Yeah cos that was what cost us the game!

Initial thoughts.

Half backs aren't good enough.
We make stupid mistakes, at important times, graham offloading after the try, Buchanan passing from dummy half, Ellis knocking on with the line in front of him.
Sinfield is not a half back. I don't watch the nrl, but god knows how widdop makes the team, he's not had much game time, but he's done little in the time he had.
Too many stupid penalties at the play the ball.
Mcbanana has to go, poor team selection, and substitutes. Wilkin was having a belter, he brought Wilkin and graham off with 25 to go (still 8

, I don't see what he's done for us

Were still years behind the Aussies, their centres are bigger than our props. Their props are as fast as our wingers.

Still a pleasure to say you've watched lockyer's last game, but if we had a halve as good as lockyer, we wouldn't see another for 20 years. The Aussies have probably three in the wings..

england needed a leader of men controlling the game, it didnt happen tonight and were punished

sadly, we'll have a inquest for a week or two, calling for a reduction in overseas players, do this and that.. then we'll be thinking about our clubs again, and thinking, i'd rather have a 30 odd year old aussie, instead of a 21 year old rookie..

the fact is, we're not producing enough players, especially pacey back and skillfull halves..

another point, i've seen superleague turn into an absolute borefest for the last five years, slowing the play the ball down, in the hope of "making half backs unlock defences" and it's just not working

We need to play a half back !

I've said it for about the past 10 years but there are too many teams in SL - we don't have enough decent players for 12 or 14 teams which means the majority of game are of low intensity meaning that come international time we get our s kicked when it really matters.

SL 1 - 10 teams
SL 2 - 10 teams.

what we need to do is this...


change the challenge cup so that the SL clubs enter at the round 5 stage instead of round 4....that will free up a "empty weekend" we should also have "empty weekend" for the exiles game.......stick the 2 together and we can have a back to back 2 game series against the exiles...

we should also have the england knights play curtain raiser against france,wales etc..prior to england v exiles games


that would be a start imo

Australia are miles ahead in the key positions of halfback/hooker. No disrespect to Sinfield/Chase, but Lockyer/Thurston plus Smith is way ahead. It won't change when Lockyer leaves either - Cronk/Thurston will soon be just as good. What helps them enormously is the fact that the rest of the team know exactly whet they're doing in attack - running off the ball, making sure the halfbacks always have options. That's the main area where our pack is vastly inferior. Too many of our forwards are happy to trundle the ball and make nice yards, but they simply don't do enough work off the ball in attack.

Defensively the issue is simply too few players facing the kind of skills Australia show with any regularity. When you add in unforced errors, it magnifies faults a lot.

Given that we didn't win or make it close, we need to look at the players that are good enough and build around them. We do have more young outside backs coming through, so hopefully we won't need the likes of Yeaman in the future. Oddly, if Widdop continues to develop, our main problem may be the forwards in the not too distant future.

As somebody else said, league is an unforgiving sport. Qld have dumped on NSW several times recently, and england would not have lost a lot in comparison to some of the poorer Origin teams over the years. We just don't have the class in key positions that Australia has. So whilst I think there are a lot of areas needing work, there is more hope this year than for some time.

Finally, looking at the crowds etc for this tournament, anyone who thinks international RL is not important is an idiot.

One of the main issues with RL in the UK is that we dont provide a good enough career pathway for people to make a conscious decision to try & make a living within the game throughout their working life. Quiet simply we need to creat an environment so that as broad a base as possible of say, kids at u7s think that they could make a career within the game. Too many times we have lost erreplaceable quality & experienced people not only to other sports but to other walks of life. So many Amateur Coaches & Players etc do not even consider trying to make a living within the game, simply because better opportunities lie elsewhere.

One of the most alarming things evident last night imo was the physical difference between the teams. Pretty much every Aussie appeared bigger & stronger than his opponent. I lost count of the number of times Thaiday, Gallen, Yow Yeh etc were able to dominate the initial contact & left one of our guys on the floor.
Tony Williams was fairly quiet last night, but his swatting of Chris Heighington at Wembley was Mal Meninga / Les Dyl all over again. Only injury prevented Jamal Idris & Dave Taylor from playing the 4N. You can probably add Ryan James in a season or two. These guys are monsters compared to anything in SL. Why haven't we got players like this?

Genetics. Islanders are naturally big they wudnt even need to hit the gym to be big and athletic!

Time to send scouts to Ramsey, Douglas and Peel?

Give some couples of Polynesian passports with the agreement they have many kids lol

It's all about player supply - ie numbers playing the game. We should give all RL clubs targets for the number of junior teams playing in meaningful clubs / leagues in their areas. Going into primary schools for a day is no good. Development needs to translate into regular participation. You need to see kids playing rugby with their mates in the park / in the streets. I know I live in the South these days but when I go home I rarely see kids playing rugby in an informal environment. That's something that has changed enormously over the years. We all used to do that every day.

who said SL is a "bore fest! strewth having watched NRL on tv and live I know which comp i want to watch and lets put it this way it is northern hemis!
if we have to go to Southern hemis style of play to beat the aussies in internationals then sod it i am happy to keep losing to them
The NRL is pretty dull to watch, the atmos at NRL games i have been to is graveyard!!
The 2 ref thing is pants

SL is a damn fine product

Big differnce with why the games are different, whats the pay scales north and south???

That's sort of my point. The league has promoted more and more of the Australia wrestling at the play the ball in an attempt to catch the Aussies. Ten years ago the game was far more exciting to watch

We need to have a more intense competition, less games. I would reduce SL to 11 clubs so clubs only play 20 games instead of 27. I would also like to see overseas quota reduced 2nd rate aussies ruining our game stopping young players develop. And put overseas coaches on quota!

so reduce SL to 11 clubs, does that not then mean there is a smaller pool of players to choose from who are playing at that level?

It means fewer average players.

so how many teams in the NRL???? seems a strange concept to me, reduce the number of teams playing at a higher level gives you better quality teams, so how far down do you think we should go?
surely by this logic we should have say a 6 team comp

Difference between the 2 comps is purely Money!"!! and the ability to develop players from the grass roots and keep them in the game

Sixteen but that will increase in the next couple of years in my opinion. You can't compare rugby league in Europe and Australia. Here we're a minority sport shunned by the media and ripped-off by Sky every four or five years. Rugby league is a huge sport in Australia, if not the biggest. The players are on the back and front pages and have the same profile as soccer players in Europe.
Australia can afford to have sixteen teams in its premier competition because it has a massive talent pool to choose from. Unfortunately we don't have that and while progress is being made nation-wide, it's going to be a good few years before we have anything like the number of quality players to support fourteen or sixteen competitive top division sides.

Dont matter how many teams at the top table 6 or 16 if you dont do the basics how many times have we seen a player make a break then look for the man backing up and no support.

les goose!! good answer

That's something that is going to take years to sort out. In the meantime drop the number of clubs then our internationals wouldn't be making breaks and having to depend on players like Karl Pryce, Mark Calderwood, Ben Fisher or Josh Veivers for support.