I hope that Catalans beat Leigh decisively. We don't need a club that is a suburb of Wigan in Super League.

Hopefully 2019 will see Catalans, Toulouse, Toronto and London all in Super League.

"How did you go bankrupt?" Bill asked.
"Two ways," Mike said. "Gradually and then suddenly."

Lost London, lost Bradford, lose Catalans...

In twenty years there won't be a professional Rugby League competition in England and the remaining people who watch the game will blame it on a conspiracy by outsiders.

Widnes are one example but in the other side of the coin both Wakefield and Salford have won the MPG and look at their seasons? Could be argued that it gave them the kick up backside scare they needed.

If we didn't have P/R or Middle 8's and Catalans were guaranteed to be a SL side I could see them in the bottom 2/3 positions for the foreseeable future comfortable in the knowledge their SL status isn't under threat. So whilst you can say it gave teams time to build - Widnes got given a 'promotion' to SL and probably felt they needed to justify that decision and felt most under threat the next time a license got given out, you can also say it could leads to some other teams getting complacent safe in the knowledge the RFL would never relegate them.....Catalans for example.

Hopefully Leigh will win so we can hopefully get rid of you, and your continuous claptrap post.

And that is the perfect post.

All of this is spot on. For the game to grow we need a strong second tier, super league shouldn't be the be all and end all. Hopefully sky will show championship games more regularly next season with Toronto, Catalans, London and Toulouse all likely to be challenging for the top 4.

Losing London and Bradford has done f**k all. The monumental RFL Stobart cock up, now that has been costly.

Also filling the top British comp with foreign teams isn't going to get more people in THIS country to watch the sport.

Spot on Willzay.

They aren't lost though are they, they are just playing in a lower division, and all three of them are capable of earning their place back in coming years if they are managed properly. Relegation doesn't have to be a death sentence.

I don't want Catalans to go down particularly, but I aren't that bothered if they do. It would be a real shame and a severe blow to the French game if they went to the wall, or ended up stuck as a semi pro side forever more, but relegation might be a good thing if it allows they to clear the decks and have a rethink about what kind of club they want to be. I don't really agree with the sponsorship argument, if it was London then I get it, but Perpignan isn't exactly an economical powerhouse is it? Why would a potential sponsor care anymore about a team being there than they would about a team in Lancashire?

Thanks to theredviking for at least an attempt at some sort of debate, rather than Cokey's infantile cheerleading of posts he likes and school-yard insults.

This bit, I agree with.



Nobody wants to see any talent flounder or go undiscovered. I'll save comment on the "Leigh have plans" part - if there is one thing RL clubs are good it, it's "having plans".



This I don't quite agree with. We have had high profile, successful international players, and we're still falling behind other sports. The Burgess brothers, particularly the return of Sam, was supposed to increase our international profile, as was Sam Tomkins. The problem that the wider public really don't lknow / care and even if they do, we can't keep our best players in this league.



That may be the case, but with international potential comes the potential to earn big money, and that means leaving Super League unless something dramatically changes. We have a serious problem in that we have too few clubs who can pay the market rate for top talent - British or Antipodean.



Au contrare. We are looking at the bigger picture. The bigger picture is wanting to attract new audiences, bigger audiences, new sponsors, bigger sponsors and more broadcasters. To me, and to most others it seems, that is better achieved with a strong Catalans team than a Leigh team in Super League.

Reaching the same audiences gets this sport nowhere. The sport is already stagnating and as much as the chippy anti-expansionists like Cokey and Vastman decry it, it needs to reach new audiences if it is to stop 'withering on the vine'.

I know why people like that object to the expansion clubs - they see the commercial success of this sport as a threat that their respective clubs can't keep up with and so they want to see the sport held back, continuing to wither, so that they can maintain this idea that they're competing, and then blame Red Hall for the sport's ills. I think that's wrong - we shouldn't let the tale wag the dog simply to keep 5,000 people in a town near Wigan happy.

