It's the first I've heard that Buderus kicked his first goal for the club on Friday but if true the clearest sign yet he won't be at Headingley in 2012. I have my doubts that he did though.
No report I've read seems to think he kicked the goal so I'm hoping it's just the Opta section of the SL website that's mistaken.
One for the statisticians to mull over? Or not as the case might be.
Carl Ablett (Ryan Hall Try)
Danny McGuire (Ben Jones-Bishop Try)
Danny McGuire (Carl Ablett Try)
Lee Smith (Danny McGuire Try)
Danny McGuire (Ryan Hall Try)
Danny McGuire (Ali Lauitiiti Try)
Kevin Sinfield (Danny Buderus Try)
Ali Lauitiiti (Danny McGuire Try)
Danny Buderus (Ryan Hall Try)
Danny McGuire (Lee Smith Try)
No Assist awarded for the Jamie Peacock Try
(McGuire’s 5 try assists is a Leeds Record (2008 – to date))
It's the first I've heard that Buderus kicked his first goal for the club on Friday but if true the clearest sign yet he won't be at Headingley in 2012. I have my doubts that he did though.
No report I've read seems to think he kicked the goal so I'm hoping it's just the Opta section of the SL website that's mistaken.
One for the statisticians to mull over? Or not as the case might be.
Carl Ablett (Ryan Hall Try)
Danny McGuire (Ben Jones-Bishop Try)
Danny McGuire (Carl Ablett Try)
Lee Smith (Danny McGuire Try)
Danny McGuire (Ryan Hall Try)
Danny McGuire (Ali Lauitiiti Try)
Kevin Sinfield (Danny Buderus Try)
Ali Lauitiiti (Danny McGuire Try)
Danny Buderus (Ryan Hall Try)
Danny McGuire (Lee Smith Try)
No Assist awarded for the Jamie Peacock Try
(McGuire’s 5 try assists is a Leeds Record (2008 – to date))
Like you tvoc I am always a little surprised at Opta's opinion on a "assist".
For me Peacock scored that try on his own. But likewise how McGuire got an assist for BJB's I will never know. It wasn't a particularly good pass floating high that he did well to catch, then the rest was all down to BJB. Not trying to take anything away from Danny like.
Quote="Gotcha"Like you tvoc I am always a little surprised at Opta's opinion on a "assist".
For me Peacock scored that try on his own. But likewise how McGuire got an assist for BJB's I will never know. It wasn't a particularly good pass floating high that he did well to catch, then the rest was all down to BJB. Not trying to take anything away from Danny like.'"
I don't know OPTA's criteria for determining a "try assist" but without McGuire's floated cut out pass BJB would not have got the ball & would not have had the opportunity to cut inside to score.
So is a Try Assist awarded to everyone who passes the ball to the tryscorer, regardless of what the tryscorer subsequently does to score the try?
If this is the case, would it be a Try Assist if the halfback catches the kickoff and passes to the winger who beats every man on the opposition team before putting the ball down on the black dot?
Quote="batleyrhino"So is a Try Assist awarded to everyone who passes the ball to the tryscorer, regardless of what the tryscorer subsequently does to score the try?
If this is the case, would it be a Try Assist if the halfback catches the kickoff and passes to the winger who beats every man on the opposition team before putting the ball down on the black dot?'"
Exactly. For me if someone has a lot to do and especially involving beating a player with footwork, then the pass to him is irrelevant.
In this particular occurance, the pass was not good and was high which needed catching for a start, then BJB didn't just dive over the line, he cut inside with a couple of sidesteps and had to beat players, and crash through the tackle.
Take Peacocks, it was a straight pass to him, but he had to beat men in the collission in order to score it. In that case there was not "assist".
Those stats are pretty much what Kirke does most weeks. This despite been against the worst team I have seen in super league this season. Why the sudden change in opinion?
Just as an example I had a quick look at Castleford at home, as it was an equally easy match to be fair.
Firstly, I've only been keeping these records since the 2008 season so please bear that in mind on any so-called 'Leeds Opta record' I flag up. It's limited to the timeframe 2008 - to date and shouldn't be taken either as a SL Era or absolute as I can't verify that it is beyond the limited timeframe. In addition the SL Website, where I harvest the raw data, only incorporates SL Regular Round fixtures so I've not got any Opta stats for Play-Off, Challenge Cup or WCC fixtures as and when Leeds are involved. They are a complete record of four seasons worth of SL Regular Round statistics (at least they will be after Sunday's match figures are included) but that is all they are so please bear that in mind also.
Secondly on a more general note (and as highlighted by others on here) I'm not a particular fan of the way Assists have been handed out (Gotcha's point) or there being a consistent approach from season to season. In years past they were often quite difficult to earn on a passing play with some jaw dropping denials. I can still recall examples of Senior, Lauitiiti (on more than one occassion) and Jones-Buchanan missing out after an ocean of creative running and handling directly led to a try being scored.
