Seems we let some of the wrong players go when our former cast offs are coming back to haunt the Wire.

Let's not try and rewrite history here, lads .. Widdop and Austin were both as big a waste of spaces as any of our present bunch AND they stole 3 years of marquee money while being so...

That reminds me of the cartoon that helped make people to be aware of the coastguard service, with Petunia and Joe sat on the beach watching a bloke out at sea in a sailing "dingy".

It's the lack of accountability that I can't stand. I didn't like the early narrative last year of a few bad eggs in the camp being the problem. It's a coaches job to get the best out of what he's got.

And the lack of improvement, infact its actually regression in all areas of our play - wtf do they do in training? How about working on reducing the stupid errors. How about suring things up at the back and completing sets. How about having some kind of ideas in attack. These players of course could do better but they aren't bad players. They look lost, frustrated and devoid of any kind of game plan....and that I'm afraid is 100% down to the coaching set up. And if it's a 3 year plan it's a rubbish plan if years 1 and 2 are absolute gash

They just aren't a very good side, simple as.

While sacking Powell might seem a viable and attractive option right now, what would it actually achieve in reality?

Yes, we'd probably get a 2 or 3 game new coach 'bounce', but once that novelty wears off, we'll still be left with a lot of average Joe's who are no better than many of the sides loitering around the bottom half of the table.

But these are the players he's decided he wants Dita???? This is his assembled side.

If we get rid of Powell we 'could' get Justin Holbrook. Holbrook would do a lot better with this group of players and then he'd set about adding some quality I should imagine - ridding the side of Matautia, Minikin, Dudson, Dufty, Ratchford....and a few others.

As Powell himself stated Leeds made the GF when changing coach mid-season and Holbrook was a conversion away from a GF in his first half season.

Not sure we could get a coach that would give us a poorer win record than Powell has - but then again KFP may well go and get John Kear.

That Leeds side got to the final almost by default, on the premise that the rest of the league is so mediocre. Admittedly, the same thing could happen for us, but in the lottery that is this season's SL, there's as much probability of us just continuing our slide down the table.

I'm not trying to defend Powell by the way - I thought last night was indefensible - but I just fail to see the quality in our side that gets us near a GF. And yes, it's Powell's team and so he has to take responsibility, but I'm not sure this sacking him midway through a season changes much, when ultimately, our squad isn't upto that much.

It will put an early end to what would've been a very, very painful 3 year stint. HIS squad is weak and it seems he's determined to make it weaker - Dwyer - retention of Matautia. Getting rid now may achieve nothing this season but keeping him will achieve nothing but further pain.

Like I say, I'm not defending him. I've always stated that a finish outside the top 6 should put his Wire stay at an end and I certainly agree I'd like to be hearing about far more positive stuff on the recruitment front than what we presently have.

But again, I think our problems as a club as a whole go far deeper than simply sacking Powell.

Which I said somewhere that Powell is not wholly responsible for this mess we are in now, but normal routine of any sports team is sack the coach/ manager. But in this case we have had issues for longer than Powell has been here it goes further back it’s poor Director decisions and Fitzpatrick is the front of that even if poeple say well it’s Moran that signs the checks etc.the back office as got to take some responsibility.

Actually the thing that annoys me about Powell right now is coming out and saying he dislikes the booing, well he needs to remember the team gets paid to play and the fans pay to watch, we can take a defeat if the effort is there but when was last time we saw effort Catalan in the cup?

Sorry, sorry, SORRY but I do not for one second buy the argument that a good coach, respected by the players couldn't get a level of success with this team. Not a GF win maybe, but CC was achievable and top 4 should have been nailed on after the start we had.

This squad beat Catalans in France twice. They can do it when they want to, but for whatever reason they have downed tools.

Lam at Leigh and Peters at HKR prove what a good coach can do with a squad built on passion, mutual reapect, organisation and commitment ..... and coaching.

So genuine question - do you think Leighs group of misfits and rejects are a better side than us?

I don't. However Lam is getting every ounce out of his players while Powell is underachieving with a better squad. And I would say there's every reason to change the coaching set up now and virtually no reasons to perserve with something that's failing with very little signs of turning around.

The "what have we got to lose" argument is quite pervasive. I dont think we are on the cusp of building a dynasty with DP. In fact I think we are watching the train derail in slow motion.

I can't imagine any decent coach doing any worse and we may get a turnaround with a change.

