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| Quote ="shinymcshine"Bring in someone with a proper business sense to grow the organisation.
Howver I don't recall Richard Lewis (tennis) or Brian Barwick (football) really improving things that much during their time at the RFL.'"
Under Lewis, the game really progressed, with a forward vision, professional set-up and decent sponsors.
Barwick has been a waste of a seat.
Nigel Wood has been too erratic. He's clearly tried his best, but ultimately he's been hamstrung by an unwillingness to challenge a small group of top championship/bottom super league clubs whose interests are contrary to the interests of the game as a whole. As a result, far too much of his focus has been on what's come to be known as the Middle 8s, and not enough on the whole sport and its shop window in SL.
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| Quote ="Sir Kevin Sinfield"I’d like us to bring someone in from outside the sport otherwise I can see nothing changing, a little too early for Kevin Sinfield, although I can see him taking over at some point in the future.'" Why do people insist on giving out high-profile off-field roles solely on the basis that they were good players? Sinfield has zero credentials to do this job.
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| Quote ="headhunter":1von1qbkWhy do people insist on giving out high-profile off-field roles solely on the basis that they were good players? Sinfield has zero credentials to do this job.'" chief executive of a sports club. I felt that I needed to give myself the academic background behind it, so that if those jobs or opportunities arise later on, I’d be in a decent position to apply for them."
Whilst this on its own isn't enough to say he should get a top job in the RFL he certainly isn't someone tipped or suggested to get a job just because of his on field performances alone.
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| Quote ="PrinterThe"Sinfield has a Masters degree in sports business with the aim of being involved in that kind of role.'" That's great, so do thousands of other people. What has he done to even be remotely mentioned in passing other than being good at playing rugby?
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| Quote ="headhunter"That's great, so do thousands of other people.'"
And I mentioned that it wasn't enough on its own.
Quote ="headhunter"What has he done to even be remotely mentioned in passing other than being good at playing rugby?'"
That was pointed out to you previously and I'm guessing your were unaware of it before being critical of the suggestion. Neither the Masters degree or his rugby career individually should be taking too much, but both together (and it's not just a good career it's being a cornerstone of the best most successful run club of the SL era) should at least get his name thrown out there.
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| Quote ="PrinterThe"And I mentioned that it wasn't enough on its own.
That was pointed out to you previously and I'm guessing your were unaware of it before being critical of the suggestion. Neither the Masters degree or his rugby career individually should be taking too much, but both together (and it's not just a good career it's being a cornerstone of the best most successful run club of the SL era) should at least get his name thrown out there.'" Why should it? His brief tenure as England team manager not withstanding, why should he be considered any more than one of the other thousands of sports business Masters graduates, who wouldn't be considered at all because they have no experience of running a major governing body?
"Because he was good at playing rugby" is going to be your answer which is bordering on insanity IMO, what the hell does that have to do with anything?
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| Quote ="headhunter"Why should it? His brief tenure as England team manager not withstanding, why should he be considered any more than one of the other thousands of sports business Masters graduates, who wouldn't be considered at all because they have no experience of running a major governing body?
"Because he was good at playing rugby" is going to be your answer which is bordering on insanity IMO, what the hell does that have to do with anything?'"
It's not "because he was good at playing rugby".....you honestly think that being involved in the sport at the highest level for 20 years at the best run club at that time doesn't give him some insight/experience/ideas that other non RL experienced can't offer?
Like I said it shouldn't be enough to get him a top job.....but at the same time it shouldn't be dismissed like you're trying to do. His name should at least be in the mix and not dismissed by someone simply because he played for a rival club.
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| Quote ="PrinterThe"It's not "because he was good at playing rugby".....you honestly think that being involved in the sport at the highest level for 20 years at the best run club at that time doesn't give him some insight/experience/ideas that other non RL experienced can't offer?
Like I said it shouldn't be enough to get him a top job.....but at the same time it shouldn't be dismissed like you're trying to do. His name should at least be in the mix and not dismissed by someone simply because he played for a rival club.'" Lol who do you think my 'rival club' is? I like Sinfield and admire him as a player. But he shouldn't even be considered at all for a job like this. Ryan Bailey was around Leeds for most of that time, do you think he should also be considered? No, you're basing it on the idea that Sinfield is a good leader because he was a leader on the pitch. It's a totally bizarre, backwards mentality within the sport, the same mentality that saw Peacock appointed to a totally unsuitable role at Hull KR and get the club relegated, or Cunningham given the St Helens coaching job when it was clear that he was a million miles away from being a capable Super League coach. It happens in other sports too, like when Maradona was coach of the Argentina football team. Very strange mentality that people have.