We need more money in this sport. I think that money is more likely to be found in France and Toronto than it is in Leigh or Wakefield.

Like Iv'e already said,you hate Leigh and know F@@@ all about Leigh,so disappear you silly little juvenile.

I've asked you before, but point out where I'm wrong. How do I know "#### all"? What am I missing that you can elighten me on? And what evidence do you have that I "hate" Leigh?

Given that you've added very little to this discussion apart from cheerleading and insults, I'd say I'm far from the one who knows "#### all".

It would be interesting to get a general idea which teams fans are generally more open to expansion, and vice versa....

Depends where. Personally I'd rather see more southern teams in SL before Toronto and any other translantic experiement.

Look, when i came on the forum today you had enough replies from other users as to why Cats should go down - READ THEM. If you don't agree, then that's up to you. I don't have to explain anything to you about my club, You have decided yourself that you don't want Leigh before Cats in SL........YOUR OPINION ONLY. What do you really know about the MIGHTY LEIGH CENTURIONS? I think nothing. That's why i said, You Know F@@@ all. Get it?

The problem, in my opinion, is the stigma around the championship. As a few have mentioned relegation should be a blow for being worse than your rivals but not a death sentence. Giving the championship more exposure will help with this.

If a team can be relegated knowing they have to make changes and clear out deadwood BUT can still make revenue, get on TV, produce a good winning atmosphere etc and make a charge for promotion back to SL it's not the end of the world. The problem is the current championship doesn't provide this. Hopefully sky will start showing more championship matches to allow championship sides to promote too. With that more get the chance to grow, improve, go full time and push on.

At the moment we have the same arguments each year, X team need to get back to SL before they do a Bradford but that means forcing out Y team who need to get back the year after at the expense of Z and so on....

Thats a good point, and the stigma probably comes about because the championship itself is split into two very distinct groups, those who are arguably too good for that level, want to be in SL, and have the knowhow/support/money etc to get there and survive, and those who aren't good enough/realise they wouldn't be able to run as a financially stable SL club and are content to run in the championship.

This is personally why I would be in favour of an expanded SL, but realise that would take a massive overhaul, not least on how we divvy out fixtures.

So thats a no then.

I've not seen an awful lot from any poster here as to why Leigh are better for the growth of the sport than Catalans - in fact, the general sentiment seems to agree that Catlans offer more in that regard. There's a lot of discussion about the on-field merits of the two teams and I have agreed with that from the outset - if the Dragons lose on Saturday they will go down on merit and if they win, they'll stay up on merit. I don't think that anything I've posted on this issue amounts to me knowing "#### all" as you suggest - I've certainly offered far more insightful opinion on this issue than you have - and I'm happy to give Leigh and Widnes credit where it is due.

I've been respectful to you, explained my views and refrained from offensive insults - it's a shame that the same can't be said of you in this exchange so perhaps we should leave it there, eh?

=#FF0000That's because i never said that did i. I said why Cats should go down, not Leigh stay up. You say they should stay up on merit, What merit? Widnes did the job yesterday (well done Widnes) Leigh [size=150MUST[/size do the same on Saturday. BTW - I don't even know why i'm wasting my time with you. Bye.

The thing is, Catalan going down is probably one of the worse outcomes for Championship clubs.
They'll have trips to Toronto, Toulouse, Catalan and London to pay for as well as lacking the income they've had for the last 3 years with big away followings from Bradford and HKR.

If it happens, then I'd be surprised if there's only one bottom end Championship club that has financial trouble during 2018

So,Is expansion a good or a bad thing?

You wouldn't think similar if you didn't support a safe sacred cow club?

Exactly Freddie....Oh hang on, I'm not cheer leading again am i?

What's so wrong with letting sporting ability decide who stays and who goes?

A contrived competition does absolutely zip for the sports credibility. We're supposed to be a professional sport and ability and winning should trump geographical location.

It's hardly Leigh's fault one of the competitions major sponsors is tinned mushy peas.

Well said mate.