I'd suggest the opposite , after 2/3 years you'd have changed your tune , unless you want us to be the northern version of Quins without a millionaire backing us

yes, thats the idea... thats why reducing the number of teams is the best way to improve the quality of superleague, and hopefully our national team.

There currently arent enough SL standard players for 14 teams.... its going to be even worse with 15/16 teams.

I think what clubs like Wakefield have proved over the past few years is that there are an awful lot of players in SL and Championship squads who aren't getting the opportunity to play first grade rugby and that if they're given the chance to do this and train full time, they can be succesful.

Look at Wire and the calibre of players that they're loaning out at the moment. Look at how Wigan got shut of Brown and Robinson all those years ago and how they're the backbone of Huddersfield now.

I think there is an awful lot of talent knocking about, enough to sustain an additional two teams. Your top elite are always going to play for the biggest club, its inevitable, but that doesn't mean there isn't room for anyone else. Also, having more clubs with strong academy set ups means that they'll eventually start to produce their own talent. This takes a bit of time, but we're seeing the benefits across the board in SL at the moment.

Event though the last time Great Britain was the dominant nation was when there more than 30 teams in one league?

Oh... i didnt know that.... that changes everything.

lets just merge superleague and the championship then.... problem solved...... we will soon be beating the aussies again.

Ooooo go on tell us what these issues are then?

Must admit, i'd forgotten MM was an additional weekend, but it's still very manageable. Make MM a weekly round, don't schedule local derbies so you don't hit the nominated "home" side with a big loss of home revenue. Allow the nominated home club to keep a % of the ticket price of tickets they sell (not sure if the RFL control this). With no outgoings, the majority of this % would be profit. half the league then have 1 less home game than the others, but without a complete loss. alternate the home side each year so to keep it fair. Not clean, but not impossible if we wanted it. I remember a few years ago we had a similar situation when we had a 12 team league yet played i think 27 games per year. It also gives the MM a pinnacle game and IMO increases the status of the WCC.

Sides like Quins and Crusaders weaken the concept of SL enough.

When you look at clubs like Leigh and Halifax and see how average they are we certainly don't want another poor quality side in SL thank you.

£1.2m versus £100,000
Stephen Hawkins IQ 165 versus your IQ of 34

How are Fax and Leigh not competing?
How are you not a professor?

Yet those are the reasons Leigh arent likely to get a franchise.

its a very contradictory standpoint for you to say franchising is wrong because it takes the prospect of promotion away from clubs like Leigh, but if Leigh were to be promoted they wouldnt be successful anyway.

If Leigh cant function in SL, then the fact franchising is keeping them out of SL is a good thing, and a system which allows them into SL is a bad thing.

The obvious answer to what you are saying, is there is a balance that needs to be struck. We need to keep expanding the league to give the pathways to young players to expand the player pool, conversely expanding the too far will dilute the quality

Im of the belief that the league should at the moment, be slightly bigger than the player pool will support. It gives us the impetus to increase it and I dont think we are that far away from supporting 14 teams, which in effect is actually only 11 teams (quins, crusaders, and Les Catalans have a special focus on their on providing a pathway for a developing player pool)

I think we are about right at the moment, but I think we are a long long way away from being able to support any more heartland sides from this player pool.

I think the proposed expansion of the championships is a good way of providing a broader base for the RL pyramid

It's all about the odds , posters like yourselves suggest that a club can come up after having a mediocre couple of seasons on pitch in the Championship and build in SL

I would suggest that unless your are coming up with a momentum of playing well and winning a league competition ( I prefer the win the league situtaion rather than the ' win one game ' scenario ) you are less likely to be competitive from the start , and that has been proved to be preferable in the past

However if you are not able to make the improvement enough to avoid a bottom finish then perhaps a season against lower opposition will allow you to build stronger the next time

Would 17 teams work?

I have stated in the past that the criteria for application is too low in my opinion , however I have also stated that the RFL are completely out of tune with what is required to improve the Championships , they haven't a clue what the clubs really need , it is pointless a club entering SL with 3 years guaranteed unless they can draw at least 4,000 attendances in the Championship , it is that mainly which has got Widnes a place this time

However there is then the other side of the coin , any SL club that isn't sustainable without massive owner input should be under real pressure from the RFL , or any club that isn't pulling in 8/9,000 fans is not a SL club , but just a Championship club who got lucky

If you are going to have a ' Super ' league , at least have it genuinely ' Super '

In your mind yes , in the real world no

But as you have just said 90% of your team will be changed anyway so i cant see how that will be relevant.

The choice (based on your logic) is between a club which has won the league and as such has the best first team squad, who will then change 90% of the squad for likely one season and a club which didnt win the league but was best placed of the field to maximise its potential in SL who will then change 90% of their squad for at least 3 years

If you want to talk about odds, i think its clear which of those you would back


Or perhaps you look at what you did wrong last season, improve on it and try again.

Well let's see shall we , anything more than 1/2 clubs will just make the Championships weaker , and further widen the gap between SL and the rest

What about the teams already in SL - that can't function in SL? Clubs that have gone into administration, clubs that are not drawing in enough crowds and clubs that are still struggling with stadia? Does that mean that the current system which allows them to remain in SL is a bad thing?

Ah but !

what the RFL do to improve SL isnt necessarily anything to do with what they do to improve the championships.

I see no reason to limit the amount of clubs who can apply, if a club wants to apply, fair enough i dont see what we, as a game, lose because of this.

No. If those clubs are building towards being able to do the things we need them to do, then giving them the time and space to do it is a good thing. If it becomes apparent they cant do these things we have facility to remove them.

Where have I stated that 90 percent would be changed , that is the point , if you build the Championships up to a reasonable level you would have teams taking 60/70 percent of the team up with you as HKR did , they competed from the start , yes they dropped off near the end of the season as they're squad didn't have the strength in depth of the established clubs , but they built a squad in the Championships and the bulk of that squad did compete

absolute nonsense to say there is not enough quality to support more teams, of course there is.

how many players are on dual contracts?
how many juniors will be lost to the game because there is so little chance of going pro?
how many championship players could potentially make the grade with full time coaching?

as for "elite" players. get a grip . there are probably a dozen outstanding players in superleague.(if you're not sure who they are, they will be the ones heading for rugby union or australia in the near future)

after that there is hundreds of pretty average players all at about a similar level.

I never said it was , so what point are you trying to make ?

The game won't ' lose ' , the Championship clubs will , that is what I said

But we won't , because there will be nobody to replace them