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| Quote ="OFFTHECUFF"Can't believe Thaler a Wakefield Man was in charge of the game tonight. He let high tackles and holding down away too.If you get relegated blame that idiot.'"
Seriously? I think Bradford fans are well aware of the causes of their plight and Ben Thaler isn't one of them! You lost. Suck it up and move on.
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| Quote ="OFFTHECUFF"Can't believe Thaler a Wakefield Man was in charge of the game tonight. He let high tackles and holding down away too.If you get relegated blame that idiot.'"
I agree mate. I have long thought the RFL have a conspiracy against certain clubs. It's a joke & a disgrace. If you look at the Widnes replacements: Willie Isa, Ben Kavanagh, Lloyd White & Paul Clough, it is an anagram of Wakefield Wildcats. FACT.
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| I think that Annie Gram woman gets far too much blame..
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| What i would love to see is the Bulls cracking on from last week and going on a massive run of form, Wakey continuing with consistent results, and salford winning very few and dropping into the bottom 2 and seeing Koukash wiping his tears up with a wad of £50 notes
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| Quote ="pulsator2k7"What i would love to see is the Bulls cracking on from last week and going on a massive run of form, Wakey continuing with consistent results, and salford winning very few and dropping into the bottom 2 and seeing Koukash wiping his tears up with a wad of £50 notes'"
And the Doctor then saying stuff that I'm going to buy t'Bulls from Marc Green. Course in this scenario it is Dr Seuss.
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| When I thought it was between you and wakey I must admit that I didn't really have any preference either way. No ill will towards either team. Now with Salford in the mix I am hoping you get all the points back and both wakey and Bradford go on a run leaving Salford to go down with London who for me are doomed
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| Yep London n Salford for me
Wouldn't be bothered if Catalan went out either
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| Quote ="Mr Bliss"Yep London n Salford for me
Wouldn't be bothered if Catalan went out either'"
Yeh, to right mate .Weve managed for 120 years without bluddy forriners, well manage another 120 without em again .
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| Ha ha, I love these ironic posts...........
???????
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| So when is our appeal hearing?
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| Quote ="Ferocious Aardvark"So when is our appeal hearing?'"
Same time Huddersfield/Kopout hearing for lying to the RFL
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| No, that one went straight to Carpet Brushing
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| Oh yeah, everyone thinks there is a really, really thick underlay beneath the Rot Hall carpets....but we know what's really under there.....
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| Quote ="Ferocious Aardvark"Quite. So, for example, OK never received any guarantee as to what league the Bulls would play in. Indeed the RFL made a big point of saying they would accept no pre-conditions.'"
OK was purchasing assets from the administrator on the basis of the business that held the assets would have a licence to operate in Super League under the name Bradford Bulls.
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| Quote ="Ferocious Aardvark"But they didn't, and that's just one of the obvious inconsistencies.
I hesitate to add any facts for your information any more, as it seems to annoy people, yet posting incorrect "facts" (not aimed at you btw) weirdly does not seem to have the same effect.
But many on here and the VT will tell you that the club - meaning OKB - were docked 6 points pretty much automatically "for going into administration". They reckon it's the deal. Go into admin, that's like your fixed penalty.
if that is true, then why didn't it happen?
OK Bulls went into administration on 31 January 2014. No sanction was applied to it. Not then, not ever.
It was on February 25th, 5 days after BB2014 had been announced as the winners of the auction, that the 6 point penalty was announced and implemented. And it is certain, however many times the misinformants want to claim this is some sort of fixed penalty, that it is no such thing, but that it was arrived at only after taking into account the proposals and plans of BB2014 i.e. NOT as a quid pro quo "for OKB going into admin":
Of course we now know (and the RFL presumably knew then) that they were not in fact the cub's directors, as they owned nothing, they were directors of BB2014 which had won the bid but was only in a conditional waiting period, and being allowed to run the business effectively as caretakers for the administrator, in case a better bid came along.
These remarks are concrete proof that the 6 points was based on the RFL's dim view of what BB2014 proposed to do about debts/ business plans. NOTHING mentioned about OKB.
It is hardly semantics to point out that it MUST follow, like night and day, that if the RFL HAD been more impressed, then we would not have been docked the full 6 points. (For Bradford to NOT drop off debt as a result of the administration would NOT have significantly impaired the integrity of the competition, so a lesser or nil points deduction would logically be fair).
