's first 13 would have what Riley maybe Harrison who count as home grown in the lineup? So still a way to go but still good progress. Leeds, Saints and Wigan have showed that powerful youth production is the main guarantee of sustained success. Tony Smith now seems to have took this view / been instructed too.

Makes the new academy changes even more ridiculous!

What Ian 77 Redux said. At our lowest point we closed down the A team to save money. It has taken a long time to repair that damage, but the youth policy has now been there for a few years and is paying dividends.

^ J20

Pretty much what I was getting at. Don't get me wrong, Wire look like they now have a great youth set up to complement a great first team but it's my opinion that your youth, considering the resources you now have at your disposal should be making greater inroads into your 1st team. Currie does indeed look like the real dal.

I take your point about where you were in 2001 but that is nowhere compared to where we've been yet we are producing/have produced more SL 1st team regulars than you have and arguably an equal amount of your own 1st team as you have!!

Redchemic - maybe I'm missing the point in what you are saying but I'm pretty sure not one of the above is a product of Widnes' Academy

You are confirming Ian 77's point. Widnes will gave a greater number of youth products for fiscal reasons. To assemble a SL squad, Widnes, like all newcomers will have to pay over the odds to get players with SL experience. inevitably, this will lead to a lesser sum of money to develop the squad depth. As has been alluded to above, I don't see any Academy products in the 17 stated.