Quote ="mat"strange career ending injury given he's been playing most of this year for Leigh. '" Pl read weblink below. Is it wrong ??? We know that wikipedia can sometime be as reliable as Mick the Gled (and maybe even nestegg/belcki) .... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Laithwaite One of our team has liaised with Centurions, and yes Mat you are right, and we are wrong. It is true that in 2018 James was told that he was medically unfit to ever play again, but as you say he's made a miraculous recovery. Good on him. Hopefully, the Bulls did pay their share of his settlement sum. So for about the 8th time we have got something wrong, but we are always willing to put our hands up and apologise. We do, however, get something's right (e.g Belcki knew and forecast - possibly along with others -that we were likely to be leaving Odsal this past season). In any event this shouldn't be about who is, or are, the biggest fans. You guys should win hands down. For example, if 'we' and the remainder of this Bulls sub-forum were collectively to appear and compete on Mastermind and each choose the Bulls as our specialist subject, then you guys would win. Yes, we are fans; but not obsessive fans; apart from one of us, who managed to overlook the fact that Lilley came from the Rhinos in 2018 etc. We reiterate for the 3rd time today that he has been suitably chastised, embarrassed ... and Anyhow, despite many of you thinking we are jokers; we are not - we are principally and collectively looking at the bigger picture. But time will tell in that regard. Mind you we do also enjoy the tongue in cheek nature of some of the merry banter on the site. In times like these you have to maintain a sense of humour. We can at least agree on that. Latest betting odds: a) Likelihood of new consortium taking over a formal shareholder interest in the club - 50/50, and b) Likelihood that the club will be in administration before Xmas - 50/50. Clear as mud isn't it.

Quote ="mat"strange career ending injury given he's been playing most of this year for Leigh. '" Pl read weblink below. Is it wrong ??? We know that wikipedia can sometime be as reliable as Mick the Gled (and maybe even nestegg/belcki) .... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Laithwaite One of our team has liaised with Centurions, and yes Mat you are right, and we are wrong. It is true that in 2018 James was told that he was medically unfit to ever play again, but as you say he's made a miraculous recovery. Good on him. Hopefully, the Bulls did pay their share of his settlement sum. So for about the 8th time we have got something wrong, but we are always willing to put our hands up and apologise. We do, however, get something's right (e.g Belcki knew and forecast - possibly along with others -that we were likely to be leaving Odsal this past season). In any event this shouldn't be about who is, or are, the biggest fans. You guys should win hands down. For example, if 'we' and the remainder of this Bulls sub-forum were collectively to appear and compete on Mastermind and each choose the Bulls as our specialist subject, then you guys would win. Yes, we are fans; but not obsessive fans; apart from one of us, who managed to overlook the fact that Lilley came from the Rhinos in 2018 etc. We reiterate for the 3rd time today that he has been suitably chastised, embarrassed ... and Anyhow, despite many of you thinking we are jokers; we are not - we are principally and collectively looking at the bigger picture. But time will tell in that regard. Mind you we do also enjoy the tongue in cheek nature of some of the merry banter on the site. In times like these you have to maintain a sense of humour. We can at least agree on that. Latest betting odds: a) Likelihood of new consortium taking over a formal shareholder interest in the club - 50/50, and b) Likelihood that the club will be in administration before Xmas - 50/50. Clear as mud isn't it.

It feels like my teeth are sticking together a little, now. Stupid glacier mints.

