Exactly my thoughts.

I like the sound of that. He'd also miss a lot less tackles in the middle IMO, he like Turner struggles reading the second man plays but his actual contact is pretty decent.

Again, a lot depends on how Lomax's legs pan out. If he's lost his zip then Saints might well look to recuperate their investment at hooker.

Can't see him moving back into the halves. And there's nowhere else in the back division for him to go.

We did warn you. Just a bully, nothing more.

He's a bully going to the playoffs, then.

Just to put things a bit in perspective...........Gary Wheeler crocked again today.

He's been crocked a few times this season. Low pain threshold.

I wonder how many games he would have missed for us had he Travis' staying power?

He's no Blake Green that's for sure.

But he's better than no Blake Green.

No Blake Green is George Williams and George Williams is better than Burns right now.

Can't say that I noticed Williams much in any of the games we've played so far.

Putting club bias aside, George Williams is a very good player and is doing half of Matty Smiths job as well.

Agree! the club can so much better, half backs are supposed to have skills and speed, not be just "scrappers"

And supporters are supposed to do ... what?

Not sure your point? I was clear what I said, that I feel a half back needs ball skills, and speed, not just being a scrapper!

I agree about a club like St Helens needing more than a scrapper at halfback. It's a bit like when we had Hooper...but we were ok then because we had other pivots like Long, Martyn, Sculthorpe etc

I think Burns is more than a scrapper, but for whatever reason it's not quite happening for him in the 'dazzling halfback' department. Maybe he's just past it in a sense I don't know but he never shy's away from graft, and he brings a real nasty streak that we lack elsewhere.

Cooper was a bit of a scrapper as well, if you have a good scrum half with good ball skills and set plays then its not really necessary for the stand off to be the same. Burns has a pretty decent passing game, supports well, gets involved and doesn't go missing. He's doing a lot of running about and over doing it because him and Walshy haven't got there partnership and combinations going, its making him look ineffective.

I think consistency with Burns is an issue. There have been games this season where he has played well and has shown some nice touches. Ultimatly though, when you sign for a club who have aspirations for the Grand Final you need to play at that level consistently.

As others have said earlier, he is trying to adapt his game. He has, from what I've seen, been a running threat throughout his career. We've seen it this year where he has seen a gap but has had his ankles tapped or hasn't been able to push through it. He's trying to reinvent himself and as I and others have said, you can't fault his effort or his desire.

Many halves have to change their game as they lose pace. Long did it brilliantly for us. Burns is trying to do the same but his decision making can be hit and miss.

Another issue for Burns in some ways is the lack of a ball player at 1. A full fit Lomax was able to find the right play and deliver it when it mattered but we haven't really seen that side of Quinlan's game.

Also when longs legs went we brought pryce in to do all the running.

Its a bit like we have can't run won't run in the side.

But for effort he gives it his all. Not seen any of this bullying slander.

We are lacking some legs in the side. Probably our best runner at the moment is swift.

Next year will depend a lot on lomax's recovery. It's not like burns or walsh will get faster

If I was Saints I would do a reassessment on Lee Gaskell for 2017 seems to have matured a bit has got a good running and kicking game. Could be cheap as chips as well.

You mean apart from the title of your post?

Is he a waste of space whose legs have gone who shouldn't be near the team or is he a "scrapper" who the team can't do without.

For what its worth, my opinion is that when Walsh was out, he was pretty good, but we don't need them both in the team for attacking options now Wilkin is back. Perhaps we should play with an extra forward and have Wilko at SO?

I tend to agree with this. When Walsh was out, I thought he was doing a great job of pushing us around the pitch and looked like a very judicious organiser. When Walsh cam back, though, he then looked like he wondered what he was there for.

Quote ="St pete"If possible, Id be tempted to try Burns as a 9 with robes next year if we could bring a 6 in'" Another piece in the MEN about Rangi Chase today. I'm assuming that we won't have the cash or the inclination to go for Chase, but it does also mention that Theo Fages's tribunal is happening next week. If he wins it, he will probably be a free agent. Could Fages be the dynamic running 6 we've been calling for? www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/ ... i-10070734

Quote ="St pete"If possible, Id be tempted to try Burns as a 9 with robes next year if we could bring a 6 in'" Another piece in the MEN about Rangi Chase today. I'm assuming that we won't have the cash or the inclination to go for Chase, but it does also mention that Theo Fages's tribunal is happening next week. If he wins it, he will probably be a free agent. Could Fages be the dynamic running 6 we've been calling for? www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/ ... i-10070734

I'd rather have Fages than Gareth O Brien.

I don't have a lot to base that on, as I've not seen an awful lot of Fages, but GOB has mostly left me fairly underwhelmed over the years.

I would also rather give Fages a go over O'Brien.