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| Quote ="Roofs"They should have just bundled them oodles of cash like they allegedly do with other expansion clubs.
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| Quote ="SmokeyTA"the case wouldnt get past the first stage, it would be laughed out of court. The clubs have agreed to be subject to the RFL's subjective decision, they have agreed to be bound by the RFL's subjective decision and that the RFL's subjective decision is final.
There isnt a court in the land that would even allow an argument to say the RFL's subjective decision was wrong, there also isnt an argument in the world that could PROVE a subjective decision wrong.
The only way a club could challenge the decision was that if they felt the independent scoring, i.e the putting the clubs in to the A B C categories was done incorrectly.'"
Quote ="Sarf Essex Taff"You're suggesting that the common law can be changed through precedent. It can, but those changes in 99% of the cases are simply clarifying existing law. The change is usually relatively small, not an absolute about turn.
I was taught administrative law in the late eighties and the position with regard to judicial review of sports bodies was the same then as I set out in my post you quote. However, the details in my post came from an article on the subject in April 2010's edition of The Solicitors Journal.
This means the law has not changed in over 20 years. I can only think that anyone who ignored that was either very naive or foolish. If a Premiership club like Sheffield United with all its millions to throw at lawyers can't manage it, I doubt any rugby league club could.
It would never damage the RFL's credability, because no case will ever be heard. The chances of the Crown Office (or the Administrative Court to give it its new fangeled name) giving permission to apply are so remote, no one is ever likely to take the odds.'"
Fair enough.
If it was as impossible as you two make out, then it makes you wonder why they need clubs to sign an agreement not to take legal action, under pain of expulsion from the game itself – curious.
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| Quote ="Pepe"If it was as impossible as you two make out, then it makes you wonder why they need clubs to sign an agreement not to take legal action, under pain of expulsion from the game itself – curious.
'"
Good point and I'm not sure (but you are assuming the RFL knows all of this!). My best guess is such disclaimers are not unusual in any tendering/franchising process to try to reduce the possibility of an organisation getting mired in legal actions with unhappy jilted suitors. Under the present Civil Procedure Rules there is an obligation for contact between parties before any proceedings are even issued. This may still involve a fair amount of work and naturally legal costs, as lawyers don't traditionally come cheap. Therefore anything that assists in having the suitor's solicitors right at the start telling the suitor "just don't go there" has to be worthwhile.
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| Quote ="Pepe"Fair enough.
If it was as impossible as you two make out, then it makes you wonder why they need clubs to sign an agreement not to take legal action, under pain of expulsion from the game itself – curious.
'" It's part of the membership rules of the rfl, it applies to any legal action against the rfl, not just regarding franchises
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| Quote ="Sarf Essex Taff"Good point and I'm not sure (but you are assuming the RFL knows all of this!). My best guess is such disclaimers are not unusual in any tendering/franchising process to try to reduce the possibility of an organisation getting mired in legal actions with unhappy jilted suitors. Under the present Civil Procedure Rules there is an obligation for contact between parties before any proceedings are even issued. This may still involve a fair amount of work and naturally legal costs, as lawyers don't traditionally come cheap. Therefore anything that assists in having the suitor's solicitors right at the start telling the suitor "just don't go there" has to be worthwhile.'"
Belt and braces eh?
It looks like whoever is for the drop is completely screwed then.
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| Quote ="SmokeyTA"It's part of the membership rules of the rfl, it applies to any legal action against the rfl, not just regarding franchises'"
It seems even stranger then, that licence applicants have to sign yet another affirmation of this policy, if all clubs are already signed up to it anyway.
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| Ralph Rimmer just been on TV saying why it would not be right to promote clubs from the Championship only to see them struggle to survive in Super League......hmm!
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| Quote ="Shooze"Ralph Rimmer just been on TV saying why it would not be right to promote clubs from the Championship only to see them struggle to survive in Super League......hmm!'"
You couldn't make it up!
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| Quote ="Shooze"Ralph Rimmer just been on TV saying why it would not be right to promote clubs from the Championship only to see them struggle to survive in Super League......hmm!'"
The ' Patsy ' speaks , I wonder how much he is costing to take the flak
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| Wouldn't the validity of the contract and disclaimer depend upon what the RFL told the clubs about the franchise system before they signed it?
If it could be proven that there had been misrepresentation by the RFL, could the clubs not apply to have the contract/disclaimer set aside?