Quote ="nestegg"Pl read weblink below. Is it wrong ??? We know that wikipedia can sometime be as reliable as Mick the Gled (and maybe even nestegg/belcki) .... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Laithwaite One of our team has liaised with Centurions, and yes Mat you are right, and we are wrong. It is true that in 2018 James was told that he was medically unfit to ever play again, but as you say he's made a miraculous recovery. Good on him. Hopefully, the Bulls did pay their share of his settlement sum. So for about the 8th time we have got something wrong, but we are always willing to put our hands up and apologise. We do, however, get something's right (e.g Belcki knew and forecast - possibly along with others -that we were likely to be leaving Odsal this past season). In any event this shouldn't be about who is, or are, the biggest fans. You guys should win hands down. For example, if 'we' and the remainder of this Bulls sub-forum were collectively to appear and compete on Mastermind and each choose the Bulls as our specialist subject, then you guys would win. Yes, we are fans; but not obsessive fans; apart from one of us, who managed to overlook the fact that Lilley came from the Rhinos in 2018 etc. We reiterate for the 3rd time today that he has been suitably chastised, embarrassed ... and Anyhow, despite many of you thinking we are jokers; we are not - we are principally and collectively looking at the bigger picture. But time will tell in that regard. Mind you we do also enjoy the tongue in cheek nature of some of the merry banter on the site. In times like these you have to maintain a sense of humour. We can at least agree on that. Latest betting odds: a) Likelihood of new consortium taking over a formal shareholder interest in the club - 50/50, and b) Likelihood that the club will be in administration before Xmas - 50/50. Clear as mud isn't it.'" Its always funny to see a troll/wind up merchant trying to cover up his mistakes/lies. Using Wikipedia as a source makes it even better.

Quote ="nestegg"Pl read weblink below. Is it wrong ??? We know that wikipedia can sometime be as reliable as Mick the Gled (and maybe even nestegg/belcki) .... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Laithwaite One of our team has liaised with Centurions, and yes Mat you are right, and we are wrong. It is true that in 2018 James was told that he was medically unfit to ever play again, but as you say he's made a miraculous recovery. Good on him. Hopefully, the Bulls did pay their share of his settlement sum. So for about the 8th time we have got something wrong, but we are always willing to put our hands up and apologise. We do, however, get something's right (e.g Belcki knew and forecast - possibly along with others -that we were likely to be leaving Odsal this past season). In any event this shouldn't be about who is, or are, the biggest fans. You guys should win hands down. For example, if 'we' and the remainder of this Bulls sub-forum were collectively to appear and compete on Mastermind and each choose the Bulls as our specialist subject, then you guys would win. Yes, we are fans; but not obsessive fans; apart from one of us, who managed to overlook the fact that Lilley came from the Rhinos in 2018 etc. We reiterate for the 3rd time today that he has been suitably chastised, embarrassed ... and Anyhow, despite many of you thinking we are jokers; we are not - we are principally and collectively looking at the bigger picture. But time will tell in that regard. Mind you we do also enjoy the tongue in cheek nature of some of the merry banter on the site. In times like these you have to maintain a sense of humour. We can at least agree on that. Latest betting odds: a) Likelihood of new consortium taking over a formal shareholder interest in the club - 50/50, and b) Likelihood that the club will be in administration before Xmas - 50/50. Clear as mud isn't it.'" Its always funny to see a troll/wind up merchant trying to cover up his mistakes/lies. Using Wikipedia as a source makes it even better.

Mick saying on Twitter that proposed takeover won't be ratified today or even imminently as [i'the size of the creditor's list is causing huge concerns'[/i

Take for what you will, but it does back up what is filtering out on here and in other places.

Not looking good

Does that not remind you of when Caisley and gang swept in to get rid of Hood. Then looked at all the hidden debt and thought "bugger that!". I'm thinking Admin 4 and if I'm pleasantly surprised and we stay afloat that'll be great.

If Mick is 100% right, and sometimes that can be a big 'if' then that's consistent with what we've heard.

So, the latest and now expanded betting odds have been revised:

a) Likelihood of new consortium taking over a formal shareholder interest in the club - 40/60, and
b) Likelihood that the club will be in administration before Xmas - 60/40.
c) Likelihood that a nestegg consortium may ultimately take an interest - ??

Does anyone really have the desire to continue past admin 4 if it happens?

I’ve never given up, had a season ticket every year and will be getting one next year despite the ground change.

But admin 4 I fear will drop our crowds to below 1000, if we even survive.

... and although this thread shouldn't be about a petty points scoring system, here's a couple of other big picture things that one of our consortium and alleged forum trolls (Madam Belcki) got right:

1) Chalmers' credibilty (the pension scandal speaks for itself), and
2) Not all of the players were covered by a fit for purpose medical insurance provision as they should be according to the RFL's - sadly often ignored - rules.

