, the SL clubs also just started sending under 18's teams and the fans of the NL clubs and the SL fans soon got bored with that

Yes the bulk of NL/Championship players are ex SL academies , hardly surprising that the SL clubs pick up the best juniors is it sherlock

The whole RFL attitude to the lower tiers needs to change or we wont have much of a lower tier in a few years

I wonder who got Town's mandatory game against SL opposition? Last season from the end of May until mid-September Town had 4 home games and during the same period Blackpool went 5 WEEKS without a game of any sort due to the incompetent nature of the fixture lists!!!! How do you suppose clubs get behind with tax bills, etc, when they have wages to pay to players and staff???

The money that comes down from the RFL to Championship clubs is only for administration and development purposes and teams in the Championship 1 below the top 4 are very unlikely to get on TV to get any extra money.

As it happens a few weeks ago Craig Spence of the RFL made a comment that Town were probably the only Championship in the black, but at what price to us fans? We got rid of all our travelling players halfway through the season and played local lads from the amateur ranks and finished the season with only London Skolars below us, but bills got paid. If SL had any scruples they would be ensuring that the lower league clubs were receiving cash paymenst from the Sky money but sadly it would mean a bit less for them.

Dont be silly the game below SL is that awash with money it can be given to Easyjet/Ryanair and hotel chains to finance Toulouse in the Championship

In our ' vibrant , worth winning in their own right ' competitions

Something definitely needs to be done about the number of games being played.

Between June 1st and August 8th Cougars only played 5 games.

I'd bring the 6 decent teams up from Championship 1 into Championship and then put the remaining 4 in Conference National and have promotion from there to championship.

A large proportion of Sky money goes to SL clubs. As it should. The remaining sky money goes into RL as a whole. It goes into a pot that provides funds for non SL clubs. So non SL clubs get sky money...live with it



Many of the clubs are badly managed and marketed so it is no surprise that the RFL want money it spent on 'professional managers'.

The 'mandatory games' continue. And of course SL clubs pick up the best young players and they spend more on developing them (the RFL insisting on Sky money being spent this way - so Sky £ produces players that fill many C1&2 teams)). Its elementary.

With greater mobility and greater tv coverage many people are unwilling to pay comparatively high entrance prices for 2nd and 3rd tier rugby. That is there choice.

Link ?

You dont have a clue how clubs operate at that level , most dont need F/T CEO's and most definatley are not going to get somebody with millions to throw away on board just because they have a ' marketing ' executive

The mandatory games might continue but nobody cares to watch u 18's , be they Championship fans or SL fans , so what help exactly is that

So if these players didn't go to the Chamnpionship clubs where exactly do you expect them to go ?

Correct , so the answer to the problem is ?

Since you are so clever

Ahh ok. Thought you knew the exact figures.

But your just presuming this money is from Sky? and not from other sources? Grand Finals, Challenge Cup finals etc?

I'm almost certain Oldham Bears played in that extended world club challenge that was held back in 1997

I seem to remeber they were thumped by a massive score by someone....not sure who when or where though

So part time teams that are rarely televised get far less SL money than ft teams regularly broadcast. This is true of all professional sports. Lower tier RU and football clubs get buttons compared with the top flight clubs.

Also the top clubs in any sport have more money and tend to have better academies. Only a moron would think that taking £20K out of the Leeds development budget and giving it to say Hunslet or bramley would improve the quality of players coming through. The idea that you can develop elite athletes on a pittance is nonsense.

The chip on the shoulder of some RL fans about 'sugar daddies' is sadly all too predictable. These guys are fans who love the game and put their own cash in. Good on them. Once again this is true of many sports. Oldham are now struggling because a wealthy local backer wants out while in barrow there is a resurrenge because of a local wealthy backer. Welcome to reality.

I am sure that your post makes sense inside your head. In the real world it is incoherent.



The problem is that many clubs do not have a clue how to run themselves. Failing to pay their taxes or hiding behind CVAs - expecting someone else to pick up the tab for their incompetence.

So you like the RFL see the only way clubs can survive and prosper is to ' snare ' a ' sugar daddy '

If that is the case then the sport will never prosper , and not just below SL , sustainability is what we need , more matches , better income from existing ' streams ' and most of all more ' pay through the gate ' fans

Clueless

Did you think that? really? Gosh.

