Out of interest what would you do?

Drop a few or "go again" with the same?

Wrench centre for King, Longstaff comes in, Butler comes in, Dean comes in, Jack Darbyshire comes in

Dean for Widdop (although I thought Widdop did OK)
Walker for D. Clark
Hughes for Holmes
Longstaff for Currie

FB - Thewlis
Wing - Charnley
Wing - Ashton if fit
Centre - Matatutia
Centre - Wrench

SO Williams
SH Dean

Pack
Mulhearn Walker Cooper
Hughes Longstaff
Magolias


Bench
Burgess
Davis
J Clark
Butler


If Ashton is not fit then Gannon to SR, Hughes to centre and Wrench to Wing. Could even bench Widdop for utility value

We may not win, but have lost 4 on the bounce anyway playing the "stars". So I think we can see it's perfectly possible.

I coached. As a coach you know who your best players are cos you see 'em everyday in all sorts of situations. There is no club I have ever seen can afford to drop 5 of their "top" players in the hope that it will give them that rocket up the that will get them playing well again. My view ... you work on your best players. Despite what fans may think I have seen very few players who don't really try on the pitch. I reckon Widdop, King, Currie, Holmes & Philbin do not lack for effort.

There's plenty of examples of coaches dropping "top" players to remind them that nobody is bigger than the club.. Smith did it with Briers, Price did it with Austin.

It's a gamble, granted, but it's not unthinkable to drop an underperforming player for the sake of the team. Not playing and removing the pressure off that player for a week may be in their best interests.

Case by case

Yep ... but it is usually done from a position of strength. Not many have ever dropped five as the right honourable Cat was suggesting. Do not throw out the baby with the bathwater. Speccies always love players being dropped and coaches being sacked but sometimes you have to get back to reality.

Really, all he needs to drop is the player(s?) who are resisting the way he wants to play. If those 5 aren't any of the bad eggs then it's pointless dropping them. Sadly King looks like one of the players with doubts, he's been one of my favourite players for the past few seasons (pre contract renewal), he's mates with lineham and I wonder if there was any private discussion coming out there. Plus he isn't performing, hopefully that's wide of the mark and some much needed go forward will allow the Second rows and outside backs more space to work in. I'm not holding my breath though.

I know it can be done but would you really want that team to play vs. HKR with the hope that it might provide additional motivation to others sitting in the stand. If Powell selected that side next week (even I) would doubt his sanity.

While I totally understand the sentiment behind Powell's remarks, I must admit to being surprised about him being so public about the players & their abilities/efforts.

The aim of his remarks are obvious, he wants to almost embarrass them into performing, however this plan carries its risks, because the players could easily down tools.

If they did that, then it's essential that the board back the coach - This is where giving Powell adequate time to get things right is vital. If the board were to cave and fire him, then it makes the coach's job an almost impossible one in the future.

I think ultimately, Powell has laid down his mark here. By saying what he has, he has got his excuse in early for this season being a massive anti-climax. He has basically washed his hands (rightly) of any blame and made it clear to all, whether they be the board, fans, neutral observers and, most importantly, the players, that the guilty party for squad underachievement is solely down to them, the squad.

Quote ="Smiffy27"I coached. As a coach you know who your best players are cos you see 'em everyday in all sorts of situations. There is no club I have ever seen can afford to drop 5 of their "top" players in the hope that it will give them that rocket up the booty that will get them playing well again. My view ... you work on your best players. Despite what fans may think I have seen very few players who don't really try on the pitch. I reckon Widdop, King, Currie, Holmes & Philbin do not lack for effort.'" Fair enough. Who do we work on and what work do we do? May I ask if you saw the tackling attempts in this video https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=504374271285479 ? It looks like lack of effort to me. But that's the opinion of an armchair fan. However, the ex pro players on Premier TV on Sunday also said the effort was lacking in Warrington. Powell himself has commented on effort [i"“You’re looking at all the effort areas and we’re getting beat for effort – we’ve got to fix that up first." [/i [size=85D. Powell 19/3/2022 https://www.seriousaboutrl.com/daryl-po ... ity-50665/[/size So are they wrong? Anyhow you posed the question on how to create a team with those five players missing. All people have done is answer the question. We may lose, but we are losing anyway.

Quote ="Smiffy27"I coached. As a coach you know who your best players are cos you see 'em everyday in all sorts of situations. There is no club I have ever seen can afford to drop 5 of their "top" players in the hope that it will give them that rocket up the booty that will get them playing well again. My view ... you work on your best players. Despite what fans may think I have seen very few players who don't really try on the pitch. I reckon Widdop, King, Currie, Holmes & Philbin do not lack for effort.'" Fair enough. Who do we work on and what work do we do? May I ask if you saw the tackling attempts in this video https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=504374271285479 ? It looks like lack of effort to me. But that's the opinion of an armchair fan. However, the ex pro players on Premier TV on Sunday also said the effort was lacking in Warrington. Powell himself has commented on effort [i"“You’re looking at all the effort areas and we’re getting beat for effort – we’ve got to fix that up first." [/i [size=85D. Powell 19/3/2022 https://www.seriousaboutrl.com/daryl-po ... ity-50665/[/size So are they wrong? Anyhow you posed the question on how to create a team with those five players missing. All people have done is answer the question. We may lose, but we are losing anyway.

If king and philbin are currently giving everything in terms of effort then they both need shipping out to widnes,...........permanently!

I think it's a strong move by Powell. I'm sick of hearing all the usual platitudes trotted out that you normally get. We stink currently and everyone knows we do, no point trying to hide it.

I'm sure the powers that be will back Powell, otherwise it will be like Lord of the Flies in the dressing room going forward.