At this time we wouldn't buy a season ticket, even if it were paid for by a credit card, and gift wrapped in Ralph and Nigel's annual travel expense accounts.

Take over not happening today according to Mick!! Admin again at a guess

I suppose if you throw enough e at the wall, some will stick.

No, I'm fairly certain that'll be me out. I've certainly no desire to waste my time and money watching a struggling team fighting yet another points deduction.
I've had enough of it. Sadly I think administration looks the most likely outcome.

A little clue, see if you can work it out for yourself: entering a CVA is classed an 'insolvency event'.

PEST-NEG

I would go and talk to the creditors and explain to them that they can either wait a bit and get their money or spit their dummy out now and get nothing. Which is sort of an informal CVA but in our case without the 12 point deduction. And is remarkably similar to what CB appears to be doing, although for your own (probably histrionic) purposes you describe this process as bullying. I agree with STUL, your business naivety is funny, to the point of being pitiable. If you are short of cash then there are plenty of awkward decisions to make such as do we pay over the paye or do we fold the whole business, put however many people out of a job, screw all the creditors, and totally wreck what has been achieved? What would you do in that circumstance, Egg-on-face? You cannot not make a decision in such circumstances, and buying a bit of time to get the new owners in is a far better option then folding the business.

If you think about it the last five years or so has in effect been one long CVA, with OK paying off Hoods creditors Green paying off OKs and Chalmers paying of Greens. From the sound of it (but still no consolation to those owed right now) the new syndicate won't have the same burden of debts to pay off, for example ROGER all net wages have been paid haven't they so no hang over on that aspect of wages for the new owners.

My preferred option was starting again from scratch, no Bulls name, especially no Odsal, start in C1 or pennines league division fifty, but that would be less of a burden than the conditions the RFL impose for having a team with the Bulls name. History shows us what can be done:

[iWhen AFC Wimbledon was formed, it affiliated to both the London and Surrey Football Associations, and entered the Premier Division of the Combined Counties League, the ninth tier of English football. The club has since been promoted six times in 13 seasons, going from the ninth tier (Combined Counties Premier) to the third (League One).[/i

They succeed because they have the fans.

I agree, this might be me done if it goes the usual bulls way (ie cr@p). If its true about the pensions, and the lack of medical care for the players that's not an organisation I want to be associated with. And the problem now is these are not one off things, we've (the supporters) dealt with so many lies and terrible organisational behaviour from the Bulls and the rfl over so many years that I have to draw a line somewhere, and this might well be it.

Dodgy owner put in by inept governing body (remember they hand picked chalmers as a fit and proper owner)due to massive conflict of interest due to historic dodgy deals between club and rfl (and all covered in lies) now were not paying pension or medical cover, whilst taking the club out of the city so I don't even have the habit of going to odsal, this leads to probable admin and points deduction (any criminal proceedings on offer - probably shoud be somewhere along the line??) and seeing another generation of kids playing for other better run teams....
could well be me done, can't keep going round on this death spiral, lifes too short for something so important to me to be so consistently damaging. I hope Im wrong and events take a positive turn with some new owners, but I'm not holding my breath....and if its going to die, please just let it die quickly, don't be dragging it out.

Can anyone actually quote the Rfl rule re club/player medical indemnity? Because it seems to me that a lot of our players over the past 3 yrs have had private operations within a week or so of injury - have we been running a pay as you go scheme?

It was interesting listening to the bi-play between Mick and Craig on the full 80 about the situation at the Bulls. They seem to know what the true situation is, not only this time but on previous admins. They also kept saying that Bulls fans should know the situation. That being the case I would like someone who is genuinely in the know to spill the beans. It seems clear that this is Admin 4 and no-one has the stomach to carry on so there is nothing to lose.

