I think you need to get yourself a new crystal ball there, because it’s talking complete .

Widnes would be a B grade club, playing to the full salary cap, immediately on entering Super League. We may struggle on the field for the first couple of seasons, that’s only to be expected, but they would be one of the most financially secure clubs in SL. The club didn’t amass any debt while in SL last time, and this time they are run far better and have a multi-millionaire backer in the form of Steve O’Connor. The Vikings have a SL attendance average of 6,500 - 7,000 – and that’s with a poor team heading for relegation. During the period we were in SL we averaged at least 1,500 more than Wakefield, Salford, Huddersfield and Harlequins. We also have excellent nationally recognised sponsors in Stobart and are getting more on board at a fair rate of knots. We've also just made £1million profit!

So could you please explain why we appear so weak to you, instead of just assuming that they will fail?

Because, it seems to me, that you know all about Widnes.

There's no doubt widnes will be a much better proposition this time round.

Out of interest, have widnes accounts showing this million pound profit been released yet? Pretty remarkable numbers and they must be doing something right.

They finished second in the Championship and got promoted from Championship 1 the season before due to playing 6 aussies who were illegally in the country.

oh well that's it then.... just because your mate doesn't THINK it will be ready he must be right...
who is your mate then? eamon mcmanus...

I think Wales needs more teams in the lower tiers of the domestic leagues first for it to work. Catalans have more french players in their team now but only because they have two other divisions of french teams to draw from. They need to spend more time and development on this at a lower level first.

start the expansion teams at a lower level giving them some success instead of throwing them into super league when they get battered in the first season and then people lose interest. back to a 12 team or even 10 team super league with relegation and promotion simples!

Rumours starting that the RFL are set to annonuce postponement of the 2012 licences until 2015 as Cas/Wakefield have threatened legal action against the RFL if they are not renewed whilst "crusaders" stay in super league.

rumours? where from?

Quote ="SLIMply the best"rumours? where from?'" www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A77003174

Quote ="SLIMply the best"rumours? where from?'" www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A77003174

Yeah it something that someone made up from the quality board of BBC606

Crusaders is working. It didnt the first year of their super league life. However when the new owners took over and moved to Wrexham they took on the old debt. They paid the tax man however Leighton Samuels wants his slice so the best way of making sure he doesnt is to wind the club up and relaunch. A bit like what Leeds United did.

Should they be in Super Leage next year I dont know but I would hope so. I stick by that Widnes should not have been allowed to come up in the last round.

But they have a chance next year along with Fax and Barrow. I dont think it should be nailed on that its Widnes.

Do those two points not kind of conflict with each other... what Crusaders are right to do Widnes should of been punished for?

As for fax and Barrow both those clubs spent soley on the first teams in the past three seasons whereas Widnes invested in the club, an academy thing that will see us well over the next 20 years at least not the next 2/3. That is what the RFL wanted from this current system and that is what only Widnes have given them (you could arguably include all SL clubs in that too as for some very little change / progress has been seen to date).

Can anyone offer an explanation for widnes' amazing financial performance? Incredible work really and something that should be shared with the rest of SuperLeague.

But surely if Celtic Crusaders are wound up and "Wrexham Crusaders" is a completely new outfit, have they even been through the procedure to applied for a SL licence.

Widnes were no where near ready for Super League last time around. you were lucky to have a club then let alone a Super League club.

And now they have......its called St Helens

i think they have a range of tickets in one of the boxes that are £100,000 each... people seem to buy them sometimes... but never actually go the game....

And again Crusaders will be this time as well as last year?


In what way were we not ready? Don't get me wrong we have improved a lot over the past few years off the field but where we 'in' the top 14 clubs in 2007? Without a doubt!

Going from one sponsor to about ten (& still growing) winning NRC, a full review of club the year before that made sure it was now fully cost effective etc etc.

Which all apply to Batley as well so where has the other £975,000 of profit for Widnes come from?


At the end of the day Widnes is a village between St Helens and Warrington and would bring nothing to Super League. If Crusaders do fold then the number of Super League teams should drop to 13 this year and 12 the year after when either Wakefield or Castleford should be kicked out (decide that by toss of a coin as they are as useless as each other).

Not sure that shows anything. I think the accounts will, whenever they are released.

Quote ="Ian 77 Redux"Not sure that shows anything. I think the accounts will, whenever they are released.'" A simple summary/explanation of Widnes' performance has been slipped into this worrying release on the Batley official website batleybulldogs.co.uk/index.php?o ... s-players-

Quote ="Ian 77 Redux"Not sure that shows anything. I think the accounts will, whenever they are released.'" A simple summary/explanation of Widnes' performance has been slipped into this worrying release on the Batley official website batleybulldogs.co.uk/index.php?o ... s-players-

[iApart from Widnes who made £1 million profit because the owner put £2 million into the Club I doubt there will be many if any who have declared a profit and the Widnes situation is hardly an achievement. We regrettably do not have a person who can put £2 million into the Club but we do know that we can compete with Clubs in our League both on and off the field.[/i

Widnes lost almost £1M in 2008 and posted a £1M profit in 2009 (despite losing 600 punters a match). The figures for 2009 were 'massaged' with the help of O'Connor to post a ridiculous profit. If you take his £2M input out of the equation, they made another £1M loss in 2009.

It'll probably fool the RFL though.

And you belive that whilst the same year Batley who won nothing and no playoff's made a profit? He's talking out his anus!

To be fair if Steve O'Connor has put that level of investment in then that is very encouraging.