Firstly good luck to the stakeholders of Bradford in their quest for survival.

Secondly when will we stop this franchise experiment that simply isn't working and killing non SL heartland clubs.
The process is obviously a joke eg Wakfield and Cru, and how many SL clubs have hit financial meltdown in recent years after being given the green light for finance by our impartial auditors


Two divisions of 10 must be implemented from next season, it will allow the Bradfords to build again in a FT culture, it will allow the Fax/Fevs/Leighs to challenge themselves to build a FT culture, It will allow the cream to improve intensity without resting players en bloc eg Wigan at Widnes, and making a mockery of the fixture, It allows a second French club in and provides a platform to expand the game and the player pool.

Scrap Franchising in its current format NOW !!

You are just using this circumstance as an excuse to introduce the measures you think are in your own club's best interests. There is no guarantee than the Bulls would have been better off under P & R. This is financial mismanagement and looks to me pretty unrelated to p & r. The RFL should have probed into this better than they did, no mistake about it, but this is pretty low.

This two league of ten idea has been touted in good and bad times and the second you suggested it, it became obvious what your motivations were. It's not a very good suggestion no matter when it's forwarded.

I'm not sure Promotion and relegation would help now. Especially as Saints are 9th and could possibly go down

And your clubs interests and your motivations for saying it is a bad idea is what Chris ?

I have always thought P&R is the fairest way to run a sport, the problem will be that if two divisions of 10 are introduced sooner or later the 10 in the top tier will want to choke off the 10 in the bottom. Our sport has a habit of maintaining self interest of the wealthier clubs over the rest.

Could you rearrange your sentence into something which makes sense?

Actually, let's pretend that the following 10 page conversation about mine and your motivations have already been played out. We could both construct it in our minds by now.

Maurice words his post like two leagues of ten is something of great urgency. It isn't. It would have done nothing for Bradford, in fact, it's completely irrelevant. Ergo, it's pretty crass and desperate.

Ok , you are suggesting that Maurices idea has Leighs best interests at the heart of it , you suggesting it is a bad idea has your clubs best interests at the heart of it

Is that simple enough for you ?

So would there be some sort of system for vetting those teams that would make the 2x10 divisions,looking into the financial stability or their youth set up etc. ??

I made it clear, I knew what you were getting at. I just think it's a completely boring and unhelpful game to play for 30 odd pages. It's a stupid argument to be having and I can't be bothered.

Now is that simple enough for you?

The game itself matters much more than petty club jealousies and rivalries at a time like this.

But the RFL and the wholefranchise system certainly deserves to come under the microscope and the blow-torch of forensic and pointed questioning. There have been some shady goings on have there not ?

I do hope we're not going to receive SOME bland statement from the powers-that-be followed by 'no further questions will be answered on this subject' as so often happens.

I mean, isn't it about time they were answerable to the game's true stake-holders - the fans ?

Almost pi$$ed myself then

Having a license system is not the problem. Its the clowns running the sport that are the problem.

In my eyes (again I am using this to support what I already thought) this looks like more evidence the league needs to be reduced and the sky money shared out 10/12 ways rather than 14.

Looking forward it would be good to have a larger league with more teams but at the moment we are losing too much quality. There are still 4/5 teams in the league that struggle to stay in business and operate well under the salary cap. Then at the same time the top teams are not allowed to pay their players the money required to stop them going to the RFU and NRL.

The current league does not provide elite teams or a competitive completion.

I don't think there is anything wrong with the franchise system as it is. The problems arise when it isn't implememented and monitored properly. I mean, weren't Bradford granted a "B" Grade less than 12 months ago? Surely a black hole in there finances to the tune of £1 million would have pretty visible when their books were looked at?

why ?

Have you a bladder problem ?

How do you attract investment if you aren't going to win anything or you won't be allowed into SL.
The drawbridge only effects a few clubs add those to the 14 and expand in France and you have your 2 x 10 whilst the next tier prove their capabilities to expand to 2 x 12. 1 up/down annually.
Dalton knows where the Vikings would be without the SL guarantee they were given.
Franchising is killing our sport at the roots, whilst only being of relevance to a few clubs as the top clubs will always be top clubs.
Over the last 50 years the downs of the Wigans, Leeds, Saints, Wire etc have been few and far between, whilst the history of the Cas, Wakey, Hudds, HKR, Salford's hasn't been greatly different to the Fax, Fev, Leigh, Oldham's of the world.
Its time to be inclusive not exclusive, it's time for unity not division - we have a very real threat from the RFU and we won't tackle it if we are weak.

2 leagues of 10 wont help anyone. Firstly it would mean less games which in turn leads to less income. The players would not willingly take less money because they would be playing less games either, so you would end up with teams paying out the same amount of money yet receiving much less. I don't see how that can work, please explain.

It doesn't have to mean less games, it could mean you play each team three times instead of two. Those games would hopefully be more competitive, more attractive to audiences and hopefully attract bigger attendances because it's likely that the best supported teams will generally be within the top 10.

The more serious issue would be what happened to the teams in the lower league. That League would need a good television deal to provide adequate funding, because in order to be successful it would need to be much closer to Super League level than the Championship currently is.

I'd seriously doubt that a 'two tier Super League' would be sustainable with both league's being under the guise of 'Super League'. Sky would only care about the highest league and that's where all the money would go.

I don't think anyone on these forums would know the ins and outs of such a decision and how feasible it would be so it's all hypothetical.

If you look at the 3 teams that screwed up in the last couple of years.

Crusaders - Mr Moss took everyone for a ride including Wrexham fc. He was only intrested in the money and selling the ground for a nice payday.

Wakefield - old Ted towards the end was clueless no cash and was running the club like a semi pro team. Look at the change since the new guy has come in.

Bradford - Again short term planning for this guy. 2 years on the bounce they have sold cheap season tickets. They sold a large amount but how many go each week. The ones that do go are then handing the cash saved into the burger vans etc which are not run by the club. He has no cash to support the club & no idea how to get extra cash in.

If we were to go back to P&R no doubt we would have a couple of teams who would be yo-yoing inbetween leagues and at least one of them going belly up as they would be paying full time cash but playing in front of a 4,000 people each week. Do Leigh, Fax or Fev have backers who could support this? (maybe fev with probiz coming on board)

Its not the SC or the RFL, its the clubs managing outside of their finances

The SC prevents excessive expenditure-It holds wealthy clubs back such as Wigan and Wire rather than hinders less wealthy clubs. They should be the ones complaining about it

How on earth is the supposition (which is nonsense) that franchising is killing non-sl heartland sides responsible for Bradfords problems.

Some on here will look for any excuse-The answer is in the mirror, Bulls Board

Of course it is the Bulls BOD fault, the RFL criticism is only relevant to the fairly recent awarding of a licence to a club with serious financial problems

The situation with the licencing issue is that it was supposed to stop things like this happening , but it seems it doesnt

It isnt supposed to stop things like this happening, no system, ever, not even your precious promotion and relegation can stop it happening.

Its just supposed to make it less likely and easier to deal with when it does.