There's no evidence that Sinfield has any ability at all as an administrator and he doesn't have anything even remotely approaching the level of experience to be considered for this. There's nothing to separate him from the thousands of other sports business Masters graduates, of which probabilities would suggest that he would almost certainly not be the most capable. You're advocating him because you are a fanboy of him as a player and can't separate what he did on the field from the person off it. Get a grip, he has no business even being discussed for this role. If anything, based on your arguments you should be advocating Gary Hetherington who was the one actually running Leeds, not someone who happened to be a good player for the club at the time.
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| Quote ="headhunter"Lol who do you think my 'rival club' is? I like Sinfield and admire him as a player. But he shouldn't even be considered at all for a job like this. Ryan Bailey was around Leeds for most of that time, do you think he should also be considered? No, you're basing it on the idea that Sinfield is a good leader because he was a leader on the pitch. It's a totally bizarre, backwards mentality within the sport, the same mentality that saw Peacock appointed to a totally unsuitable role at Hull KR and get the club relegated, or Cunningham given the St Helens coaching job when it was clear that he was a million miles away from being a capable Super League coach. It happens in other sports too, like when Maradona was coach of the Argentina football team. Very strange mentality that people have.
There's no evidence that Sinfield has any ability at all as an administrator and he doesn't have anything even remotely approaching the level of experience to be considered for this. You're advocating him because you are a fanboy of him as a player and can't separate what he did on the field from the person off it. Get a grip, he has no business even being discussed for this role. If anything, based on your arguments you should be advocating Gary Hetherington who was the one actually running Leeds, not someone who happened to be a good player for the club at the time.'"
No his career as a RL player is an attribute. He has being working on planning on going into an administrative role for several years including getting a Masters degree at university so to compare him to Ryan Bailey going for the same role is idiotic.
What's happened is you didn't know the Uni bit about Sinfield and just tried to jump on the suggestion he should be considered. Instead of accepting your mistake you're now digging a hole and trying to suggest him Sinfield getting the role is no different to Ryan Bailey.
I'd agree if you say he shouldn't just be given a role. To say he shouldn't be considered at all is stupidity
ANY Rugby League who has worked hard academically,got degrees and spent several years aiming to have a role in the administrative side of the sport should always be in consideration for roles....not given them solely on them being past players....but considered and in the mix.
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| Quote ="PrinterThe"No his career as a RL player is an attribute. He has being working on planning on going into an administrative role for several years including getting a Masters degree at university so to compare him to Ryan Bailey going for the same role is idiotic.
What's happened is you didn't know the Uni bit about Sinfield and just tried to jump on the suggestion he should be considered. Instead of accepting your mistake you're now digging a hole and trying to suggest him Sinfield getting the role is no different to Ryan Bailey.
I'd agree if you say he shouldn't just be given a role. To say he shouldn't be considered at all is stupidity
ANY Rugby League who has worked hard academically,got degrees and spent several years aiming to have a role in the administrative side of the sport should always be in consideration for roles....not given them solely on them being past players....but considered and in the mix.'" No, I was aware he was at uni, I just didn't care. I don't think a fresh-faced graduate is a suitable person to be considered for the CEO of the RFL, regardless of whether or not they were a good player or played for a good club.
If you have 5 sports business masters graduates applying for a job in RL, one of them is Kevin Sinfield, one is some random guy who played for Gloucestershire All Golds and the other three have never played RL, which one is best for the job?
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| So folk are glad 'Mr Blobby' has left.....now what !?
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| I'm actually with headhunter on this one. Sinfield might be a good choice to be an assistant to whoever leads the game because he understands the sport from the inside and most people involved in the game will respect his opinions. But actually running an organisation when he's never done anything remotely like it before? Nonsense. Especially given how fractured the game is and reliant on clubs sometimes making decisions in favour of the sport as a whole at their own expense.
I think the head coach comparison is a really good one. Appointing former players straight into the role is lazy recruitment because its popular with some fans due to playing records. But coaching isn't what it was in Alex Murphy's day - it is or should be a highly technical role requiring good man management skills as well. Most players, even captains of clubs, are probably hopelessly ill-equipped to become head coaches the day they retire.
Running our game is far more difficult, and to be honest I'd far rather we look at people with business experience and contacts in industry. If we ever get a presence in North America we should definitely look at getting them involved in running the game. Shock horror, they might even understand marketing.
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| Do HeadHunter and BrisbaneRhino actually understand what "being considered" means?
Doesn't mean give him the job, and yes if there are 2/3 people with no RL experience but vastly more experienced in this role then give them the job because they'll know things Sinfield won't.....But he'll have ideas/criticisms/plans as a past player that none of them could offer or never think of given no past history in the sport.