Otherwise, the RFL have tied the two things (proposals & plans / points penalty) together for no apparent reason. Which clearly isn't the case.
I see this as a fundamental and massively important fact, for the club and the fans. If I need to spell it out, it MUST mean that (if the process is to be done consistently and fairly) the RFL needed to do exactly the same routine with the new new owners - BBNL - and base a new decision on exactly the same sort of factors, as they announced prematurely would apply to BB2014 (but never did, as they never owned the club).'"
The RFL has been consistent in the timing and level of punishment in both cases of administration at the Bulls. The first time round the penalty was announced in roughly the same timescale, give or take 2/3 days as the second.
First time round there was no prospect of a new owner, the RFL was funding the business and creditors were not going to be paid a penny. Liquidation was the outcome for the holding company.
Second time round, although there was a prospect of new owners, they were not taking over the existing holding company. This was the case with OK. He set up a new holding company, as did Moore et al. No creditors were to be paid a penny. The only difference is the timing of the new holding company seeking to take over.
The new holding company owned by Marc Green has no intention of paying any creditors of OK Bulls, so the 6 point penalty is absolutely correct & consistent.
Both OK & MG have taken control of the assets through new holding companies. No creditors have been paid. The penalty imposed is exactly the same, and done in the same timescale.
MG has no chance of getting any points back. he deliberately placed OK Bulls into administration to protect his debenture, therefore it was not unforeseen or unavoidable.
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| Oh look another "new user" with a couple of posts has come to have a pop, who are you really???
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| Quote ="LeagueDweeb"<snip>'" Good afternoon Blake.
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| Quote ="redeverready"Good afternoon Blake.'"
Haha that's what I was thinking,or Nigel or Ralph
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| Quote ="broadybull87"Oh look another "new user" with a couple of posts has come to have a pop, who are you really???'"
Not having a pop at anyone at all. Certainly not the Bulls owners, players or fans. Just calling it as it actually is.
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| Quote ="LeagueDweeb"OK was purchasing assets from the administrator on the basis of the business that held the assets would have a licence to operate in Super League under the name Bradford Bulls.'"
No. 100% wrong. The licence was absolutely not an asset, was not in the gift of the administrator, was entirely at the discretion of RFL/SLE, and the RFL made it extremely clear that they would not ever agree to any "you will be in SL" precondition.
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| Quote ="LeagueDweeb"Not having a pop at anyone at all. Certainly not the Bulls owners, players or fans. Just calling it as it actually is.'"
"Calling it as it is" my arrrrrse.
Quote The RFL has been consistent in the … level of punishment in both cases of administration at the Bulls. '"
Yes, if you think that the last time being fined one year’s Sky money, and the second time not being fined at all, is consistent.
Quote First time round there was no prospect of a new owner, the RFL was funding the business and creditors were not going to be paid a penny. Liquidation was the outcome for the holding company. '"
Liquidation is the end game for the first time, as it will be for the second time. Of course there was the prospect of a new owner. Had there been no prospect then we wouldn’t have got one.
Quote Second time round, although there was a prospect of new owners, they were not taking over the existing holding company. This was the case with OK. He set up a new holding company, as did Moore et al. '"
You are contradicting yourself. As you now say, neither was taking over the old company. But we all know this. It wasn’t even news when it was news.
Quote No creditors were to be paid a penny. The only difference is the timing of the new holding company seeking to take over. '"
Rubbish. You clearly know nothing, and all the info is in the myriad posts and threads so maybe you could start by reading them before spouting nonsense. Just for instance, the administrator in his initial report to creditors stated that the proposal of BB2014 was that ALL trade creditors would be paid, as opposed to your version.
Quote The new holding company owned by Marc Green has no intention of paying any creditors of OK Bulls, so the 6 point penalty is absolutely correct & consistent. '"
So they have disclosed all that to you, have they? In fact, nothing has been stated in public about the proposals to pay any money to any creditors or not. We therefore don’t know. And you don’t know. I would be surprised if he was paying much but that is pure speculation so stop stating it as if you know because you don’t. And of course the question of “consistency” is a red herring as the totality of any sanctions is all we can compare, not picking out one element. OKB failed largely because of the massive (and unprecedented) sanction of one year’s loss of funding on top of the points deduction so you really cannot equate te two situations.
Quote Green has no chance of getting any points back. '"
If that is your opinion fair enough, we are none of us at all hopeful on here either. But the fact is you have no idea as to the detailed arguments of the appeal nor have we since they have not been made public so again this is pure speculation.
