It's been a poor season for us so far, the highlight being the magnificent WCC win but far too many lows overall. I was one of the 99.9% that doubted last season and I've got say coming away from Headingley last night the doubt crept into my head again. It's the 3rd consecutive regular season that we've underachieved and far too many times over those seasons I've come away from games scratching my head. I hope I'm in the stands at Old Trafford listening to Sir Kev give another victory speech alluding to the "doubters", but it's looking more and more unlikely. We all know nothing is won in May, but can anyone hand on heart say they don't have grave doubts about where our season is heading?

One man's doubt is another man's realism. Kudos to this bunch of players for all it's achieved, but nothing lasts forever.

Would be idiocy to doubt Leeds. They effectively showed that the play off format means jack shiit if your a decent side. A home game and two away games are hardly a challenge, so there's no real incentive to finish higher in the league. I did'nt think they were the best team in the league last year at all, but they have proven ability to lift their game when they need to which benefits them given the rules as they stand. FWIW, I think they'll beat Wigan in the cup because the likes of Peacock, Bailey etc will go to toe with the pies and they won't like being given to them what they so often give out. You have the decent blend in the side to do well. Only prob is Webb who is a version of Meli these days in giving away silly penalties and errors.

Not really doubt. A bit of head scratching though going on as to McDermott's use of his subs bench and thinking he can win games with just 15/16 players. As many have pointed out the starting forwards actually played ok last night, however they can't do it all they need back-up.

I think its more tweaks rather than the overhaul some think is needed......
- Utilise his bench so they have a real input/impact on games with decent game time.
- Start Lunt with Burrow off the bench.
- Sort out the Hardaker/Hall problem.

I've spent 20+ years doubting Leeds ability to win trophies, and since 2004 they've managed to prove me wrong, winning Super League 5 times, and establishing themselves as Super Leagues most successful club.
I have major doubts we will win the title this year, but believe will win the CC
Wigan & Wire are desperate to match our success, and their fans are bitterly jealous of our successicon_smile.gif

It's how the squad is shaping up which concerns me we've retained another 34 yr old Prop and already have JP who is 35 and 2 more 30+ FR's in Moore and Griffin and whilst JP and Kylie may be doing well now i'm not convinced they are the future for beyond this year.
In the BR we haven't replaced Ali and the 9 and 6 situation seems to be a hinderance thus far.
I started the over-haul thread with a view to the future despite what ER was having a dig about and i'd rather give some more youngsters a go now rather than risk losing them long term.
I think Clarkson should start at 13/SR or not play ,Lunt should start and RB be back at 7 or on the bench and i agree with others who have mentioned the mis-mash of our defencsive structure especially Sinfield out wide.
There are issues and the coach for some reason unknown to us keeps using 16 players whilst using 1 more sparingly when players are out on their feet.

Lets be real here

Last year we 'performed' in the last month or so (few exceptions on the way) but otherwise had a poorish season

Same again this year

Cannot see anything at all to contest there in your observations.

You should also mention the criminal inability to resolve the Hardaker/Hall situation by the fantastically simple method of moving one or both from their present position/s. Why do the Leeds coaching staff (apparently) not see any of this ?????

Wish you were our coach

Because we have enjoyed an unprecedented run of recent success does not mean it will go on forever. Our run has to come to an end at some stage to be followed by a period of regrouping and blooding new talent.

However I for one am not prepared to write off this team just yet. Despite the dissapointing league position we still can climb the table with a run of form. And despite the errors last night we were not that faraway. Silly errors and a few harsh decisions by the officials cost us momentum and possession at important times in the match. Had these factors gone the other way our heads and energy levels would have been up and the result could have gone the other way despite Saints playing very well.

How many times can we use this excuse though ??

It was only a few seasons ago that despite not playing particularly well Leeds still had the ability to snatch victories at the end. Those days have gradually dissipated ..... Leeds is now that opposition that used to offer lots of honest effort and endeavour in the forwards, but was never enough to beat the better team.

What me?...never

In that sense I think we are missing a cutting edge, a senior or Ali type who would grab the game by the scruff of the neck and make an offload or break a tackle to see us through. Burrow could be that player if he came off the bench.

Our forwards ran the show or at least kept with the saints pack barring big Tony(an Ali type) and we just made too many errors/could not score the points to match. And then we got Knackered but thats another story

But that is sport! If it were so predictable it would be boring. Last night we lost and we didn't come up to the mark and we didn't have the rub of the green but we saw some splendid tries from both sides and the game was in the balance for much of the game. Don't despair and don't throw in all the youngsters at once and be dissappointed again because they prove to be not quite ready yet.

It could be worse......you could be a Greek!

Is that SL's most successfull club on or off the field?

Off the field perhaps in terms of profit/loss accounts but on the field (and most tend to support the players rather than the bean-counters - no offence to the accountants out there, I'm sure you're wonderful too) - in terms of trophies won I see it like this

1 - St Helens: 5 Titles, 2 WCC, 7 Challenge Cups, 5 League Leaders

2 - Leeds: 5 Titles, 3 WCC, 1 Challenge Cup, 2 League Leaders

3 - Bradford: 4 Titles, 3 WCC, 2 Challenge Cups, 3 League Leaders

4 - Wigan: 2 Titles, 0 WCC, 2 Challenge Cups, 3 League Leaders

5 - Warrington: 0 Titles, 0 WCC, 2 Challenge Cups, 1 League Leaders

=6 - Hull: 0 Titles, 0 WCC, 1 Challenge Cup, 0 League Leaders
=6 - Sheffield: 0 Titles, 0 WCC, 1 Challenge Cup, 0 League Leaders

If you care to look elsewhere I don't quite advocate this......however I would endorse the concept that the sooner you "throw them in" the sooner they [uwill be[/u "ready".

Not if you throw too many in at once they won't.

You'll just burn them out. London found this last season. Loads of youngsters...great start to the season...Eddie and Stevo creaming over their play-off chances...Rose like rockets - fell like sticks!

If only you got a trophy for runners up in the GF, we'd be miles clear

Again

...if you care to look carefully I do not advocate "throwing them all in at once"...However, by all accounts the likes of Singleton and Hood, if not Ward and Chisholm too, would [ualready[/u be first team SL regulars at some other clubs.

Instead the Leeds club appears more interested and focused on grasping on tightly to the 'old guard' in the forwards at the expense of the younger kids who by now could/should have gained much more valuable SL experience.

If that was the case you'd probably be 6 in a row Semis bottlers rather than 6 time Grand Final bottlers that you are now.