The following is what Prof Tony Collins, RFL archivist and critically acclaimed author sent me in reply to my question.

Hi Mick

Of all the clubs currently playing rugby league, Bradford were the first to be founded in 1863 (actually one interesting point is that they were formed well before the RFU was founded in 1871).

I know some people argue that they went bust in 1964 or that the majority of the original club went over to soccer in 1907 and became Bradford Park Avenue, but there was/is a living continuity in terms of club administrators, players and supporters. Huddersfield were founded the following year and Hull FC in 1865.

It’s important that we celebrate the history of our clubs - when the 2013 World Cup takes place it will mark 150 years of rugby league history. These clubs are older than the vast majority of clubs playing any football code around the world. It’s a great opportunity for the game as a whole.

I would like to think that in 2013 the Bradford Bulls take Prof Tony Collins advice and really push the fact that our club will be 150 years old.

I'll be having a word with Mr Bennet and Duffy during the season about this rare and fantastic opportunity.

Rugby League "the greatest game"

I think Prof. Collins needs to remember that the club actually celebrated it's centenary in 2007, promoting it widely by both a centenary shirt (which I and many others bought) and a club crest that lasted the year.

Don't get me wrong, i'd love it if we were the oldest existing professional rugby league club but if the club itself has previously declared that it was formed in 1907 then i doubt anything will happen.

I dont reckon any thing will happen either. I asked for Trevor Foster to lead the team out or have a guard of honour to mark the 40th anniversary of the re-formation in 2004, that fell on deaf ears.

And I asked Duffy for a star above the club crest to mark the wcc victory back in 2002.

Got the usual "ill pass it on...:

I like the idea of the stars!!!

While I'll agree that in the past people at the club didn't listen to us supporters, from the feedback that I've had from Stuart and Andrew, they seem to be listening to us now so I'll put something to them along the lines of a classic Northern top with the date 1863-2013 on or maybe even try and arrange a warm up vs Australia (we never did get that game at Valley Parade against them in 2001).

leeds are already doing it (blatantly copied from england football team) with stars for each of their Grand final wins.

Such a shame it'll stop at four

Never understood the desire to
ignore the 1863 date in favour of 1907 (why not 1964 then a TC points out?). Also saddened by the failure to grasp the marketing opportunities offered by the celebration of milestones. The Aussies go big on it and while I realise that merchandise is something the club are loathe to take a punt on after the centenary shirts failed to shift very quick, it would be nice to see the history of the club recognised more in - for example Penrith Panthers turned an ordinary game into a big occasion by celebrating their 10,000th game since format. Would be nice to see the 150 celebrated in some style.

Using the same ‘Duckworth Lewis’ method, Bradford City will be celebrating their Sesquicentennial in 2030. Manningham, the very first champions of the Northern Union-1895/96, was formed in 1880.

you sure as I cant see them on my shirt nor on the pictures on the website

And some of us complained about completely made up centenaries at the time, especially ones that are more celebrations of the club breaking in two rather than forming.

I'll go with Professor Collins interpretation, but I was happy for any excuse to buy a proper Northern jersey in 2007!

I go along with professor Collins too, but the 2007 shirts (and other merchandise sold at the time) make it a bit difficult to now say the club was actually founded in 1863, at least without appearing to be money grubbing and only looking to another marketing opportunity.

Much as I (and others) may disagree I think, for the sake of credibility, the club has to stick with 1907, even though, as the rugby actually carried on throughout, the only thing which was founded on that date was the Park Avenue soccer club, and which IIRC is the date they recognise (or, at least, the date recognised by the 'old' Park Avenue club.

Completely agree but the club have stuck their neck out and decided for some reason to stick with 1907. If they make an about turn and change their minds it will make to club look rather silly!!!

I'm sure that if it presented a marketing opportunity and a chance to increase revenue the club would be able to put a spin on it.

Well, in terms of rugby heritage, it counts, even if they don't want to use it as a 'club' event. '150 years of rugby in Bradford' , not sure how they wore the old RA&B back in those days, but It sounds OK to me.

[size=50So long as they get them in the right order..........[/size

I agree with Bulliac, anything that presents a marketing opportunity should be exploited and '150 years of Rugby in Bradford' sounds like an opportunity to me

A replica of the exact shirt worn back in 1863 would be a great move, perhaps used as a 'third kit' for the season or worn for the match nearest the exact anniversary of the first ever match. In fact, if the club asked far enough in advance, we could probably get a match on the exact date. Who were the opposition? Maybe we could even play the same team (assuming its not Broughton Rangers or Heckmondwike or some other long defunct outfit)

It would also be good to be planning a really comprehensive and wonderfully illustrated club history, by which I mean one that has more than two pages on the first 50 years of the club

And we'll probably be playing at Valley Parade by then, the way things are going, so we could exploit the whole Manningham connection. In fact why not just go the whole hog and present the move to VP as a positive attempt to 'get back to our roots'

I'll put my tin hat on now

Yeah you're probably right Mat. I never liked history at school

According to [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oldest_football_clubsthis[/url, the Bradford club is the 37th oldest football club of any kind anywhere in the world. Not counted but at a glance there are only two or three in the entire football league that are older.

A bit more honorific than centenaries invented by a well meaning marketing dept, even if we did get a nice jersey out of it.

If they are the oldest regby league club then who did they play in the first season?


They must have walked the league that year....

What is it with this 1907 centenary invention stuff. I would say that it's more credible than the 1863 one. The original Bradford club switched to Association Football and a new club was formed, hence the 1907 claim seems quite right.

As I said previously, i'd love us to be the oldest club but given what I have read we're not.

In 1907 [ipart[/i of the 'old' club moved to soccer and another [ipart[/i about one third of the original members stayed with rugby. Nothing actually ended, so they didn't start another rugby club, it was a split: they kept the rugby kit, their membership of the Northern Union and the historic timeline was continuous, many of the old committee were still running the club and the rugby fans remained. They moved to a new ground and decided to change the name to Northern, but the only new entity to be born on that fateful day in 1907 was the Park Avenue soccer club.

I would suggest that 1963/4, when the company running the club folded and fixtures were left unfulfilled, was more of an ending and new beginning than 1907. Not that companies folding, grounds changing or other physical and financial events can ever end the continuity that is the 'club'.

For what it's worth I don't know which is the oldest club and there is no true reason to believe it was Bradford. You have to remember that clubs in the early 19th century didn't necessarily major on paperwork. Virtually all would have been loosely organised clubs of friends or people with similar interests and wouldn't have left a great paper trail behind them. The 1863 date for instance, isn't an actual date of formation, it's merely the date of the earliest evidence that people were playing a handling version what would have then been called football. The actual foundation of the club may well have been before that, and in fact probably was.

That's correct, there is no connection between the old Bradford FC (original name of Northern/Bulls) and Manningham (later BCFC). I don't know why this keeps coming up.

I don't think anybody treats your history as anything before that 1907 split and you did reform as a 'new club' in 1964.
I think Hull FC were formed in 1863 weren't they?
I think your claim is a bit optimistic imo
At least Halifax RLFC (Bluesox silly SL name foced on us apart) have been Halifax RLFC since 1873, yer the Ltd Co have reformed a few times as have most most clubs in hard financial times but we have kept the same club technically going all this time. You have been Bradford RLFc, then Bradford Northern RLFC (reformed in 1964 with help from Halifax by the way) and now Bradford Bulls.