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| Quote ="Starbug"The ' Patsy ' speaks , I wonder how much he is costing to take the flak'"
Not much flak. There's no pitchfork wielders on the grounds of Red Hall.
Only Santa, carrying Fax's application
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| Quote ="Shooze"Ralph Rimmer just been on TV saying why it would not be right to promote clubs from the Championship only to see them struggle to survive in Super League......hmm!'"
it's a joke ! what's the difference if a club 'struggles' in SL or C/CI ? - whichever league you are in you have to cut your cloth accordingly surely ? I think i'd rather my team 'struggled' in SL than C/C1
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| Quote ="sanjunien"it's a joke ! what's the difference if a club 'struggles' in SL or C/CI ? - whichever league you are in you have to cut your cloth accordingly surely ? =#BF0000I think i'd rather my team 'struggled' in SL than C/C1'"
SL allows for that!
Take the money and run.
No ambition, who cares, 3 years of EASY money without worries and parachute payments if you go out.
Nothing to play for, so what!!!
Nothing however to do with the game on the field though, which IMO is secondary as far as the RFL & SL are concerned.
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| Quote ="sanjunien":2xwvn0hiit's a joke ! what's the difference if a club 'struggles' in SL or C/CI ? - whichever league you are in you have to cut your cloth accordingly surely ? I think i'd rather my team 'struggled' in SL than C/C1'" wereas other clubs that just spend money they dont have and are unlikely to get anywhere near earning in a season are defended
Barmy
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| Quote ="Starbug"Not if you were guaranteeing the short fall , in the Championships it will be between tens and hundreds of thousands , in SL it will be at least hundreds of thousands but more likely millions
In fact I find it quite strange that a club that ' cut it's cloth accordingly ' is lambasted by many on here [ yet that is what the RFL tell us they want wereas other clubs that just spend money they dont have and are unlikely to get anywhere near earning in a season are defended
Barmy'"
quite agree - it's lunacy !
Quote ="Leaguefan"
SL allows for that!
Take the money and run.
No ambition, who cares, 3 years of EASY money without worries and parachute payments if you go out.
Nothing to play for, so what!!!
Nothing however to do with the game on the field though, which IMO is secondary as far as the RFL & SL are concerned.'"
well summed up LF
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| tell me more about these parachute payments
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| Quote ="tb"tell me more about these parachute payments'"
I don't think they exist anymore. Huddefield received one but i think they stopped after that.
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| Quote ="Barnacle Bill"I don't think they exist anymore. Huddefield received one but i think they stopped after that.'"
Hudds , yes , Salford , possibly , Fax definatly finished by then
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| Quote ="Pepe"It seems even stranger then, that licence applicants have to sign yet another affirmation of this policy, if all clubs are already signed up to it anyway.'" I would imagine its so that when a club gets snippy there isn't just one document signed by a clubs representative previously, but also another signed by a CURRENT club representative.
I struggle to see how any club would have a leg to stand on in that situation.
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| Quote ="tb"tell me more about these parachute payments'"
The RFL called them 'development grants' for the relegated club.
The first 2 clubs relegated from SL, Workington and Oldham, both went bust shortly afterwards due to having players signed on SL sized contracts but losing the SL income to pay for them.
They then took steps to partially address this for future relegated clubs by introducing these grants. They started off at £250k and diminished year on year. Halifax were the last recipients in 2004 when they got £95k after relegation.
There was no need for them after that as the RFL introduced the standard SL contract terms which contain a clause that if a club loses its SL status then all player contracts become null and void, hence any club losing SL status is not burdened with huge wage liabilities that it can't afford plus the fact that it would be automatically in breach of the Championship salary cap as a result.
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| Quote ="Derwent"The RFL called them 'development grants' for the relegated club.
The first 2 clubs relegated from SL, Workington and Oldham, both went bust shortly afterwards due to having players signed on SL sized contracts but losing the SL income to pay for them.
They then took steps to partially address this for future relegated clubs by introducing these grants. They started off at £250k and diminished year on year. =#FF0000Halifax were the last recipients in 2004 when they got £95k after relegation.There was no need for them after that as the RFL introduced the standard SL contract terms which contain a clause that if a club loses its SL status then all player contracts become null and void, hence any club losing SL status is not burdened with huge wage liabilities that it can't afford plus the fact that it would be automatically in breach of the Championship salary cap as a result.'"
I stand corrected , so in 2005 the SL safety valve contract was born
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