I am not presuming anything - though you need to think otherwise.

Answer this one from Geekay



This is just one of the problems clubs outside SL have

But not to worry the RFL will chuck 300 K a year at having Toulouse in the Championship , very helpful

Ah the old ' if I pretend I dont understand your post I can avoid arguing the points of it ' excuse

How clever of you

Blackpool & London Skolars had home games in nearly 2 months, how the hell can anyone plan a business round a garbidge fixture list like that? Endless blank weekends with no games in the best summer weather, what a farce the RFL fixture planning is.

Ask Marsdengiant , he'll tell you it is all the clubs fault

Except Huddersfield , they just use w1g4ns cast offs

Ahh so when you said



You didnt mean that you knew? But other fans did. Ahh i get it now, you dont know anything. Because if you did you could give exact figures of what Sky money was given to CC and CC1 clubs.

Ok my mistake.

Your fixation with 'sugar daddies' is touching. Wealthy backers are a fixture of many clubs and many sports. It is a reality that iI do not have a problem with. You do...tough. the reality is that many of the club, match and player sponsors that a club has are businesses owned by fans. lots of little 'sugar daddies' who know there is no return on their sponsorship investment.

Your 2nd paragraph is childish truism. It would be really really lovely to have those things. a lovely wish list. Any specifics?

Will I? Oh dear! Thanks for letting me know starbug

And West Tigers! don't forget them

It worked out nice for us in 09 thanks.

No...you were incoherent.

Its not more complicated.

The VAT

1. You collect 15% VAT on your income. On behalf of HMG...never your money.
2. You pay 15% VAT on some of your outgoings - but not payroll-related costs.
3. Because most of your income is VAT standard-rated, and much of your costs are not subject to VAT, you end up owing HMRC.
4. You have to pay the VAT quarterly (unless a big outfit) in arrears.
5. You don't pay it when due - effectively using money which is not yours to finance your business.
6. You eventually get a winding-up petition from HMRC who finally lose patience with you holding onto money which was never yours.
7. If you go bust, you have effectively (in my book) stolen from the taxpayer.

THE PAYE/NIC (this one is far worse IMO)

1. You deduct tax and NIC from your employees' pay.
2. You have to pay this over to HMG (usually) by 19th of following month, together with the employers' NIC contributions.
3. The deductions were never your money - they are monies you have deducted from employees and are effectively holding in trust pending paying them over. The NIC contributions in particular are important since they qualify employees for pensions and benefits etc.
4 You don't pay it when due - effectively using money most of which was never yours to finance your business.
5. You eventually get a winding-up petition from HMRC who finally lose patience with you holding onto money which was never yours.
6. If you go bust, you have effectively (in my book) stolen from the taxpayer. AND screwed your employees.

In the old days, with "Crown Preference", the Crown ranked ahead of mopst other creditors for a lot of their dosh. This meant they had more certainty of getting paid out if the business fell over, so they tended not to push for winding up - let someone else do that (or initiate anotehr form of formal insolvency).

Since Crown Preference was abolished, the Crown has had to become much more active and assertive in seeking to recover money due - in the interests of all taxpayers. That's why you often see HMRC as the initiator of winding up petitions nowdays. Especially since directors often have a habit of paying off the pressing creditors and maybe their mates (and yes I know about fraudulent preference, any lawyers out there...) and leaving HMRC as the biggest non-loan creditor since they are often quite lenient before finally losing patience. So often get taken advantage of.

Like you said, its not really that complicated: just a case of companies frequently using the bank of the taxpayer as a loan, and then not being able to pay it back. And so effectively using and losing money which was never theirs in the first place. That's why when London Broncos fell over, they owed money mainly to the Crown and to the owner. That's tantamount to theft in my book, but when in that situation its more like desperation so I always tell people not to be too quick to judge unless you have been in that horrible place yourself.

hth?

Poor lad. i've explained that some sky money + other £ goes into central funding and some goes to C1&2 clubs. Do try and keep up.

Yet another patronising know nothing fan of a I'm all right stuff the rest SDL club

Never mind I'm sure w1g4n will keep bringing through players for you , and lets face it , it's a good job you have your ' sugar daddy ' because you'd be f***** without him

So tell me are Huddersfield Giants a well run and solvent sustainable club , showing a healthy profit every year ?