Whilst MK Dons did what you're so mad about the Crusaders doing

Who gives a ? about MK Dons. They are not in a false position, they are where they are based on their achievements in a sporting context, they have not been told they will be in the premiership in 3 years regardless, they are not playing to rules different from other clubs in the division, all their players are probably here legally and their coach is not paid by the FA

Neither does any RL club. Clubs with SL licences for 2009-11 received a point in the licence grading - but it's not a criterion for moving from the conference to the conference premier, from there into the championships or from the championships in to super league. Despite your constant misdirections.

Exeter 1994, 2003
Bournemouth 1997, 2008
Darlington 1997, 2009
Chester 1998, 2009
Portsmouth 1999, 2010
Crystal Palace 1999, 2010
Oxford Utd 1999
Barrow 1999
Swindon 2000, 2002
Scarborough 2000
Hull 2001
QPR 2001
Chesterfield 2001
Leicester 2002
Barnsley 2002
Carlisle 2002
Notts County 2002
Bury 2002
Bradford 2002
Port Vale 2002
Lincoln City 2002
Swansea City 2002
York 2002
Halifax Town 2002, 2008
Derby 2003
Ipswich 2003
Huddersfield 2003
Oldham 2003
MK Dons 2003
Wimbledon 2003
Wrexham 2004
Cambridge 2005
Crawley Town 2006
Rotherham 2006, 2008
Leeds United 2007
Boston United 2007
Southampton 2008
Luton 2008
Stockport 2009
Salisbury 2009
Portsmouth 2010
Crystal Palace 2010

seems to be working out quite well for them, or maybe not

Go on , give us a clue ?

its a list of clubs in the last 11 years who have gone into adminstration, almost all were relegated in the preceeding 3 years to going into administraion.

40 clubs at a qucik count, not a bad total considering there are only 112 in the premiership and football league

Aren't there 92?

They're rushing in a License system and scrapping P&R as a result.

Aren't they?

that's why we have a salary cap

All were relegated then went into administration , so basically they overspent by giving out long term contracts that could not be honoured , something that isn,t a problem in RL

So your point is what exactly ?

But you told me we had a salary cap to spread the talent not keep costs down?

Also, surely if the aim of the cap is to protect clubs from overspending it should have some link to the amount clubs can actually
afford to spend and not simply be an arbitrary amount?


well im pretty sure any club, anywhere, which goes into administration 'basically overspent'

my point is promotion and relegation has massively damaged clubs in football just as it has in RL,

Since Leeds utd were relegate they have sold their stadium, sold their training ground, and dismantled one of the most successful youth academies in the country, was Leeds Utds relegation good for football? no, clearly not. It severely damaged one of its top clubs, it meant the club lost its stadium and training ground and it lost a very successful youth academy.

But hey, im sure the clubs which were promoted benefited right? im sure Norwich, Crystal Palace and West Brom went on to be a great success yeah? oh..............

there is indeed, for some reason i counted the premier league twice

So why hasn't the soccer world seen fit to protect such clubs from dumb-assed Chairmen? West Brom seem to be content with yo-yo ing without cocking their finances up. Have Burnley financially imploded? Some club owners are more sensible than others - that's business as they say. And it is business these days, not a sport so lay off the intervention - let the free market rule

You are Peter Ridsdale

no they havent, but 40 out of 92 clubs did. Thats nearly 44% of clubs in the past 11 years have gone into administration, some a few times.

And if we want to run the business as a free market, there is one far more obvious intervention that we would need to get rid of

'"

Have you answered the question yet, couldnt be ar$ed looking back

of course being relegated damaged them, the uncertainty regarding relegation damaged them too.

they do have contracts which are cancelled on relegation, they have contracts which include wage drops on relegation, the idea that clubs struggle in football because they dont have the intelligence or rl chairmen to put in relegation clauses is idiotic nonsense.

you arent going to accept anything other than what feeds your delusions, you have decided that there is a conspiracy and see everything done as part of it, you have invented yourself a silly little circular argument and it really is ridiculous.

Right. Let's face the facts.

No-one can deny that the advent of franchising has torn the game apart. What used to be regarded as "The Rugby League Family" is now severely disfunctional, to put it mildly. There are now 2 families, pro franchise/P&R and anti franchise/P&R and there is ever increasing animosity between the 2 camps which is only going to get worse.

Whilst I can understand, to some degree, the RFL's original intentions I believe that it was, as usual, ill-conceived and all it's implications were not taken into consideration.

I can not speak for the Pro Camp as I openly admit to belonging to the Antis but I suspect that, if their club was under threat, their views may be different.

