Hmm, problem with your top three apart from arguably the DW, is that they're too big for their clubs'. In fact I would suggest that the five below are actually better, more suitable RL grounds and what the clubs below that should be aspiring to.

I actually like Odsal because it's synonymous with the sport and Craven Park is basic but not crumbing and as dated as Wheldon Rd, Belle Vue and the Willows are and, unlike all of them can be built on and improved.

So I debate designed to be NOT about stadia became just that VERY quickly?

Blame the OP. If he didn't want people to talk about grounds, he shouldn't have had a pop at someone's.

It's like saying "I don't want to talk about your missus, even though I think she's an ugly whore!"

KC Stadium capacity = 25,586
Hull FC average crowd = 13,000 (roughly over the last few years)
= 50% full on average

DW Stadium capacity = 24,826
Wigan average crowd = 16,500
= 67% full on average

Galpharm Stadium capacity = 24,500
Huddersfield average crowd = 7,500
= 31% full on average

Hull's is possibly a tad large but then for Hull KR games they can fill it, Wigan's is just the right size, Huddersfield's is currently too big but when compared to some of the others it's still not too bad.

Halliwell Jones capacity = 13,024
Warrington average crowd = 10,500
= 81% full on average

The Stoop capacity = 14,816
Harlequins average crowd = 3,250
= 22% full on average

Stobart Stadium capacity = 13,350
Widnes average crowd = 6,500
= 48.6% full on average

Racecourse Ground capacity = 15,500
Crusaders average crowd = 4,000
= 26% full on average

Headingley capacity = 20,500
Leeds average crowd = 15,000
= 73% full on average

Ideally you'd want something like Wigan or Leeds averages. It keeps it fairly full to keep up income and get a good atmosphere but also allows space for "big" games to get a big crowd in.
Warrington's is too small.

Odsal capacity = 27,491
Bradford average crowd = 12,000
= 44% full on average

Wheldon Road capacity = 11,750
Cas average crowd = 7,000
= 60% full on average

Craven Park capacity = 10,000
Hull KR average crowd = 8,250
= 83% full on average

The Willows capacity = 11,363
Salford average crowd = 4,500
= 40% full on average

Belle Vue capacity = 12,600
Wakefield average crowd = 6,000
= 48% full on average

So Warrington & Hull KR's are too small. Leeds, Wigan & Cas are about right, the rest are either slightly or a lot too big.

The problem when you start using capacities is it discounts clubs that close stands for games. The KC often looks fuller than DW, despite being roughly the same capacity and Wigan having more fans because we close the upper tier.

so are we all agreed then that on field crieria (ie. rugby league) is not even a topic for discussion any more?

its far more important which stadium we squat in.

Yep

, that'll beat the Aussies , having better stadiums

Refreshing to have a thread about 'on-the field' criteria. It's a shame then that despite the figures above, I can't see them booting out Crusaders, Salford, Harlequins or Catalans because they're 'expansion' clubs and I can't see them kicking out Bradford because they're Bradford. So, unfortunately it'll probably be Wakey...

Tell you what...IN MY OPINION odsul and belle view are both as bad as each other.......how's that sit with you?



You'd think wouldn't you......but 3 pages in it's been sucked into the "stadium" tube. I suspect this is because the list of under performing teams included Bradford.



On the point about London, Salford, Widnes, Catalans and Crusaders being "safe".....If you look at the results since 2000 then it reads like this:
Catalans: 150 games with a .8266 average
London: 318 games with a .7924 average
Widnes: 81 games with a .7232 average
Wakefield: 318 games with a .7169 average
Salford: 263 games with a .5855 average
Crusaders: 81 games with a .444 average

Sald=ford and Crusaders, alonfg with Widnes are the 3 newest clubs and should be safe.....Catalans and London are the true expansion teams so will probably be safe which leaves Wakefield.

BTW....just in case I am accused of being anti-bulls....1.264 points per gam over 318 SL games since 2000........only Saints and Leeds score higher I believe......

That's exactly what I said

Bradford clinch match day with a muppet on a motorbike waving a flag and a tannoy system blurting out silly music, they also have some green stuff with people running about on it, i think.

Can you justify that opinion though?
How would it sit with you if I said Belle Vue was a better ground than, say, The Stoop?


no, it's because you decided to have a pop at two club's stadia, so the focus turned to that.
If you don't want people to talk about something, you can't bring focus on it by taking cheap shots.

Have you ever been? I'd say the Bulls do great community work on matchday.

I would say that my opinion is based on having been to both and then comparing them to a decent stadium, like Headingly, KC or Huddersfield. As for you saying belle view being better than the stoop...that would be your opinion and would be fine....you're entitled to it. You'd also be certifiable, but hey, it's your opinion.

Headingley? A decent stadium? And I'm certifiable? Excellent! Other than one stand, Headingley is a dump.

What did you compare Odsal to with it? It's lovely South Stand that isn't even allowed to be filled anymore because it fails H&S? It's modern North Stand with wooden seats about as comfortable as sitting on a concrete floor? Or it's crumbling Western Terrace with steps so shallow you can't even see the dead ball line on the near side? That's decent like the KC and the Galpharm?



What have you compared then? Let's see a justification here. Saying their both as bad as each other because you compared them to decent stadia isn't justification. Otherwise you could say that the HJ and the Stobart are just as bad as Odsal and Belle Vue because you compared them to Wembley. It's a flawed logic.

I can't see them kicking Bradford out because: (based on the old criteria for license applications)

Capacity of 12,000 + - YES
Premier competition standard ground - NO
Average crowd of 10,000 + - YES
Operating at 40 per cent full - YES
Turn over £4million + - YES
Solvent - YES
Contribution to competition - Debatable, I aren't sure of the exact criteria. Possibly, possibly not.
Junior development - Undoubted YES
No salary cap breaches in last two years - None so YES
No club within 20 miles - NO
GRAND TOTAL 7, maybe eight.
LICENSING GRADE B

Yes we know all that , but more importantly , Nigel likes your choice of biscuits at half time better than those at Wakey

What's happened to Castleford?

Well Fax are certain to get in with them being home to Fox's Bis-ker-wits!

But thats the point , Fax are having the ' biscuit ' taken out of them , I really do feel for them , adding ' credibilty ' to a decision already made , disgusting

Other than one stand, Headingley is a more than decent stadium. In fact, at the end of the year. Other than one stand Headingley will be a very good stadium, paid for, owned and operated at a profit by the club. With more than healthy attendances and fantastic and highly profitable corporate facilities.

that 2/3rd of a stad across is almost half the entire capacity of the LSV

And we were ' smitten ' by the mighty sword of Smokey

Im not sure smitten is the right word. It worries me if you are smitten by my sword? When did you see it? are you watching me?

I hope, with every fibre of my being, you meant smote, not smitten.