Give the championships their niche as something closer to college gridiron than a second division ala football.

Take away youth development from SL clubs completely, why are we aligning players with clubs at 15, shuffling them out again at 18/19 and bringing them in again at 20/21. Doesn’t seem to make much sense to me.

My preference, which I stated before The RFL takes control of all youth development up to the age of 17(end of season when they turn 17),

At 18 players join a championship or championship 1 club, who run a 1st team and a reserve team.

At the end of the season in which they turn 19, they can declare themselves eligible for an SL draft.

Players then join SL clubs, but stay affiliated to their championship/championship 1 club.

Take Zak Hardaker as an example, he goes through the RFL youth development, signs for Featherstone, Fev bring him through

He goes to Leeds at 19, When he plays for England he is listed as Zak Hardaker Leeds Rhinos/Featherstone Rovers. Fev are given a bonus for him becoming an international.

Should Hardaker be dual registered, he can only be dual registered to Fev.

I think that this would work out for everyone. The RFL can take a more rounded approach at the youngest levels, where basic skills are more important than victories. They can spread around the very best coaches to work with the kids that would be far too expensive for one club to afford. I.e pay £60k to Darren Lockyer and get him working with all the best half backs and fullbacks in the country between the ages of 13 and 17 for 6 months.

Lower league clubs have a clear and defined place within the RL structure, they have a competition to win and a better level of player playing for them. They would also act as a feeder league for SL but be completely independent of SL clubs. They can take DR players but those will be DR players with a personal link to that club and a history and affiliation completely separate to the SL club. It would also make it easier for the game to achieve its ‘strategic aims’ with regards to club location. It would mean an expansion club would simply need to concentrate on making itself a viable business, marketing itself, building links with the local community etc, and they are guaranteed a steady stream of good quality, credible players from the outset. I also think it would build great interest in the game at lower league level. People would talk about it, they would look it at, they would watch it. Can you imagine how much publicity someone like Tomkins would have built in the lower leagues. I can perfectly imagine a player like Stevie Ward being an attraction to fans of SL clubs this year having had a year in the championships already, probably playing most games, and standing out this year. SL fans would want to go to hunslet to watch him, or their local team when hunslet played them. To see who their team maybe getting next year. It removes this competition we seem to have between some clubs who are on massively different levels.

For SL clubs, they get a steady stream of distributed talent and they don’t really need to do much for it.

The elite competition reflects the number of teams a country can sustain. The standard of the games would be better, more intense and more productive in producing international players which allows the RFL to market the game based on international competition which as the RFU show is the most financially productive revenue stream and one currently non existent to RL. Odd that the RFL are desparate to market the game using the World Cup, cannot figure out why

Less games for the elite, more rep/international fixtures ? and/or better results internationally? More academy teams / set up based on development rather than the financial capabilities of club who are not capable of being elite.

8 + 12/14 = more teams than the current SL competition and allows the 12 / 14 clubs to develop without overstretching themselves financially. Some clubs currently in the championship would benefit greatly.

If necessary, bring back a mid season cup competition, air on the BBC / ITV, bring back relegation / promotion. A more gradual extended climb to the elite eliminates (hopefully) too artificial promotion of development areas only for the clubs to go belly up.

What would you do Bear?

Yes 8 + 12/14 does = more than 14.

However 8 doesn’t. Your re-named championship doesn’t really achieve much.

You are still ignoring that less games = less income.

More time for marketing, building, fewer to attend means less expense or more if the clubs increase prices because the games are a better standard, scarcer in number. Greater investment from sponsors / media etc. Works for the RFU and Britain responds to international events more readily than anything else which is importantly in a sport trying to become nationwide.

The 12 / 14 tier = less teams going bust, present clubs in the championship getting a real boost to their finances, a gradual, progress to elite level for new RL areas rather than pushing them too high, too fast.

