Took players heads off.

You go and do your homework ! I'm not doing it for you.

So nothing different then

And that didnt win us a competition either

To a certain extent I agree with the original poster regarding out and out prop forwards. But I think these days there seems to be very few specialist players overall.

And just as you've asked for examples above... For me, the prop should always be the biggest player on the field, the one you give the ball to when you need to smash through the defence (I bet that wasn't said above because it seemed pretty obvious?). Or the big hit you want in the middle of the field, and obviously size would be an advantage. In teams in the past you knew who the props were. Even recently, say early 2000s you look at a team like Bradford, Wigan or Saints (just using these as it's easier to think of names around this time) and you'd know straight away that Anderson, Vagana, Cowie, O'Connor, Matautia and Fairleigh were the props in the team. They couldn't really play anywhere else, but their size was a great advantage.

Last season a hell of a lot of 2nd rowers were playing or at least covering at prop, looking at the same teams theres not a massive difference in the size of the props to the 2nd rowers. Now as long as you can run hard and straight and tackle well you'll be able to play prop. But that's just the way the games changed I suppose.

You could have this same debate about any position though. Most Wingers on the field have been used as a full back at some point, or at centres too in some cases. loose forwards have been put at 6. 2nd row can easily cover the centre positions, fill in at loose forward or cover prop. Props are being used as a loose forward if a bigger pack overall is wanted. stand offs at full back, players who have always been a 6 have played 7, and as long as you can pass a ball you can cover 9.

It's the game evolving, most players on the pitch now are able to cover more than one position, so the "traditional prop" that I think the original post is talking about isn't as desirable as a player that could tackle well, run hard and could cover other positions if needed.

So far we have established that prop forwards need to be big

Craig Huby?

Should be in for a good year this time with a full pre-season unlike last year.

Yes he's big

In answer to the OP

No. Not a chance.

Some coaches like to bandy phrases like "lightweight mobile pack" but they are synonyms for "beaten pack". Just look at the Giants at the back end of last season, regularly beaten by any team with a decent set of forwards

Rugby League is still the same game I essence. The pack needs to gain dominance in the midfield to allow the halfbacks space to get the backs into space.

Note as well the consensus that props don't hit their best till their late 20s means you just don't get "young props" that often, those that are can be called exceptional.

Look at the set of props England could pick and all of them are top notch and as good as any that's gone before.

I think it's a deeper set issue than just game development. Our players are full-time professionals now so lard diets are out of the window. Everybody is big these days and not just props.

Not all props are big look at P Gallen not the biggest but i would say the best.

and here is a few more Wiki,Pongia,Assotasi,all these guys 6ft and all just over 100kgs.

You could add that there hasn't been a genuine prop in the sense of the name - i.e. propping up a scrum - in RL since contested scrums went (quite a few were blown away when the 6th tackle scrum was ditched as well, which made scrums far less important anyway). Kevin Ward was to the Chisnalls, Pitchfords etc what Peacock is to him - i.e. not a 'real' prop at all.

Paul Gallen is the same size as Kevin Ward.

There is a leaning by some NRL clubs to have more mobile props. So they're using second rowers and locks to fill those positions.

Yeah and they lose to teams with big props

NSW has a light pack, Queensland doesn't.

It is an evolving position , unlike union where they stil need a fat imobile prop.

Not to mention QLD having the likes of Slater, Cronk, Thurston, Inglis, and Smith in their team. You'd think NSW would simply pick a few bigger blokes if it were that simple. Origin isn't 1997 SL when the big Bulls team swept all before them because the rest of the league couldn't handle their physicality (tellingly the Bulls then failed to win a single game in the expanded WCC).

Is it the reduction in the number of replacements in a game that is pushing us to reduce their size and keep them on the field longer?

Maybe a push for a faster more expansive game in SL is contributing. Watching Graham play he probably passes more than he takes it in.

Well we got there in the end, the game has changed, big barging Props are a thing of the past, Hill like Graham has good ball handling skills and off loads, also mobile and fit enough not to be ' spotted ' and also able to play up to the full 80 minutes if required

Wigan and GB legend Brian McTigue played prop in the 50s and 60's.

He was fast on his feet, a ball player, and physically very strong. As well as being an ex-boxer.

McTigue scored a try at Wembley in the early 60's, shot through the defence like a bullet. It's on the web somewhere, don't think it's on youtube though.

So not all were big barging props in the past.

I think that one reason the op thinks that props are a thing of the past is the fact that, most of the other positions
ie second row, centre, wing are now played by blokes who are the best part 16 stone which is about the weight of an old school prop.
The fact is that all of the modern league players are bigger and physically stronger than their counterparts from say 20 years ago.
We do miss some of the handling skills, but the game is more power based these days and there is no doubt that some of the craft has gone.

With 4 subs on the bench, usually 3 "props" and a hooker, the players can attack in the same style for most of the full 80 mins, with the forwards knocking holes in the defensive line and then scoring through advantage in attacking numbers or pace through a gap in the line.

The "props" are still doing a job, its just the game that has changed.

Why do people see a development of a position as a negative thing. Big, heavy flat footed forwards of yester-year are done. The fast paced and technical game we have now chews them up and spits them out. Feka was one of the last to attempt at a decent level, and got picked apart by good hookers like Monaghan and Roby around the ruck. The game now hinges on split seconds.

Props can not be marked against props of years gone by, top level props at the moment have to have a skill set; a step, offload, decent short pass, and tackle technique rather than just knocking someone to the ground. The best forwards around at the moment are (other than the established Graham, Burgess etc) Remi Casty, Larne Patrick, Lee Mossop and Chris Hill. All have a lot of ablility and decent work rates.

Warrington quite often play with 3 props on the field at once, we use Harrison or Cooper at 13 and have 3 props crashing into the opponents mid field. Thats why Wire always seem to tire teams out mid second half.
So to say its a dying position is wrong as we have got rid of 13 and made this an extra prop.

I bet Shaun Wane doesn't think it's a dying position.
He's picked seven in the 25 man squad with only one, Ben Flower, who'd play front and back row.
As far as I can make out five of them are over 6'3" and are huge guys.
Six out and out props with only one, Lauaki, under 6'3" is some size and Hame isn't a small bloke.
Yes, I would think SW is expecting them to make an impact