That said IMO there does appear a slightly more lax interpretation being applied to 'Assists' generally this season with only the straight pass from the floor at dummy half seemingly guaranteed to miss out. Even then if the hooker takes a step or two first he's in with a reasonable chance of gaining a credit. Everything else appears to have a chance from the most mundane inaccurate floated pass with players still left still to beat (McGuire for Jones-Bishop) to a perfectly weighted, face ball delivered with speed and precision allowing a walk-in score (Buderus to Hall.)
Quote="G1"TVOC, is McGuire's record shared with Burrow or did he break it outright?'"
To my knowledge (bearing in mind the first point above) Burrow and Sinfield shared the previous record with '4 Assists' in a single outing.
McGuire's effort here (in a 11 try, 10 assist haul) set's the new mark. How it compares to previous efforts is open to debate.
(Edit: Reading the opening post on the Burrow '4 Assist thread' linked to above it appears I was making the same general point re the relaxation on Assist criteria that I've just made again above regards this season. Standards are continuing to slip in SL it appears.)
Firstly, I've only been keeping these records since the 2008 season so please bear that in mind on any so-called 'Leeds Opta record' I flag up. It's limited to the timeframe 2008 - to date and shouldn't be taken either as a SL Era or absolute as I can't verify that it is beyond the limited timeframe. In addition the SL Website, where I harvest the raw data, only incorporates SL Regular Round fixtures so I've not got any Opta stats for Play-Off, Challenge Cup or WCC fixtures as and when Leeds are involved. They are a complete record of four seasons worth of SL Regular Round statistics (at least they will be after Sunday's match figures are included) but that is all they are so please bear that in mind also.
Secondly on a more general note (and as highlighted by others on here) I'm not a particular fan of the way Assists have been handed out (Gotcha's point) or there being a consistent approach from season to season. In years past they were often quite difficult to earn on a passing play with some jaw dropping denials. I can still recall examples of Senior, Lauitiiti (on more than one occassion) and Jones-Buchanan missing out after an ocean of creative running and handling directly led to a try being scored.
That said IMO there does appear a slightly more lax interpretation being applied to 'Assists' generally this season with only the straight pass from the floor at dummy half seemingly guaranteed to miss out. Even then if the hooker takes a step or two first he's in with a reasonable chance of gaining a credit. Everything else appears to have a chance from the most mundane inaccurate floated pass with players still left still to beat (McGuire for Jones-Bishop) to a perfectly weighted, face ball delivered with speed and precision allowing a walk-in score (Buderus to Hall.)
Quote="G1"TVOC, is McGuire's record shared with Burrow or did he break it outright?'"
To my knowledge (bearing in mind the first point above) Burrow and Sinfield shared the previous record with '4 Assists' in a single outing.
McGuire's effort here (in a 11 try, 10 assist haul) set's the new mark. How it compares to previous efforts is open to debate.
(Edit: Reading the opening post on the Burrow '4 Assist thread' linked to above it appears I was making the same general point re the relaxation on Assist criteria that I've just made again above regards this season. Standards are continuing to slip in SL it appears.)
Quote="Gotcha"Exactly. For me if someone has a lot to do and especially involving beating a player with footwork, then the pass to him is irrelevant.
In this particular occurance, the pass was not good and was high which needed catching for a start, then BJB didn't just dive over the line, he cut inside with a couple of sidesteps and had to beat players, and crash through the tackle.
Take Peacocks, it was a straight pass to him, but he had to beat men in the collission in order to score it. In that case there was not "assist".'"
I'm sticking to my guns here. BJB did very well to take the ball over his head & cut back to score but without the pass from McGuire that took out at least 2 defenders & allowed BJB to cut back & wrong foot the defence no try would IMV have been scored.
All that the guy that passed to Peacock did was pass the ball to him without creating any space or wrongfooting the defence.
Two entirely different scenarios.
Contrast that with one of McGuire's other assists - the try for Ablett I believe - again a simple pass but one that was timed & disguised so well that it fooled the defence opening up a gap for the try scorer.
All views expressed are those of the author and not necessarily those of the RLFANS.COM or its subsites.
Whilst every effort is made to ensure that news stories, articles and images are correct, we cannot be held responsible for errors. However, if you feel any material on this website is copyrighted or incorrect in any way please contact us using the link at the top of the page so we can remove it or negotiate copyright permission.
RLFANS.COM, the owners of this website, is not responsible for the content of its sub-sites or posts, please email the author of this sub-site or post if you feel you find an article offensive or of a choice nature that you disagree with.