OK. From the Anti's point of view. The main criticism most of us have and the reason that there is so much antagonism and hatred aimed at the RFL hierarchy is because the rules are so ambiguous, are constantly changing and differ according to who your club is and where it is situated. This is causing fans at most Championship clubs to start to lose interest. Attendances have started to slide and attracting new fans is becoming more and more difficult.

What I would propose is something along these lines:

After the next set of licenses is announced for 2012-2014 the RFL invites any Championship/1 clubs who are interested in a license for the following period (2015-2017) to declare it's interest. I suspect that this may involve only 5 or 6 clubs at the most. These clubs could then have their infrastructure and facilities examined by the RFL to see if they are elligible or close to it and advised of any improvements which must be made and a deadline set for the end of 2013 at which time they should be re-examined and, provided the recommendations had been met, given the nod that they have met the off-field requirements.

Alongside this a 3 year league table of these qualifying clubs would be kept where they would be awarded points for final league placings each year (maybe 10 for 1st, 6 for 2nd, 4 for 3rd etc.) Further points would be gained for progress in NRC and Playoffs on a similar scale.

I believe that this could restore interest in the Championship and build momentum over a 3 year period but ONLY if the eventual winner was GUARANTEED a SL place not just given the right to apply. All we ask is that the rules are set in stone from the outset.

Can you imagine the buildup of intensity over 3 years with a fixed prize at the end of it?

Perhaps a similar table could be kept at the bottom of SL to keep underachieving clubs on their toes.

Just my thoughts and I'm sure someone will pick holes in them but, believe me, something needs to be done and fairly quickly.

I sure they will

people on here would pick holes in a polo.
Very well structured though.
Free Market should rule, with minimal intervention from the authorities, im afraid at the moment, things have gone a step too far.
Its clear that SL has now distanced itself from the game beneath, some rules to allow people in yes, minimal criteria, the main criteria needs to be have they earned or lost the right through on field rugby.
I commend your indepth structured alternative.
People would find more interest and investment in the Championship if it wasn't a 3 year gamble. Clubs should know right from the start what they have to do, im afraid that at the moment clubs ticking all the same boxes would cause a quandry, how would they decide one space from 3 or 4 equal entrants, its not use crossing that bridge when we come to it, and it would be easier to tick some boxes if you had 3 years of SL exposure and Wigan and Leeds fans turning up and filling your ground, its loaded too far currently and too ambigious, agreed.

Some very valid points there, similar to my previous gripe of the game thas has become so fragmented. The RFL have messed up and have created there own "Rubik Cube" the facets of the game has lost its direction in many ways.

I think Steve O Connor should be the new Chairman at REd Hall , given his fiscal performance at Widnes

if we were to let the free market rule, the very first things to go would be the quota and the salary cap, they are the two most obvious restrictions we have in place.

People complain that the RFL give special credence to people in new areas with lots of money and complain 'thats all you need to get into SL' you make SL a free market and thats exactly what you will get.

My only problem with franchising is the timeline. If we get that right i think we are in a much better position. It would be a much cleaner process to have clubs outside SL submit bids at the beginning of this season and be told at the end they would be in in 2012, give them clubs year (preferably two) to sign player and coaches, improve infrastructure and stadiums, source sponsorship and build towards SL, if a club would make a good contribution to SL it gets in. The aim from 2012 should be to expand the top division by one, every three years, if one is ready.

Clubs in SL should be bespoke targets for every three years and if a club is failling, it can have plenty of warning to improve and if not it is dropped.

Wakey Wakey! no pun intended. www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/t ... 6483689.jp

Wakey Wakey! no pun intended. www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/t ... 6483689.jp

IIRC it was failing to qualify for the Champions League which caused the initial damage, which meant they ended up with a team that could not compete in the Premier League.

The clubs going into administration was the fault of the clubs themselves, not the system that they operated in.

the champions league issue was the beginning, but not the whole story.

It was the fire sale that followed with the inability to bring anyone in due to the uncertainty of where they would be playing and how much they would have to spend meant relegation followed, then the next generation of youngsters on relatively small wages were sold for relatively small amounts after relegation, this was Milner, Carson, Lennon, Kilgallon, along with Smith, and Robinson of the previous generation. It was only at this time the Ground and Stadium were sold. It was only after relegation that things really went wrong, and only on being relegated a 2nd time that Leeds went into administration.

Had Leeds had guaranteed PL football and PL money it is much more likely they could have regrouped, kept hold of their stadium, youth academy and training ground, and built a new squad around Milner, Carson, Lennon, Delph, etc

you are right, the fault lies with the club and not the system, however the system ensured the downsides were massive and the chance of rebuilding was low