To be honest mate, the Bulls haven't been that important for to me for a few years. Though I probably went to more games this season than any in the last 3 years, they've played some good stuff this year and I hoped they were slowly building something. But it's very disappointing to see good young players continually making the grade at other clubs after we've either sold or lost them due to money problems. I've not watched much SL on tv for a good few years either so I guess it's not such a big step for me to give up on the sport of RL.

It was certainly becoming an expensive hobby with a family at Odsal anyway, can easily have a much cheaper day out that the kids would probably enjoy more anyway.

I agree, I thought after coming back up from L1 and a decent season in the Championship that we'd turned a corner. We seemed to have a chairman who knew what he was doing and was working towards the best interests of the club.

Turns out he's another chancer who's strung us along and left us in the

Tbh if what they claim to know is true there would be no risk in saying so would they, or am I missing something??

Having an opinion and what the facts actually are can be 2 different animals completely..
Mick has a bit of reputation to be fair but Craig to listen to comes across as Mr straight...

Pretty much my feelings exactly

The bit in bold is that part that I'd really, REALLY like to have thoroughly investigated and exposed for what really happened. It's been stated in print that Chalmers was not only 'appointed' but also 'approached' by the RFL to take over the club.

IF it turns out that there has been dodgy stuff going on all along (3 years of pension contributions suggests so) then the RFL surely HAVE to be held to account.

I won't hold my breath though....

These situations always bring out the liars. You would think we have enough experience by now to take everyone who claims to have insider knowledge with a whole salt shaker, never mind a pinch. And yet still the stirring and attention seeking gets people talking.
There's only one person who claims any insider knowledge on here that I ever believe and that's Roger, largely because he has backed everything up in the past and only passes on information he knows to be accurate and he is able to share. Anyone else claiming knowledge, remember your salt folks and try not to get wound up. If you want to put energies into this, I'd suggest just hoping something gets sorted that those who want a club still have it, and those who have been shafted with pensions or unpaid bills get their money.

I'm not so sure where I fall on this. Whilst I agree that on the face of it a massive blunder has been made by the RFL in picking this particular chairman, I'm not sure how much blame falls at their feet for what's happened. How much can you really know about a person before they perform the act? Sure there were some warning signs there, but presumably there were also some indications that they may do something right, otherwise why would they possibly have gone down that route in the first place.

It kind of reminds me of a situation a few years back when an ex work colleague of mine died. Whilst looking up funeral proceedings on the internet, we discovered that actually he had a past before we worked with him that made him very much not a nice man. Without going into detail of what he did, it was bad enough that he only escaped jail time because he appeared to be terminal at the time (he ended up at least temporarily beating that diagnosis). I worked with him for years never knowing about the past and before it was discovered, I would have swore blind he was a lovely chap. Since presumably his past wasn't known about when he was hired, should the people that hired him be lambasted for doing so, even though they clearly didn't know what he was? I don't think they should.
Different situation I know, but when people are saying the RFL should take the blame, it just reminds me of that event. Which is why I'm not sure where my opinion sits on it.

what worries me in the link between how Chalmers and Lowe ended up at the club is that 3 years is how long they have lasted.
3 years til the odsal break clause, 3 years log enough to hide certain things? long enough for them to advance monies without becoming apparent? long enough to not look overly suspicious. 3 years for the then chief exec who was close friends to plot an exit from his roles and have less ties with the rfl?
it is a shame we cant as bulls fans push a claim against the rfl for their interference in the administrations as their input has clearly not helped. The stipulations and punishments were never going to aid an organisation to thrive not that I am supporting Chalmers but whoever did take over may have challenged this more if it wasnt for the rfl insisting and bringing in their yes man. I am not blaming the rfl as a conspiracy against us as they haven't allegedly mislaid pension payments for 3 years nor do I know of any involvement.

That's exactly why it needs to be thoroughly investigated

If the RFL were shown to be without any fault, then fair play to them. But, as it stands there always seems to be 'smoke and mirrors' when we hit trouble, which gives rise to the speculation. Only by the whole process, going right back to them giving Hood the loan, being independently investigated can those issues be put to bed.

Let them 'clear the air' if they really do have nothing to hide

Couldn't have put it better myself.