Junior development, the RFL would have to get all the clubs to trust them with far more funding whereas the clubs are reluctant to do so and only prepared to invest in youth if they can see a return for themselves. Self interest prevails. Why should it not? Can they trust the RFL? youth development is expensive and funding say via Sport England requires internetional success. Who do Warrington get Cheshire? Widnes get Liverpool?

Im fairly sure its not because we don’t have enough time the marketing isn’t what it should be.

Im struggling to see in what way, what you have proposed is anything like the 12, and then 12 in RU

Why does 8 + 12/14 equal fewer clubs going bust? Why do you assume those clubs will deal better at a lower level. By and large their fixed costs and overheads, their stadium rental/upkeep costs wont go down, their advertising/marketing costs wont go down, yes their wage costs will go down but will that cover the drop in attendance, tv deal, sponsorship, corporates, congruent with a drop from the top to second tier?

Interesting stuff. Not sure I can see it happening, and I've never really liked the odea of a draft but I don't think your proposal is a bad one.

Yes they do , as feeder clubs to others

Look , you can twist it , turn it , bend it any way you want , they would still be feeder clubs , and nobody will be willing to pay to watch them

Bear tonight showed why SL should be reduced in size. Wigan v Wire was a proper match. Sadly it is a rarity and we get too many none events.

If you cannot comprehend what elite sport is then so be it. Wigan v Wire markets this sport far better than a dozen walk over games ever will. We cannot produce that standard week in week out with the current number of teams. Why do we have the same number of clubs in our elite league as a cash / player rich NRL?

A second tier of lesser SL clubs would mean that such clubs are better protected against their own excesses. Hull KR, Salford, Widnes all went down from SL but did they suffer? Maybe they benefitted. Why should Leigh, Featherstone etc not play clubs of a similar standing, crowd followings week in week out. Are you telling me the Leighs and Featherstones would not benefit.

Far better than your cuckoo youth development scheme bear

Not even worth debating with someone who can't even tell the difference between 16 and 14.

You have no argument to debate

Who said anything about an argument?
You can debate a point or view just as much.

Away you go then

Like I clearly said, no point debating the point/view of how many SL clubs we should have with someone who can't even count how many we currently have

Come along we wait with baited breath

Because you cant / dont have a viable opposite point of view , an old tactic long forgotten and abandoned by most

His point is still a valid one

I quite easily could. Debated with this poster on the 'Sinfield Golden Boot' thread and made him look silly enough times to last a year. He showed there that he has a pre-formed and closed mind opinion of the SL.

*I do like your tactic of accusing me of the thing that you are actually doing.........that's so cute

Well f***ing well DO IT you MORON

We are waiting

Alas you have memory issues. I have yet to see you produce a coherent argument in any thread. I think my views on SL are quite accurate but hey why bother. I watched a terrific match tonight, it was not highly skilled (Tony Smith's words!) but I will not be entertained like that for several games. The players will not be stretched or have to perform high skill levels under pressure so we get beaten v Australia as we have for 50 years BUT hey no doubt you prefer mediocrity as long as the right team wins, beggar the sport.

In what way have these teams benefitted? Let's remember that these are the sort of clubs that would be demoted in this SL2 type idea you're hinting at.

Fylde Warrior's Dictionary
*Benefitting - Have a few years in SL before being dropped back to original level because they couldn't challenge the big boys.

If only we could get our players taking as many drugs as they do















Awwww, now now sunshine, stressful week at work was it? Marital issues? Kids giving you potty?



You are waiting? Sorry, don't jump to your commands. I could debate further but seen as it's wound you up so nicely me not doing it I think i'll hold fire some more



P.S. I await and expect laughable weak-ar$ed response along the lines of "you won't because you can't."

lower tier clubs have, and always will be feeder clubs. Its the same in every sport. Always has been, and always will be.

Let me see stabilising financially (access to KR accounts will show losses went silly in SL not in the Championship, developing players, fans enjoying victories and success.