And the bold bit is where we are losing ground on the top sides.

Where as Leeds, Wigan, Saints keep their best youngsters (in the main) we have lost some of ours - ala, Fielden, Peacock, Leon, Burgess, Atkins, Bridge.

I know these players all left for varying reasons and stages of development, but this doesn't seem to happen as much with the other sides. I think we may have just realised that homegrown players (especially the top ones) are worth more to us than we previously realised.

Exactly, which is the crux of it. And why we have shifted the emphasis to this in the last couple of years, but we're playing catch up now in a game of junior developement where there are no guarentees as to what you produce.

Are you sure Southernwood counts as homegrown? I thought we signed him from Wakefield...

They are classed as club trained if joined club before they are 21.

If this season's 25 went by squad number order, Crookes and Andy Tate must also have been included, while Finigan, Addy, Crossley and Wardle would not have been. Crookes is contracted for 2011, and after making the first team for the last couple of games seems unlikely to drop out of the 25, but I could see Tate dropping out.

Additionally, we have not yet heard of new contracts for Kopczak, Addy, Crossley and Wardle. I would expect most of them still to be here, but not necessarily all. I would expect to have 11 or 12 homegrown players in the 25, who would be:

Halley, Sykes, Langley, Whitehead, Donaldson, Finigan, Addy, Southernwood, Olbison, Kopczak [uOR[/u Crossley, Crookes (and Wardle, if we have 12). [uIF[/u we were to re-sign a homegrown ex-player, we might have to re-think who is in & who is out.

Agreed - but if Dowes arrives, I would expect it means Sculthorpe is going. Elima is Federation trained whichever way you look at it, because he started out with Cas & Wakefield, and UK & France will be classed as the same federation. We may see at least one other Fed-trained back.

Agreed.

See above about Crookes. Of the rest, only the Burgesses and Tate are publicly announced as contracted.

May be only 11 home grown, but will certainly be comfortably more than 8.

Do the youngsters have to be included in your 25 man squad or is it like the Premiership where you can play under 21's not included in 25?

ainscough wont be in the squad as hull have beaten us to his signature

We signed him from Wakefield but he's from Castleford.

meli would have been a waste of a signing imo...he may be the rohbust woinger that les was but he is not a patch on les
his defensive and positional play is awful and like some one said he has this thinkg about dropping the ball
ainscough is better bacause he is 10 years or so younger and will want a lot less money

Would be happy to see this squad in 2011;
1- Brett Kearney
2- Dave Halley
3- Michael Platt
4- Chev Walker
5- Shaun Ainscough
6- Paul Sykes
7- Matt Orford
8- Nick Scruton
9- Heath L'Estrange
10- Andy Lynch
11- Olivier Elima
12- Elliott Whitehead
13- Jamie Langley
14- Wayne Godwin
15- Glenn Hall
16- James Donaldson
17- Ewan Dowes
18- Craig Kopczac
19- Jason Crookes
20- Danny Addy
22- Rikki Sheriffe
23- Stuart Reardon
24- George Burgess
25- Tom Burgess
26- Cain Southernwood
27- Vinny Finigan
28- Tom Olbison

I don't think Michael Potter sees Paul Sykes as our 1st choice stand off for next year.

No, I don't think anyone does. Not even Sykes.

The fact is, as long as Orford returns to the club we still need another half back. 2010 has shown that you can't go into a season with only 1 recognised half back

The players we are linked with are better than what we have but i wouldn't say they are wetting the appetite as was mentioned at the forum.

A bit of credit due to Sykes. As said he's not a stand off and he knows it as much as everyone else.
When asked by the club to play there has done so to the best of his limited ability without moaning.
If he has learned anything about the position's linking with centres he might understand that better when he reverts to centre.

tbh I wouldnt expect our best signing to be announced first. sensible thing for club to do would be to gradually build up excitement, with increasingly good signings, during pledge period. That said if they've got a signing up their sleeves that as they said ' would whet the appetite' ,and it isnt one of the names already floating around, then they are doing a brilliant job of keeping it quiet.

In Hoods regime there has never been a response to press/agents/rumours/linked-with etc. on buying or selling players so it's hard to second guess him.
Orford, Kearney and Menzies were signed with little press speculation.
I remain confident the the signing of a player "to whet the appetite" will be an outsanding one as Hood so far can not be accused of exageration.
Potter will be aware that we need a high quality stand off, as the signing of one is a prerequisite to his team building.
It is inconceivable that Potter would take on the coach's role without assurance that his team would approach 2011 without such a key player.

I'm not sure about Mat's thinking about releasing the top signings last. The impetus of the pledge will need a boost after 2/3 weeks otherwise it will atrophy. Minor signings wont give it the kick forward we will then need.

Exactly. If we have a major name lined up, I think about a week to 2 weeks from now would be about the ideal time to drop it in. Then about 10 days from the end of the pledge period would be the best time for our next most appealing signing (unless that is a low-key name, in which case it wouldn't make much difference).

I think we'll have a good squad next year. A lot will depend if we have a stand off though.

If we dont get one then I think Kearney or Addy will be our best options.

No way is Addey ready for first team at stand off. Kearney has some merit at that position thogh lacks creativity -world class at full back. He needs to be there.
We nustl sign a stand off, without ehich any other plan for the Bull's future will go down the toilet.
Strong sentimernts, but IMO valid

Of course Addy is ready.

addy is ready
he is a loose forward because of his size but he plays pretty dammmmmm well in the halves considering he doesnt have an experienced pair in the halves atm (sykes)
with orford he will thirve and hopefully form a deadley partnership........................
IF and a big if he is played at 6 next year

i agree but would go further, as I said last off season, without two good halfs we can forget it. I thought we had one good one in orford and a potential good gamble in kearney. As it turns out kearney is better at fB for us and Orford missed half the season so the season went with him.

Same this time, we should have one good half with Orford, we have a potential good half in southernwood, we have cover with Addy/Kearney/Sykes...but we need an actual creative stand off...Recruitment starts and ends there for me again this year.

papers in france have stated that elima has signed for us.................nothing at all in UK papers or from the club yet

Totally agree. Addy has done well for a 19 yr old loose forward and perhaps would be even better a year older with Orford beside him but his defence is suspect (see Clint Newton) and he's not quick enough to be one man further away from the ruck. Southernwood will have a full pre-season to put weight on and get stronger. Donno looks a more ball handling loose forward than Langers but is still very young.

Hence, an injury to Orford would leave us with no recognised half back aged over 20 and if we're serious about challenging the top 4/5/6 then that's a hopeless situation. Elima, Ainscough, Walker are all better than we have but a stand off is essential with a good quality prop.