So when someone says "considered"..,,,learn what considered mean.....doesn't mean given the job.
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| Quote ="PrinterThe"Do HeadHunter and BrisbaneRhino actually understand what "being considered" means?
Doesn't mean give him the job, and yes if there are 2/3 people with no RL experience but vastly more experienced in this role then give them the job because they'll know things Sinfield won't.....But he'll have ideas/criticisms/plans as a past player that none of them could offer or never think of given no past history in the sport.
So when someone says "considered"..,,,learn what considered mean.....doesn't mean given the job.'" No, it means he's being considered for the job, which Sinfield shouldn't because he doesn't have anywhere near the credentials. If he goes away and holds high-profile administrative roles in other major sporting bodies and organizations, and is successful in those roles over a number of years, or if he spends a few decades working his way up the ranks in the RFL, gaining understanding of how the organization works and demonstrating the required ability to move things forward in increasingly demanding and high-profile roles, then yes we can consider him for the job. The reason you want him to be considered right now is because you think he was a good player, which is TBH idiotic.
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| Quote ="JTB" I'll hang off digging out the party poppers...'"
...god help the bloke who has to dig his grave
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| Quote ="headhunter"No, it means he's being considered for the job, which Sinfield shouldn't because he doesn't have anywhere near the credentials. If he goes away and holds high-profile administrative roles in other major sporting bodies and organizations, and is successful in those roles over a number of years, or if he spends a few decades working his way up the ranks in the RFL, gaining understanding of how the organization works and demonstrating the required ability to move things forward in increasingly demanding and high-profile roles, then yes we can consider him for the job. The reason you want him to be considered right now is because you think he was a good player, which is TBH idiotic.'"
No what's happened is you didn't have a clue that he spent several years working towards a sports administration role and dismissed him as just a player and won't admit your mistake.
Whilst his lack of experience in an administrative role would likely see him not the right person for the role.....you thinking he should be ignored completely ignoring his knowledge of the sport which would almost certainly supersede most of all other candidates......that's idiotic.
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| Quote ="headhunter"No, it means he's being considered for the job, which Sinfield shouldn't because he doesn't have anywhere near the credentials. If he goes away and holds high-profile administrative roles in other major sporting bodies and organizations, and is successful in those roles over a number of years, or if he spends a few decades working his way up the ranks in the RFL, gaining understanding of how the organization works and demonstrating the required ability to move things forward in increasingly demanding and high-profile roles, then yes we can consider him for the job. The reason you want him to be considered right now is because you think he was a good player, which is TBH idiotic.'"
At the risk of "my agenda" being cited again, Bill Beaumont is now the head of World Rugby.....I suspect that his running the family business in Lancashire had as much to do with his being selected to represent the RFU at the IRB, then become manager of the B&I Lions, before being elected as Chairma of the RFU before eventually becoming the Chairman of the entire sport...as his prowess (SIC) on the field.
Sinfield needs to work his way up the ranks before even being considered......it took Beaumont 30 years from retirement to the head of the RFU.
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| Quote ="PrinterThe"No what's happened is you didn't have a clue that he spent several years working towards a sports administration role and dismissed him as just a player and won't admit your mistake.
Whilst his lack of experience in an administrative role would likely see him not the right person for the role.....you thinking he should be ignored completely ignoring his knowledge of the sport which would almost certainly supersede most of all other candidates......that's idiotic.'" No, once again, I didn't care that he is one of thousands of people who have spent years working towards a sports administration role, and I still don't. You repeatedly presenting this information is not some sort of revelation. What is happening here is you seem to be suggesting that because he's Kevin Sinfield that makes him more qualified than some random 24 year old who has the same uni degree, which again is a pretty bizarre assertion. His "knowledge of the sport" as a player is utterly irrelevant to his ability to succeed in an administrative/CEO role.
If I told you that Chris Bridge had the same uni qualification as Sinfield, would you be suggesting him to be considered as the next CEO of the RFL? No, of course you wouldn't. The reason you are advocating Sinfield is because you like him as a player and can't separate his on-field attributes from those off it.
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| Quote ="headhunter"No, once again, I didn't care that he is one of thousands of people who have spent years working towards a sports administration role, and I still don't. You repeatedly presenting this information is not some sort of revelation. What is happening here is you seem to be suggesting that because he's Kevin Sinfield that makes him more qualified than some random 24 year old who has the same uni degree, which again is a pretty bizarre assertion. His "knowledge of the sport" as a player is utterly irrelevant to his ability to succeed in an administrative/CEO role.