Quote ="Wires71"Fair enough. Who do we work on and what work do we do? May I ask if you saw the tackling attempts in this video https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=504374271285479 ? It looks like lack of effort to me. But that's the opinion of an armchair fan. However, the ex pro players on Premier TV on Sunday also said the effort was lacking in Warrington. Powell himself has commented on effort [i"“You’re looking at all the effort areas and we’re getting beat for effort – we’ve got to fix that up first." [/i [size=85D. Powell 19/3/2022 https://www.seriousaboutrl.com/daryl-po ... ity-50665/[/size So are they wrong? Anyhow you posed the question on how to create a team with those five players missing. All people have done is answer the question. We may lose, but we are losing anyway.'" Sorry I cannot reply to all of this. But ... I have just watched the clip of the Wakey try. Blimey you can't blame a lack of effort for the last few "attempts". Charnley, Williams, & Thewlis. You have to look at how the break was initially made.

Quote ="Wires71"Fair enough. Who do we work on and what work do we do? May I ask if you saw the tackling attempts in this video https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=504374271285479 ? It looks like lack of effort to me. But that's the opinion of an armchair fan. However, the ex pro players on Premier TV on Sunday also said the effort was lacking in Warrington. Powell himself has commented on effort [i"“You’re looking at all the effort areas and we’re getting beat for effort – we’ve got to fix that up first." [/i [size=85D. Powell 19/3/2022 https://www.seriousaboutrl.com/daryl-po ... ity-50665/[/size So are they wrong? Anyhow you posed the question on how to create a team with those five players missing. All people have done is answer the question. We may lose, but we are losing anyway.'" Sorry I cannot reply to all of this. But ... I have just watched the clip of the Wakey try. Blimey you can't blame a lack of effort for the last few "attempts". Charnley, Williams, & Thewlis. You have to look at how the break was initially made.

Fair point, I'm gonna cheat then and go easy on currie and King and not drop them, but give them a shot across the bows.

I like shot across the bows. Never drop five players ... unless you are playing Blackpool Borough or Huyton.

Still Top Poster on here Smithy, but just have to correct a minor, inconsequential, mint imperial detail there, and in correct order

With all this head butting going on and general lumber int mill, just who are regarded as the hard knocks in our squad at present, you know, the guys that all the other players would always defer to and never challenge but would look to on the pitch when the going got tough. I don’t see anyone


Have we got a Team Cock any more

Yes, a certain someone rushing out of the line, causing a gap, being beaten by footwork then ineffective tackle.

Anyway you said you don't doubt effort, yet Powell and ex pros do. Someone has to be wrong.

Who was it in your day? Sculthorpe? Ellis? Shelford?

All I can say is in my very humble experience the vast majority of players try very very hard but fail for other reasons.
Fear of failure and pressure of expectation, ability (of course) and coaching ... usually more of a problem.

Difficult to comment on some of the twaddle that comes out at times when an ex-player suddenly has a microphone in his hands.

re. Powell ... not clear on exactly what he said re. effort. Did he suggest a lack of effort? If he did .. well it is dead easy to solve that one.

Quote ="Smiffy27"All I can say is in my very humble experience the vast majority of players try very very hard but fail for other reasons. Fear of failure and pressure of expectation, ability (of course) and coaching ... usually more of a problem. Difficult to comment on some of the twaddle that comes out at times when an ex-player suddenly has a microphone in his hands. re. Powell ... not clear on exactly what he said re. effort. Did he suggest a lack of effort? If he did .. well it is dead easy to solve that one.'" [iDP: We’re 12-0 up today – that’s a great platform from which to go and win a game. If we get something wrong – give a penalty away, for example – we are under so much pressure and we cannot keep a team out on our own try line. Some of that is effort, which is unacceptable really. Completely unacceptable. [/i https://www.warringtonguardian.co.uk/ne ... -cup-exit/

Quote ="Smiffy27"All I can say is in my very humble experience the vast majority of players try very very hard but fail for other reasons. Fear of failure and pressure of expectation, ability (of course) and coaching ... usually more of a problem. Difficult to comment on some of the twaddle that comes out at times when an ex-player suddenly has a microphone in his hands. re. Powell ... not clear on exactly what he said re. effort. Did he suggest a lack of effort? If he did .. well it is dead easy to solve that one.'" [iDP: We’re 12-0 up today – that’s a great platform from which to go and win a game. If we get something wrong – give a penalty away, for example – we are under so much pressure and we cannot keep a team out on our own try line. Some of that is effort, which is unacceptable really. Completely unacceptable. [/i https://www.warringtonguardian.co.uk/ne ... -cup-exit/

Quote ="Wires71"[i Some of that is effort, which is unacceptable really. Completely unacceptable. [/i https://www.warringtonguardian.co.uk/ne ... -cup-exit/'" Should be relatively easy to solve.

Quote ="Wires71"[i Some of that is effort, which is unacceptable really. Completely unacceptable. [/i https://www.warringtonguardian.co.uk/ne ... -cup-exit/'" Should be relatively easy to solve.

There's no ambiguity here, Powell has quite clearly said that players are not playing to instruction, are wilting under pressure and in some cases lacking effort. He didn't dodge blame himself, and emphasised the "all in it together" mantra but he didn't shield the players from blame.

And good on him. Some of these players have been wallowing around in a comfort zone for years and failed to deliver on the talent they seem to think they possess.

The reaction of the players and the respect they have for the coaching staff will be the acid test in the coming weeks. They'll either pull away from the coach or they'll dig in for him.

Well he should've had that conversation last week. We might still be in the cup by now. He’s not without accountability.

Good on him is right. You would have to say that our defence looks worse than last year. Price did improve our defence almost immediately but of course our attacking ideas were limited.