Its only pity that i want to give him a chance

We're down to 4th and theres a good chsnce we wlll be out of the top 6 in the next couple of weeks

Saints were not that great tonight, maybe their minds were on the big game next week

but they will still beat us. Wigan week after well it’s Wigan and then Wakefield who seem to be starting something, fills you with joy does it not

We're in the worst of all situations. We were mired in mediocrity and brought in a coach who would clean house and bring a new culture. Sensible decision.

There now seem to be a whole load of different problems with the culture with these guys who we have brought in than with the guys we had before. I'm sure some of them are looking at Wire now and thinking "Ha - see, we weren't the problem". Lots of them were the problem, it was right to get rid of them, what we got wrong was who we brought in.

Now if we bring in a new coach they will be inheriting guys they didn't necessarily want, and it will take a few years for contracts to expire and do another job of cleaning house.

I would give Powell to the end of this season at least and see where we are with his squad. Probably down the bottom end of the table again. But if we're going to do another job of cleaning house we need to go deeper than the coach and players, we need to overhaul the whole approach to recruitment because for about a decade our recruitment has been garbage. Year after year we bring in players who don't work out.

We throw money at overseas players without being certain other than the motivation of the cash the reason for coming....unless someone is coming because it's part of a greater holistic desire to play and experience with their family for a couple of years a different culture they really shouldn't be on the plane nor considered by the club because the homesick card is something that should have been more thoroughly considered by an incoming player before getting to the airport rather than just the cheque on arrival

misfits and rejects??? wow! I wouldn't go that far, but.................................

Atm yes! 2nd in league, and in semi final of cc. TBH - It looks like Powelly is losing the dressing room.

I don’t agree that our squad is better. Leigh have much better centres, a better hooker, a half as good as Williams and in better form, more punch in the pack (certainly second row - no not Holmes), a winger on fire and more playmakers.

I think Powell has got an average squad playing badly and that’s why we’re in a mess.

Haha yeah fair enough a bit strong maybe buy what, they've got 6 of our former players that weren't deemed good enough, hardaker who is decent but seemingly difficult to manage, Briscoe who leeds didn't want to keep, mellor who I'm sure we've been linked with over the years and most on here didn't think he was good enough......

The point I was trying to make (albeit badly) was a good coach will find a way to get the best out of players and unfortunately that's not happening with us. I watch leigh playing with energy, working for each other and exciting in attack and frankly I'm jealous.

I'm not saying our recruitment hasn't been pap and that's another serious issue, but a coach has to work with what he's got until he can change it. Powell has been given the chance to change it and non of our playing issues have gone away - like I see zero improvement anywhere

Good honest post that bud.

Im not sure what the issue(s) is / are but the one thing i know is that this group of players CAN win, they can catch the ball, they can stop throwing forward passes, they can play the ball properly and they can match and better every team in this league.............but they dont.

Some people are saying we are bang average at best, and that might be the case, but then no other team in the league are outstanding and, on that point alone, we should be able to compete.

The defensive line is atrocious, by the time we've moved up after the opponent has played the ball, it has already moved through several sets of hands and the organised move is in motion, meaning any creative player coming up against us can pick his pass at will........Contrast that with Saints, Catalan and Wigan, their defensive line is on top of us before we have the first clue who to pass to.

When we do eventually get to the opposition 20, we are clueless in attack...meaning the defensive line has no hard decisions to make AT ALL.

But compare all of that to the start of the season and we could defend, we looked sharp and organised in attack and could damage teams from most areas of the pitch.......so what has changed? Why dont we look bothered, why dont we care, why arent we bending our backs and getting stuck in? Why have the mistakes got a grip of us, why are our heads down when we all KNOW (fans and players alike) we can do better??

I think its not just the players and playing staff, I would guess that of our back room staff and other positions they would not even get to the interview stage at wigan saints or Leeds.....

DP is struggling with the players as there are two camps, one pro Maguire and the other in the eyes of the pro Maguire are too friendly with Charnley and he can't get them to play nicely either in training or on a match day. Somebody in the hierarchical structure needs to take control of the situation before the club and fans implode.

Well they all seemed to be getting along at this golf day and subsequent drinks on Friday night so I'm not sure how much this supposed rift is just an excuse. We were playing poorly before McGuire did what he was alleged to have done. Bar Drinkwater we were at full strength (I think) at Leigh when they walloped us. I think we got off to a good start due to catching teams cold and not playing at their best and we were enthusiastic and adventurous with ball in hand. Enthusiasm and adventure, which have both disappeared, got a very average (and lightweight) squad only so far, I think when the final table sees us outside the top 6 it won't be lying.