If I told you that Chris Bridge had the same uni qualification as Sinfield, would you be suggesting him to be considered as the next CEO of the RFL? No, of course you wouldn't. The reason you are advocating Sinfield is because you like him as a player and can't separate his on-field attributes from those off it.'"
If Chris Bridge has the same qualification as Sinfield then yes he should be considered too....I'm not stubborn enough like you to admit I didn't know that about Bridge.
You should interview as many people as possible from a wide a range as possible. Interviewing the same type of person with the same background you'll only learn so much. Sinfield (or Bridge) may not be ready for the role now but the RFL would be better for hearing a different viewpoint and those candidates would be both better for the experience if they were to come back again in 5/10/15 years time.....there's no limit to how many people we should speak to and interview about how the sport should go ahead even if you think it should be only one certain type of person.
If we can't even be bothered to listen to the people who played this sport then we're a poorer sport for it.
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| IMO the sport needs a massive shake up, and certainly someone who knows how to run a business should be in prime position. I would then have an assistant, or a few assistants with sports related acumen. I think that knowledge of RL should be a consultant role, rather than a key skill pertaining to a prime role. Like I said, a shake up is required.
It's all a moot point though as he ain't gone anywhere................
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| Quote You should interview as many people as possible from a wide a range as possible. Interviewing the same type of person with the same background you'll only learn so much. Sinfield (or Bridge) may not be ready for the role now but the RFL would be better for hearing a different viewpoint and those candidates would be both better for the experience if they were to come back again in 5/10/15 years time.....there's no limit to how many people we should speak to and interview about how the sport should go ahead even if you think it should be only one certain type of person.
If we can't even be bothered to listen to the people who played this sport then we're a poorer sport for it.'"
Do you interview people for your vacancies in your business line who should be considered, but not suitable so you can hear differing views on how to run your business better
What a load of nonsense. If Sinfields CV came in with no name on it, it would go straight in the bin, with similar CV without the necessary competence
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| Quote ="Wildcat26"Here`s a summary of all Wood`s "Achievements" in his 11 years in his role..
- Reduction of 38% in Sport England grant funding
- A decline in the standard of match officials
- A general decline in the standard of Super league
- The decline of reserve teams within SL / champ clubs.
- The national side has failed to beat Australia under Nigel Wood.
- Bradford bulls entering administration on numerous times after a number of owners was accepted by the RFL.
- A Decline in media coverage.
- The Loss of top English players to NRL and RFU due to salary cap restrictions.
- 2012 ridiculous Stobart sponsorship deal
- 2013 SL starts with no Sponsor
- Significant cuts in junior development funding
- 4 officials resign due to official complaints been "Brushed under the carpet"
- Accepting the first offer put on the table by sky 200m for 5 seasons.
Here is an interesting one -
Charging fans to stream Englands ONLY warm up match before the world cup and turning down the exposure to 1 million plus viewers on BBC who had only reportedly offered 10k as they was only given 6 weeks notice !!! The RFL then refused to release any figures on how many paid for the stream.
Average SL attendance
2007 - 9,855
2016 - 9,134
Challenge cup final attendance
2007 - 84,241
2016 - 76,235
Salary cap (Super League)
2007 - £1.6m
2016 - £1.85m
Player Participation
2007 - 131,900
2017 - 44,900
In fact he did such a great job, somewhere in between Aug 2013 and Jan 2017 he got a 110k P/A wage increase from 204k to 314k.'"
Says it all.
Who will replace him and where are we going long term and short term?
Can we have more open information provided to us fans by the organisation for their plans?
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| Quote ="Roy Haggerty"Under Lewis, the game really progressed, with a forward vision, professional set-up and decent sponsors.
Barwick has been a waste of a seat.
Nigel Wood has been too erratic. He's clearly tried his best, but ultimately he's been hamstrung by an unwillingness to challenge a small group of top championship/bottom super league clubs whose interests are contrary to the interests of the game as a whole. As a result, far too much of his focus has been on what's come to be known as the Middle 8s, and not enough on the whole sport and its shop window in SL.'"
As a sport we have strived to grow from the middle out rather from the top down and we have hindered the sport greatly.
What business model has ever succeeded like that?
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| I read that under Woods income had trebled more or less, the RFL is in profit and he secured government funding until 2020 to expand the playing base. Not bad.
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| Quote ="Dally"I read that under Woods income had trebled more or less, the RFL is in profit and he secured government funding until 2020 to expand the playing base. Not bad.'"
The RFL being profitable is a good thing.
However, he presided over a 38% reduction in funding from sport England (cut from £20 million to £12.6 million)
Surely you cant count this as an achievement
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