Quote he deliberately placed OK Bulls into administration to protect his debenture, therefore it was not unforeseen or unavoidable. '"
How come you do not seemingly know that he was not the owner, or even a bidder, at that point? Do you not understand that the appeal is being pursued by BBNL, not by Marc Green? Do you not understand that the debenture was held by a different company, not by Marc Green personally?
You seriously need to do some reading before getting involved in any discussions as with respect your uninformed claims add nothing. You're calling it as it isn't.
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| Quote ="LeagueDweeb"
MG has no chance of getting any points back. he deliberately placed OK Bulls into administration to protect his debenture, therefore it was not unforeseen or unavoidable.'"
Okay, quick question....
Do you know the full details of the lodged appeal? I assume you must, as you are pretty certain of the outcome.
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| Quote ="LeagueDweeb"
The new holding company owned by Marc Green has no intention of paying any creditors of OK Bulls, so the 6 point penalty is absolutely correct & consistent.
'" marc green had not even made a bid at the time the 6 points were deducted
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| Quote ="Ferocious Aardvark"icon_lol.gif
"Calling it as it is" my arrrrrse.
Quote That's exactly as it is'"
Yes, if you think that the last time being fined one year’s Sky money, and the second time not being fined at all, is consistent.
Quote It wasn't a fine as there is nothing in the operational rules regarding financial punishment. It was the RFL recouping the huge amount of funds it had to pay the administrator to prevent liquidation'"
Liquidation is the end game for the first time, as it will be for the second time. Of course there was the prospect of a new owner. Had there been no prospect then we wouldn’t have got one.
Quote There was no prospect of a new owner for BB Holdings which is why admin came so quick & as shown, it took many months before one did come forward'"
You are contradicting yourself. As you now say, neither was taking over the old company. But we all know this. It wasn’t even news when it was news.
Quote Where s the contradiction?'"
Rubbish. You clearly know nothing, and all the info is in the myriad posts and threads so maybe you could start by reading them before spouting nonsense. Just for instance, the administrator in his initial report to creditors stated that the proposal of BB2014 was that ALL trade creditors would be paid, as opposed to your version.
Quote BB2014 made no such proposal, in writing or otherwise'"
So they have disclosed all that to you, have they? In fact, nothing has been stated in public about the proposals to pay any money to any creditors or not. We therefore don’t know. And you don’t know. I would be surprised if he was paying much but that is pure speculation so stop stating it as if you know because you don’t. And of course the question of “consistency” is a red herring as the totality of any sanctions is all we can compare, not picking out one element. OKB failed largely because of the massive (and unprecedented) sanction of one year’s loss of funding on top of the points deduction so you really cannot equate the two situations.
Quote OK Bulls is being liquidated with no creditors receiving any payment for monies owed. Check the administrators statement of proposals from late March. Clearly states no creditors will be paid. MG isn't paying any of them. OK Bulls failed because OK didn't know what he was doing & had a general manager in place who displayed an equal level of incompetence. When taking on the Bradford Bulls, OK knew what the central funding would be. He had a proportion of it brought forward a year. His ego was the biggest single contribution, along with not one of the other directors making any financial contribution, either in purchasing shares or directors loans. Was the RFL simply supposed to write off the numerous monthly contributions it made to ensuring the club continued to function?'"
If that is your opinion fair enough, we are none of us at all hopeful on here either. But the fact is you have no idea as to the detailed arguments of the appeal nor have we since they have not been made public so again this is pure speculation.
Quote Force majeure is the basis for the appeal. MG put OK Bulls into administration.'"
How come you do not seemingly know that he was not the owner, or even a bidder, at that point? Do you not understand that the appeal is being pursued by BBNL, not by Marc Green? Do you not understand that the debenture was held by a different company, not by Marc Green personally?
Quote MG is BBNL. MG is paying out of his own pocket, or so he has claimed. MG is SSG. It's his name & signature on the documentation processed by Platinum Partnership'"
You seriously need to do some reading before getting involved in any discussions as with respect your uninformed claims add nothing. You're calling it as it isn't.
Quote No misinformed comments. All based on fact. Hard as that may be for you to swallow'"
'"
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| Quote ="SmokeyTA"marc green had not even made a bid at the time the 6 points were deducted'"
Who said he had? he isn't paying any creditors, which is the shy the 6 points is correct. His appeal isn't based on any being paid.
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